thru canopy video

[ridestrong 1]

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Someone should post some video of the paranoid cameraman after breakoff.

????

*I am not afraid of dying... I am afraid of missing life.*
----Disclaimer: I don't know shit about skydiving.----

[hcsvader 1]

Thats when after break off the camera looks leftrightupdownbehindbelowohfuckwhotryingtokillmerightleftupdown PULL

Have you seen my pants?
it"s a rough life, Livin' the dream
>:)

[Squeak 17]

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Thats when after break off the camera looks leftrightupdownbehindbelowohfuckwhotryingtokillmerightleftupdown PULL

When the camera man does what they are supposed to do.
Watch any good 4 way or other FS work you will see the camera person pull in place, earlier that the rest of the team

You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

[hcsvader 1]

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Thats when after break off the camera looks leftrightupdownbehindbelowohfuckwhotryingtokillmerightleftupdown PULL

When the camera man does what they are supposed to do.
Watch any good 4 way or other FS work you will see the camera person pull in place, earlier that the rest of the team

but on this jump, there were people everywhere... didnt even look to see who was trying to kill them

Have you seen my pants?
it"s a rough life, Livin' the dream
>:)

[Squeak 17]

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Thats when after break off the camera looks leftrightupdownbehindbelowohfuckwhotryingtokillmerightleftupdown PULL

When the camera man does what they are supposed to do.
Watch any good 4 way or other FS work you will see the camera person pull in place, earlier that the rest of the team

but on this jump, there were people everywhere... didnt even look to see who was trying to kill them

Not the point, he should have pull well before getting to the already open canopy. If he had "Pulled in place" and not taken it lower, this would not have happened.
What he did was film someone traking away and didnt check his air space

You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

[BillyVance 34]

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So the guy's canopy I went through fell out of the group earlier but didn't track away.

Same thing almost happened to me once;
At breakoff I looked down just in time to see a pilot chute coming at me.
I went into the hardest track I could, and I think I my toes missed the inflating canopy by ~4 feet.

I've had my near misses too. Late 90's, a 6 way went to shit around 7000 feet. Some girl in my group ended up about 50 or so feet below me. I saw her reach for her helmet with her left hand, and then her right hand went for her pull-out, for a second I wondered what the fuck is going on, then all of a sudden FUCK! Quick mad dash out of there just in time to see the bitch shoot up just mere feet behind me. I raised hell when I got on the ground. She avoided me the rest of the day, but that night she meekly came to me and explained what happened. She thought her helmet was gonna fly off since the strap came undone (Factory Diver with velcro strap) so she dumped in place not thinking about who was nearby.

In the end, my eyes were exactly where they should have been given the situation. If not, I might not be here.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[mircan 0]

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So the guy's canopy I went through fell out of the group earlier but didn't track away.

Same thing almost happened to me once;
At breakoff I looked down just in time to see a pilot chute coming at me.
I went into the hardest track I could, and I think I my toes missed the inflating canopy by ~4 feet.

I've had my near misses too. Late 90's, a 6 way went to shit around 7000 feet. Some girl in my group ended up about 50 or so feet below me. I saw her reach for her helmet with her left hand, and then her right hand went for her pull-out, for a second I wondered what the fuck is going on, then all of a sudden FUCK! Quick mad dash out of there just in time to see the bitch shoot up just mere feet behind me. I raised hell when I got on the ground. She avoided me the rest of the day, but that night she meekly came to me and explained what happened. She thought her helmet was gonna fly off since the strap came undone (Factory Diver with velcro strap) so she dumped in place not thinking about who was nearby.

In the end, my eyes were exactly where they should have been given the situation. If not, I might not be here.

Very similar thing happened to me too. Except it was 5-way it was a guy and it was a brain-lock. After we funneled he got stable and immediately pulled at 7k. While he was 10 feet below me....

You know, when you can see him going for a PC and you can do shit about it except to try to get away from him...

dudeist skydiver #42

[Andy9o8 0]

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BTW, I have well over 3000 video jumps, and still tell any New group, and some old ones, The Middle is mine, and I do not pull high!

I thought SOP when camera dumps in place is for camera to dump at breakoff to maximize vert sep. No?

[raftman 12]

DGIT!

[Andy9o8 0]

Not to be a busy-body, but wouldn't this be a useful thread to move to S&T?

[Andy9o8 0]

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BTW, I have well over 3000 video jumps, and still tell any New group, and some old ones, The Middle is mine, and I do not pull high!

I thought SOP when camera dumps in place is for camera to dump at breakoff to maximize vert sep. No?

Anyone?

[Squeak 17]

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BTW, I have well over 3000 video jumps, and still tell any New group, and some old ones, The Middle is mine, and I do not pull high!

I thought SOP when camera dumps in place is for camera to dump at breakoff to maximize vert sep. No?

Anyone?

read up Andy, we've covered that already

You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

[skyrider 0]

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BTW, I have well over 3000 video jumps, and still tell any New group, and some old ones, The Middle is mine, and I do not pull high!

I thought SOP when camera dumps in place is for camera to dump at breakoff to maximize vert sep. No?

Anyone?

Anyone? Here I am to call BULLSHIT...WHAT if I have a malfunction? now I have some lazy ass clown who didn't track, hanging out in the middle, that center Tunnel of air is MINE! Track the Fuck AWAY......... BTW, I usually pull at 1800, I find it safer than pulling high!Do to that lazy tracker problem!

[jimmytavino 16]

yup.... sure IS a good procedure....just as davelepka points out,, further upstream here in this thread....

he ALSO mentions the sometimes NOt understood concept.... of "keeping track of ALL the members of Your skydive"..

i've videoed plenty of fun jumps, from 4 ways to 16 ways.. where for one reason or another.... People are OUT!!!! of the dive..
sometimes within the first 15 seconds from exit....
THose are the dives,, where the camera person must be especially vigilant..... and MUST be on top of things....( literally AND figuratively )

Attending the dirt dive is a must, to learn the size and shape of the dive, and to SEE who the participants may be...
If there are "unknowns",,, be extra careful....
If there are jumpers with whom you are familiar,,, then KNOW,, who might go low,, KNOW who might 'over dive'. and KNOW who is likely to 'be there"...
know who the fast fallers are, and know who the floaty ones are......
beware!!! of the quick "pick-up " video slots... arranged, at boarding,,,,and KNOW what the plan will be
When ever a formation is Incomplete,,, THAT'S the time to be on your toes....
Use the process of elimination, to assess when there might be people floundering around a building dive, unable to dock on it...

If you're videoing with wings,,,,it's good to work your way to the top side of most all skydives....
and as others point out,,, 'get the hell outta Dodge,,,' sooner, rather than later...when seperation begins...
let fly your pilot chute, as soon as the dive finishes, and people start leaving.. The center might be " yours"... but hanging around there,, and pulling low,, is dangerous for everyone..and serve no useful purpose.

jmy
a 3914
d 12122
36 hr. ff # 1281

[jumpwally 0]

1800 ? i knew a guy like that once..................................

smile, be nice, enjoy life
FB # - 1083

[popsjumper 2]

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So the guy's canopy I went through fell out of the group earlier but didn't track away.

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I was the base and was supposed to pull in place as planned.

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(Quoting davelepka)This is where you have the responsibility as a camera flyer to recognize that there is as jumper missing, and to locate that jumper

Not just video...EVERYBODY!

Everyone:
Some of you guys are confusing inside video with outside video...there's a difference. For outside video, I would agree with your points about pull time.

However, inside video is a different animal. Inside video is part of the formation and has all the same responsibilities as the others in the group.

You know the mantra: Plan the Dive, Dive the Plan

In this case, the dive was planned and the video guy followed the plan. The one who didn't was the low man... assuming that the plan included what to do if one goes low. Regardless of that, we all should know to get out from under the formation if you go low.

Here is a case where the low man did not get out from under...plain and simple.

Yes, the video guy did not look...I didn't notice him looking below for the low guy at anytime during the dive....spank his ass, for sure.

Now go spank the low man...the one who screwed up.

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Then you should have pulled. As it was, you clearly just sat there, falling as others tracked away.

As per the plan. Period

Has anyone NOT done video for others for tracking?
Do you sit and float getting the shot of the trackers line and distance? What's the difference here?
(Other than the obvious video guy not looking below)

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This incident is a prime example of a camera creating a distraction. You may or may not think so, but you never would have followed that same course of action without a camera on your head. You would have never just sat there in freefall staring at another jumper tracking away,

Distracted by the camera? Maybe so...looks like it to me, too.
Followed the same course? Yes he would have IF the plan called for it.

Me? I would be discussing things quite seriously with the low man.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[popsjumper 2]

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Thats when after break off the camera looks leftrightupdownbehindbelowohfuckwhotryingtokillmerightleftupdown PULL

Funny as hell but serious at the same time.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[CazmoDee 3]

Here's mine......


http://www.youtube.com/castlecam#p/a/u/1/CJof5qGC3Sg

I'm behind the bar at Sloppy Joe's....See ya in the Keys!

Muff 4313

[Flygator 0]

Thanks for the advise! I have learned alot since then and still learning. I wanted to get the one guy tracking on video for my files.

The secret to life is not arriving at the grave in a well preserved body but sliding in sideways completely worn out yelling "holy crap" what a ride!!!

[davelepka 4]

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Then you should have pulled. As it was, you clearly just sat there, falling as others tracked away.

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As per the plan. Period

Has anyone NOT done video for others for tracking?
Do you sit and float getting the shot of the trackers line and distance? What's the difference here?
(Other than the obvious video guy not looking below)

I have not done video of others tracking when it wasn't appropriate, such as this jump.

Sitting in the middle and filming another tracking is not a good idea when you're on a jump such as this one with others of low experience. By taking the middle, and not pulling at break off, you're crowding the airspace down at pull altitude. You actually end up cutting the seperation in half by opening in the middle.

If two guys track away from each other, they have the combined distance of their two tracks as seperation. If you sit in the middle and dump, now they only have the distance of their own track from the closest canopy, that being you in the middle.

This is of course just a possibilty, but the other real danger (as illustraded here) is that a group jump with lower time jumpers is no place to not be 'paying attention' on the bottom end. Fliming tracks or deployments, or any other video work that extends beyond the break off should be approached with extreme caution.

The potential for things to go wrong tends to go up during and after break off. There's alot going on, and on top of it the nature of what could go wrong also shifts because people are opening parachutes. Freefall to freefall collisions are one thing, freefall to canopy is another.

I have to figure that the low man on this formation was not very experienced, as illustraded by the fact that he went low, stayed low, and dumped under the formation. These are not the hallmarks of a sharp, experienced jumper. With this in mind, and the experience level of the other jumpers on the dive, the first mistake was on the part of the camera flyer for making the plan that he did.

You can say 'plan the dive, and the dive the plan', but if the plan itself is shit, the point is moot. My take on this is that the presence of the camera created the situation. The camera flyer lost respect for the bottom end because he wanted to 'get the shot', and pre-planned or not, that's a mistake.

Yes, the low man is also in need of some additional training, but the rule is (and always has been) that the low man has the right of way. While I can't ignore the actions of the low man, I have to say that the camera flyer played a bigger role in this incident than the other guy.

[davelepka 4]

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Thanks for the advise! I have learned alot since then and still learning. I wanted to get the one guy tracking on video for my files.

See my reply to popsjumper for more info on this. What you may want 'for your files', and what might be a good idea on a given jump are two different things.

If you have a need for a specific shot, then you need to plan a skydive around that shot. Even if it's just a track away shot, make it a part of the skydive in that it is accomplished before the actual break off.

If your normal break off alititude is 4k, that means that at 4k everyone needs to leave and find a safe place to open a parachute, you included. What you would need to do is arrange for the tracker to leave the formation at 5k, so you can get your shot, and still complete the real break off at 4k.

The skydive is job #1, the video is much further down the list. Never let the camera get in the way of making a safe skydive. The best way to do this is to plan your jump, then picture yourself doing it without the camera. If it still makes sense, and appears safe, then you can proceed.

In this example, if you were not wearing a camera, your plan at break off would have never been to 'just sit there and wait for pull altitude'. If it doesn't make sense without a camera, it makes even less with the camera.