How would you feel if put in this question

[flyhi 24]

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remember you are nuts because you are a DZO

Ain't it the truth.

A friend and I were once told by a DZO that everytime we jumped at his place, we cost him money. That pissed us off so badly, that we decided to jump there until we ran him out of business.

Remember, he is profit, you are overhead.

Shit happens. And it usually happens because of physics.

[pilotdave 0]

Stories like this make me so happy that I jump at a civilized DZ, run by a club, not a DZO. A lot of our jumpers switch back and forth between competing DZs. For special events, planes are shifted around as needed, and jumpers go where the action is. There's even an RW competition coming up between DZs. Now THATS how nearby DZs should compete, not by banning jumpers that choose to jump elsewhere.

Clubs are the way to go. No DZO to feed.

Dave

[Nightingale 0]

I think feeling "uncomfortable" with another DZs staff jumping at your DZ is silly, so long as they're safe, heads-up jumpers.

I've seen folks that work at Elsinore jump at Perris, use the tunnel at Perris. Nobody seems to have a problem with it. Heck, the two DZs even have a boogie where the planes take off at one DZ and the jumpers land at the other.

If they're paying you for their jump tickets, why should it matter where they work?

For a while, I worked at one karate studio while training at another. The reason was that when I went to train, I wanted to have fun, and I didn't want students bugging me while I was trying to train, learn, and enjoy myself. I always ended up teaching, answering the phone, or dealing with new students, instead of doing my own workout. Its harder to have fun at work. More fun to go elsewhere.

Sounds like you kicked a jumper off your DZ for no good reason, and lost some money in the process, and possibly a bit of reputation.

[flypunk 0]

I don't know about how folks run business in different DZ's, but come on lets grow up a bit and be civilized. Why would you care that your funjumpers work at other DZ's?

Did you ever stop to think about how them doing their fun jumps at your DZ might actually be a good reflection on your DZ?

Geez. So far I've been fortunate that three other DZO's in the surrounding areas are friendly and actually greet you and encourage your visiting their Dz's. Hell some of our DZ's even have staff that works at several of them, and one of them trained me as a TI knowing that I worked at another DZ.

I think you just lost a customer to a really bad decision.

...

[shropshire 0]

Brian,

What do you think of the replies that have been posted?

Have they helped?

It would be great to hear what you think.

Blue Ones

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[jlmiracle 7]

I would think you wouldn't mind them making their jump money at one dz and spending it at yours? I would think the other dz would have a bigger problem since that person works there and doesn't support them by jumping there.

just my 2 cents.

Judy

Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

[hookitt 0]

Brian, you laughed at me when I back flipped my very first Hop-n-pop.

Suck it up bro. You know that skydiving is supposed to be fun. That's why you bought a DZ in the first place.

I've jumped at many DZ's and work at different one's on occasion. Think about it, if you have too many tandems, are you going to call around to other Tandem instructors to help out? I'll answer that for you. Yes you will.

If you are uncomfortable, then that's your gig. He's just a jumper like you are/were. Remember the H Place prior to it's current owner? Don't be like that. Life's too short. Help him don't hinder. In the long run it will serve you better any way.

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[Hooknswoop 19]

Did you employ this jumper an independent contractor or employee?

If they are an IC, then you can’t fault them for making money at another DZ, since they have neither the benefits or job security at your DZ.

You can’t pay someone as an IC and expect them to act like an employee.

Did you guarantee them enough work that they would have no need to go to another DZ?

Did you offer to pay them more or give them discounted or free fun jumps if they stayed at your DZ?

What would you have done if given an ultimatum?

Seems to me you lost a valuable staff member and customer because you expected them to act like an employee but paid/treated them as an IC.

Loyalty is a 2-way street. If you offered enough that the this jumper felt no need to work at the other DZ, then they probably wouldn’t have. Since you didn’t/can’t, how can you expect them to cut their own throat and not work at the other DZ?

If Pepsi had a computer tech fix a computer, paid them as an IC and Coke called this tech and asked them to fix a computer for them, would he? Of course he would. Pepsi only paid for a specific service and because they didn’t need any more than that, didn’t hire the tech. By the same token, since the tech wasn’t hired, they must work on other company’s computers to make enough money.

DZO’s crack me up. They think jumpers OWE them.

How do companies earn my loyalty? Quality products at a reasonable price with good customer service. I will even pay a higher than reasonable price for a good product backed up by good customer service.

You tried to put this jumper in the middle of your differences with the other DZ, like two divorced parents using the kids to get back at each other. You shouldn’t have put this jumper in the position of having to choose.

You got what you deserve.

Derek

[shropshire 0]

wow... you just summed everything up really nicely, in a clear non aggresive way - good post Mr.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[peacefuljeffrey 0]

You are talking about a different person from the one with whom the DZO had the falling-out, right?

Why take out the bitterness from that situation on an unrelated person?

If you care about skydiving, and people becoming better skydivers, you will be business-neutral about the decisions you make regarding jumping with this person and letting him jump your aircraft.

If you care more about the petty business squabble, particularly if outside of this, your business is doing fine, then you don't care about skydiving or making better skydivers, and you should pack it in and let someone who loves the sport take over your DZ.

-

-Jeffrey
"With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!"

[Ralf 0]

When a staff member is at their own DZ, they are on call. That is a from of pressure. They also have to maintain a good example, etc. More pressure. So I can see why a staff from one DZ would like to jump at another DZ.

If they talk about their "home DZ" in a factual way -OK, that is human nature. If they are advertizing, or trying to get people to "jump" over to the other DZ, they have crossed the line - and a private word to them would be in order.

Ralf Stinson

PS Some very good points above about independent contractors and treatment of employees!

[scottbre 0]

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I think you just lost a customer to a really bad decision.

... and several potential customers, from the looks of it.

"Your mother's full of stupidjuice!"
My Art Project

[ladyskydiver 0]

Quote

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I think you just lost a customer to a really bad decision.

... and several potential customers, from the looks of it.

Agreed 100%. I will not support a DZO that has that kind of an attitude with my $$$.

Life is short! Break the rules! Forgive quickly! Kiss slowly! Love truly, Laugh uncontrollably. And never regret anything that made you smile.

[turtlespeed 212]

Quote

When a staff member is at their own DZ, they are on call. That is a from of pressure. They also have to maintain a good example, etc. More pressure. So I can see why a staff from one DZ would like to jump at another DZ.

If they talk about their "home DZ" in a factual way -OK, that is human nature. If they are advertizing, or trying to get people to "jump" over to the other DZ, they have crossed the line - and a private word to them would be in order.

Ralf Stinson

PS Some very good points above about independent contractors and treatment of employees!

I would hope that if you are, even a Ind. Contractor, that you a=would not be feeling pressure at being a good example at your home DZ, and I SURELY hope that the staff that would be the same at a different dz. (after hours exepted)

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[Ron 7]

The DZO should grow up.

If a DZO made me choose...trust me he would lose..Hell I have had GF tell me "Its your friends or me"....I still have my friends.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[turtlespeed 212]

Works the same with wives - or ex wives I should say.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun