Whatever happened to Flightline Systems?

[Airviking 0]

I'm looking at a cheap, nearly unused rig with a Flightline Systems Reflex harness/container.
-It looks like Flightline folded, ehe? Any idea why?
-Did anyone take over their product line?
-Is the Reflex any good? Any issues?

I believe you have my stapler.

[stratostar 5]

The company was sued in to being out of the biz by a wife of someone who went in. The replacement parts can be found in Davis Ca. Some people love them, others hate them, like every other rig on the market.

you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo

[likestojump 3]

man, you ask a lot of questions instead of doing a lot of searching...

they were sued out of business after a fatality
a basic search would have given you a post from the former owner http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3092690

Action Air owns the TSO and provides replacement parts
http://www.tridenthc.com/fuzz.htm

Reflexes are still jumped, and most people like 'em. As usual, you will find naysayers for any brand.

YMMV

[Airviking 0]

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man, you ask a lot of questions instead of doing a lot of searching...

Guilty as charged. But you think I'm bad? I belong to a Suzuki Bandit message board, and all we do is re-hash the same old topics: engine oil, and chain maintenance. If we didn't do that, there would be nothing to post about.

I believe you have my stapler.

[liftedtitan 0]

Quote

man, you ask a lot of questions instead of doing a lot of searching...

they were sued out of business after a fatality
a basic search would have given you a post from the former owner http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3092690

Action Air owns the TSO and provides replacement parts
http://www.tridenthc.com/fuzz.htm

Reflexes are still jumped, and most people like 'em. As usual, you will find naysayers for any brand.

YMMV

Not to be a dick, but did you read the thread you linked to? The owner of the company said they were not sued out of business, they cloased the doors due to a low in the market.

If your going to chastise someone for not searching, the least you can do is get your facts straight.

Moriuntur omnes, sed non omnes vixerunt.

[likestojump 3]

ooops.

open mouth
insert foot

[GLIDEANGLE 1]

Reflex had a dual reserve pilot chute arrangement called the "catapult".  It was controversial.  As I understand it, the idea was that if the pilot chute at the end of the bridle became entangled, the pilot chute near the free bag might deploy the reserve.  

As I understand it at least one person was saved by that feature, and one killed by it.  Apparently, adding the second PC added a new failure mode... One PC on each side of the jumper with the bridle running between them under the jumper... Resulting in neither PC deploying the reserve.  

I seem to remember being told that the manufacturer allowed the second PC to be removed if the owner desired.

All of the above is my recollection of what I have been told by riggers who I trust... I have no other sources to point you to.

The choices we make have consequences, for us & for others!

[Airviking 0]

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Reflex had a dual reserve pilot chute arrangement called the "catapult".  It was controversial.  As I understand it, the idea was that if the pilot chute at the end of the bridle became entangled, the pilot chute near the free bag might deploy the reserve.  

As I understand it at least one person was saved by that feature, and one killed by it.  Apparently, adding the second PC added a new failure mode... One PC on each side of the jumper with the bridle running between them under the jumper... Resulting in neither PC deploying the reserve.  

I seem to remember being told that the manufacturer allowed the second PC to be removed if the owner desired.

All of the above is my recollection of what I have been told by riggers who I trust... I have no other sources to point you to.

That's good information. (if it's true. And I only say that because of you disclaimer) At a glance, the rig looks like a Racer. Who woulda thought that there were 2 springloaded PCs in there.

I believe you have my stapler.

[hookitt 0]

There isn't 2 spring loaded Pilot chutes. The primary reserve pilot chute is spring loaded. There is a second optional pilot chute attached inline to the reserve bridle. It looks like a throw out with no handle.

The rig is good. If you get one that has a tight fit on the main, I do suggest opening the lower corners of the main pack tray a little.

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[Rover 9]

1500 jumps with 1 chop on a Reflex. No complaints.

2 wrongs don't make a right - but 3 lefts do.

[riggerrob 558]

That rumour was spread by other manufacturers, who did not want another competitor.
It turns out they were right, because the market took a down-turn shortly after Flightline started sewing rigs.
My last (January 2001) conversation with Mickey Cottle focussed on the down-turn in the market.

[Airviking 0]

I just got word the rig's gone. It was a Craig's List posting, and had no details. But the rig looked really nice, and CHEAP.

That dual PC design sounds like a gimick. I wonder if there was a particular failure mode they were addressing with the 2nd PC. Or if it was just an easy way to increase the extraction force.

I believe you have my stapler.

[likestojump 3]

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I wonder if there was a particular failure mode they were addressing with the 2nd PC. Or if it was just an easy way to increase the extraction force.

they were addressing a reserve pc entanglement.
re: http://www.tridenthc.com/catapult.htm

[councilman24 36]

I have jumped one since 1997, have a new in box waiting to be assembled, and know where another NIB with a pull out is.

There is enough difference between a Reflex and a Racer that I like my Reflex very much but won't jump a Racer. Your milage will vary.

I still have my "catapult" on the mine. But it is legal to remove it.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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Is the Reflex any good? Any issues?

I have a couple that I like a lot. They're very comfortable and construction quality is better than the Javelin I have (for example, the Reflex main container is lined while the Javelin isn't).

Some riggers fail to distribute bulk so the pilot chute seats and leave the cap sticking out out where it could theoretically snag a line in adverse situations like a CRW wrap. (While Reflex pack jobs compress a little over-night and might need a little attention, some people manage pack jobs that can't be fixed). When that happens I blame the rigger not the gear. My first reserve pack job ever was on a Reflex and didn't have the problem because I searched on-line and talked to people about how to distribute the bulk. Based on that I can only conclude that some riggers are too lazy to do a little research when they come across something a little different. You don't want those guys packing your rig regardless of the brand and might even be better off with something like a Reflex where the inattention to detail is more likely to be obvious.

The Reflex reserve closing loop can be tightened without opening the container and breaking the seal in the process. A few riggers won't pack Reflexes because they're paranoid about an idiot messing with things, leaving their seal intact, and getting blamed if something bad happens. Those guys are rare enough it shouldn't be a problem in practice.

[riggerrob 558]

" ... The Reflex reserve closing loop can be tightened without opening the container and breaking the seal in the process. A few riggers won't pack Reflexes because they're paranoid about an idiot messing with things, leaving their seal intact, and getting blamed if something bad happens. Those guys are rare enough it shouldn't be a problem in practice.

[riggermick 6]

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I just got word the rig's gone. It was a Craig's List posting, and had no details. But the rig looked really nice, and CHEAP.

That dual PC design sounds like a gimick. I wonder if there was a particular failure mode they were addressing with the 2nd PC. Or if it was just an easy way to increase the extraction force.

No not a gimmick, I almost went in due to both main and reserve pilot chutes becoming entangled. That's when I came up with the idea for the Catapult.

As faras extraction forces go the Catapult has no effect to that end.It was discovered during testing tthat once the primary p/c was under load and moving away from the jumper, the secondary p/c did not have time to accelerate and provide any additional force. The Catapult is located about 3' from the bag and the overall bridle length is around 15'.

Oh and we were not "sued out of business", the equipment market was in a deep slump back then. There were no winners in the law suit, no money changed hands but we all lost somthing, a friend. Our leagal bills to successfully fight the suit were quite large, there is no liability insurance in this business.

Mick.

[kleggo 138]

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Reflex had a dual reserve pilot chute arrangement called the "catapult".
I seem to remember being told that the manufacturer allowed the second PC to be removed if the owner desired.

.

i liked my CFlex very much.
It was by far the most comfortable rig i've owned.
the reserve container was a sweet design that was "rigger friendly"
i liked the external reserver PC.
i removed the catapult and never used it.

cheers

Craig

[ronaldheadrick 0]

I'm in need of a free bag for the reflex 2 that is what I jump and have been jumping it since I had 20 jumps and I've got 83 total and I love it I had a bag lock today and had to deploy my reserve the bag lock was my fault not the equipment but I need a new free bag for one that fits a raven 181 that is what mine came with