Martial Arts Practitioners i have a question.

[Mad47 0]

Quote

If it's your 400th fight, you have the same edge that you have in the door with 400 dives more than a 1st jumper. No matter how strong, brave or talented, they're in a position which is somewhat alien to them. Sparing and competition fights are largely dances without music. You can only learn to fight by fighting when the outcome is uncertain, getting hurt, losing. We don't learn from our hits. We learn from our misses.

t

Excellent example.
No martial art lesson can be more rewarding than doing your first solo on empty street or loosing it to five drunk guys in a men’s room (with no major broken bones). Practice fights are only good to some extent because in most of the cases they are conducted by rules.

An average street fighter will always defeat an average master of kung-fu theory who only practices in gym and rarely gets involved in real fights.

[Viking 0]

Quote

What exactly are YOU looking to get out of a martial art?

To learn how to defend myself and the people i care about.

My entire childhood i was picked on and beat up. I walked away when ever i could. When i did i knew i couldn't have won. It was a huge blow to my self esteem. The few fights i couldn't walk away from (crowd of class mates caging you in) i got my ass kicked.

I want to be able to walk away knowing i could have handed that guy his ass.

I swear you must have footprints on the back of your helmet - chicagoskydiver
My God has a bigger dick than your god -George Carlin

[favaks 0]

It depends on how much you are willing to commit. If you are going to spend a few hours a week, mix martial arts is your best option. Take Muai Thai, boxing, and grapping. In about one year, you will be able to take on most of the average joe on the street.
Kungfu is a lifestyle. It takes a very long time to obtain result, but it is very rewarding. The training is also more complete. It's like wine, you get better as you age. Do you see boxers fighting into their old age? How often are you going to be rolling on the ground in your 70's?
The problem with Kungfu is it's hard to find the right teacher. You also have to put in a lot of time. I am commiting 11 hours a week and it doesn't seem enough.

favaks

[Nightingale 0]

it really depends on your teacher.

go to www.martialtalk.com and you can ask the kung fu guys there to help you find a teacher in your area, and do some research into other styles if you wish. me, I'm partial to kenpo.

You have to pick a style that works for you. Pick an instructor you're comfortable with.

Beware of any school that:

promises a black belt in a certain amount of time
tries to rope you into a contract immediately
charges more than about $100 a month
has a lot of five to ten year old black belts running around.

[leroydb 0]

i would suggest to delve into multiple martial arts. Ground/grappling/standup/distance fighting techniques are are important and would be vital to add to ones arsenal.

i feel that it would be better than studying just one art. there are teachers out there that do this. they are usually pretty serious.

Leroy


..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio...

[Jib 0]

I agree with everyone about grappling, also because pretty kicks take too long, take too much room, take too much energy and are too early to see coming. Knees and elbows work.

As for schools, beware of the mills. You pay $X/month, but can only go to 30 minute classes (too short) 3 times a week unless you want to pay for private lessons (more $$), have to sign a year contract (can't leave) and have to test every month (pay more).

--------------------------------------------------
the depth of his depravity sickens me.
-- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt

[RoysPlayThing 0]

Quote

No style is really useful in real life nowaday.
It's and art of the body and mind.
Fighting should only be use in need of defense, or when someone writes a check bigger than their ass can cash.

-

I agree... but for a art of physical exercise it is great... I like any form of Martial Arts with alot of kicking... I also was certified for CDT (compliance-direction-takedown) which is a form of pressure point exercises to disable a person without any damage to the person afterward. Its a great form of defense to get away without getting sued later on. ... speaking of which I need a refresher course.

_______________________________________________
My mind is like a parachute...it functions only when open.

[tunaplanet 0]

I've taken BJJ for 15 years. Where did you study and what belt?

Forty-two

[beowulf 1]

Mohler Jiu Jitsu in Coppell, TX
I only took it for about a year and never tested for any belts. Also never competed. Just tried to learn as much as I could. Wasn't all that great at it, but tried hard and enjoyed it.

http://www.mohlerjiu-jitsu.com

[tunaplanet 0]

Quote

Wasn't all that great at it, but tried hard and enjoyed it.

Having fun is extremely important. Sparring is the most fun in BJJ.

What were you weak in? What were you strong in? How was your guard? Guard passing? Key Lock? Triangle choke? Open guard work?

Stick with it. Some people are just natural grapplers. Others take a bit to pick it up. You will eventually.

Forty-two

[Snowbird 0]

My vote goes along with what lots of others are saying. I'm partial to jiu-jitsu. Brazillian can have a lot of competition focus, but if you don't want to compete it shouldn't be a problem. I took Bissett jiu-jitsu, which has sparring but no competition. Done properly, your opponent doesn't always get back up in one piece.

One other thing that I haven't seen said here. You only get out of it what you put in. Regardless of which school you choose, if you want to really learn it, you need to dedicate a fair amount of time and practice. It needs to be muscle memory, no stopping to think about what the sensei said to do.

And remember, your best defense is to not get into the situation in the first place, if it can be at all avoided.

Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea.
-Robert A. Heinlein

[bluewaterstream 0]

Quote

In terms of practical uses where does Kung Fu stand? In your opinion which is the most useful style in real life?

For starters, make sure that the people that are giving you advise regarding the most useful martial art style in real life situations actually have experience both in the ring and in real life(street fights). If they don't, their opinion is useless and they have not truly tested their art. Most people simply stand by the one art that they have the most experience in. I've met, seen, and have fought plenty of incredible tournament black belt point fighters that would get their asses kicked in a real street fight. What most people learn in martial art classes and in the ring, will not apply to real life situations if they are up against someone that can actually fight. Bruce Lee had it right by combining various arts. When you limit yourself to just one art, you are also limiting yourself to understanding and knowing your enemy that may have practiced several arts that you are not familiar with. Learn to fight both standing up and on the ground. If you're really just looking to learn how to protect yourself in a street fight, forget martial arts for now and take up boxing. You'll learn how to take and avoid a hit, plus you'll learn how to put someone on their ass. You'll become a REAL fighter a lot fast through boxing, than you will with martial arts. If you then want to become even a better fighter after boxing for awhile, then take up a few different martial arts and learn how to fight on the ground and how to kick.

I personally have most of my experience in Tang Soo Do(Black Belt), Hapkido, Judo, Muay Thai, and Boxing, but I have played around with many other arts as well(including the art you seem to be most interested in, Kung Fu). I also used to be a martial arts instructor and I competed for several years against many different black belts that were proficient in many different styles. I have experience both in and out of the ring and value my ground and boxing skills the most in 1 on 1 street fights. I have used martial art techniques before in real life, but those situations are rare. Save yourself some time and money and learn how to box.

[tunaplanet 0]

Quote

Save yourself some time and money and learn how to box.

One of the weakest forms of self defense.

Forty-two

[MarkM 0]

Quote

Right down the road from where I work is a Ninja school. You could try that.
Here is their website. www.artofcombat.com
When I first noticed I couldn't stop laughing. Never went in there to check it out. Who knows maybe they really know what they are doing?

I took Ninjitsu for a few years when I was a teenager(a long time ago). It was aimed at being a very practical art. We learned knives, shuriken(thrown for administering poison and held in hand for close combat), tumbles, throws kick and punches that tended to work towards breaking a bone as quickly as possible(so you could get away), improvised weapons(a guest speaker was a prison warden who brought in makeshift weapons prisoners made, and he showed us how they did it), firearms, short sword, short bo, chase and evasion techniques, nunchucks, infiltration and since we were kids we were also taught various things to defend against an abusive parent or schoolyard bullies.

[murrays 0]

I've been going to Muay Thai for just over a year. The school that I go to teaches karate, Muay Thai, BJJ, Filipino Stick fighting and self defense courses. The school's owner had years of bouncing experience way back when .... guys used to come from all around to take him on. He has always changed with the times and adapted new techniques/styles and his real world experience into the school's curriculum.

One of our local jumpers, who got a black belt in karate when he was about 17 or 18, trained this year for his first MMA fight.

He focused most of his time on BJJ and his ground fighting skills. He has lots of bar fight experience but used BJJ for his ground skills and Muay Thai training to work on his stand-up/striking skills.

His preference was to go to the ground in his fight but he was fighting a striker who wanted nothing of going to ground...so he smoked him with a right, broke his jaw in two places and ended the fight with his striking skills.

The night he fought, our school had 10 people fighting..6 in MMA bouts and 4 in Muay Thai fights. All our fighters except one MMA fighter won their fights. Most in very convincing and decisive fashion.

Based on what I saw, I think BJJ and Muay Thai or other striking disciplines are a pretty good way to start.

--
Murray

"No tyranny is so irksome as petty tyranny: the officious demands of policemen, government clerks, and electromechanical gadgets." - Edward Abbey

[Casurf1978 0]

Quote

Having said that, grappling is useless against multiples. While you hold the one, the other could strangle you with their shoelaces. Royce Gracie is not a "quick" winner, dispite being undisputed master of his domain.

You sound like one of my Krav teachers.
My co-worker learned that the hard way this last weekend when he got into a bar fight. He's taking BJJ for two years now and guess what happened when he was on the floor with one guy, the other guys friend came up and knocked him out cold. It works in UFC, but in real life with multiples he's lucky he only got away with a broken nose, a black eye, and a hurt ego.

[tunaplanet 0]

Can anyone put up a video on this thread that is 11 mb? I can send it email or on AIM.

Forty-two

[bluewaterstream 0]

Boxing

Quote

One of the weakest forms of self defense

Thank you for pointing that out.

I have also studied a bit of Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and I agree that it is a great art. I see why you stick by it. However, like most people like yourself that have only really studied one art for a long time, you stick by it and talk down upon others and are blind to their value. Every style has something to offer. You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but I couldn't disagree more with your comment.

A few quick questions for you, have you ever been jumped or have been in a fight where it wasn't a 1 on 1 situation? Probably not, because if you had you would then realize that in a "real life situation" grappling with one dude while you have a few others around really isn't the best idea, because you'll probably end up getting your head kicked in. This guy posting was asking about real life situations, not UFC or any other organized fight, where you're usually guaranteed to only have one opponent.

Learning to box first as a beginner has two major advantages: First, it will show you how to get a lot more power out of your punches and how to avoid punches when they're being thrown at you at full speed (unlike the punches and kicks that are thrown at new martial artists). Second, you will learn how to take a hit in boxing - even as a beginner. A lot of martial artists get all the way up to black belt without ever taking a real hit and then when they do, especially in a street fight, they go into shock or get knocked out. Pretty weak.

Listen bro, I also have a shit load of experience in martial arts and I am not knocking any of them, I'm just saying that a beginner should focus on the basics if they truly want to be able to hold their own in a street fight.

At my current boxing gym, we actually have quite a few Brazilian Jiu Jitsu students training with us because they want to learn how to punch harder and more efficiently(I think one of them is actually training for UFC). These are very good fighters that already have very strong punches, but they realize that they can become better punchers by training with someone that specializes in punching. You definitely are not speaking for all Brazilian Jiu Jitsu fighters. No one art has it all, not even yours. Try exploring the things that your art is missing and I guarantee you that you'll become a better fighter, both in and out of the ring.

[tunaplanet 0]

When you gain the appropriate grappling experience you'll see what you're missing to be the complete fighter.

What people like yourself don't realize is that you don't have to learn 37 different styles to be a complete fighter.

Tell me again what ranking you hold in BJJ?

If you're ever in Florida float me a PM and we'll hook up. I'll take you to one of the gyms here and we'll video tape a 1 on 1 and post it on these forums and let the people see for themselves which is a more dominent style.

Forty-two

[tunaplanet 0]

Quote

have you ever been jumped or have been in a fight where it wasn't a 1 on 1 situation? Probably not, because if you had you would then realize that in a "real life situation" grappling with one dude while you have a few others around really isn't the best idea

#1 - Correct. It's not the best idea to go to the ground when confronted with multiple opponents. That's something that's elementary. Everyone knows this.

#2 - I have been in more than one fight where I was outnumbered.

Forty-two

[bobsled92 0]

Quote

In terms of pracital uses where does Kung Fu stand? In your opinion which is the most useful style in real life?

___________________________________________
I studied Japanese styles and found that my record of 114-5 means there's always someone out there that is better and you'll only find out after it's too late. I don't remember my 114 wins as well as I remember my 5 losses.

_______________________________
If I could be a Super Hero,
I chose to be: "GRANT-A-CLAUS". and work 365 days a Year.
http://www.hangout.no/speednews/

[favaks 0]

A well rounded fighter needs to know when to go to the ground and when to fight stand up. Most kungfu practioners don't bother with the ground and that is their weakness, just like ground fighters who ignores striking. It would be fatal to take somebody who has a knife to the ground.

favaks.

[jkwon 0]

Just don't fight. Everyone loses their temper at some point but it is really not worth anything to get into a fight. If someone threatens you just talk him/her down. It's easier than walking home with a broken knuckle or face.

--joe
HISPA #69
The Best Band in the WORLD!!!
The new full length album "See What You Can Find"

[leroydb 0]

i agree, its even better to not have to fight at all... BUT i was leaned more toward fullcontact/grappling train of thought

Leroy


..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio...

[bluewaterstream 0]

Quote

If you're ever in Florida float me a PM and we'll hook up. I'll take you to one of the gyms here and we'll video tape a 1 on 1 and post it on these forums and let the people see for themselves which is a more dominent style.

I think you've been hit in the head one too many times. This may prove which one of us was a better fighter, but it wouldn't prove shit about which is a more dominant style. I never said that Brazilian Jiu Jitsu wasn't a good style and I actually agreed with you in my last post that it's "a great art", so what's your problem? You seem to have a lot to prove. I personally can care less who would win in a fight between us. I grew out of this having to always prove myself stage many years ago. If you're really that upset with me, I'm sure you'll eventually see me at a boogie one of these days - introduce yourself. You see what I look like and you've got my name. Approach me as a cool skydiving brother and we'll make a jump together or throw a punch at me and we'll brawl, I vote for the skydive but whatever... you don't scare me chief, so lets cool out with the pointless online threats...