Nitro Main canopy

[letsgofast 0]

Won a gift certificate for a Nitro canopy from Hyper USA and ordered a 120. Just wanted some input on jumpers jumping them. What do you guys think?

[PhreeZone 15]

Nitro is a Nitron basically. Do a search on either term and there is a lot of info on here.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[hipgnosis 0]

I've been really enjoying mine.

Only problem I've heard and had with them is an occasional hard opening. This seemed to be fixed by making sure the tail is tightly rolled.


Bill

[feuergnom 22]

i've been jumping a nitro 135 since jump 50 so after two years i can say: i wouldn't want any other canopy.

you can fly nitro's/nitrons pretty conservativ or the other way. but no matter what – they'll bring you wherever you want to go safely

you can fly/maneuver it perfect even in deeeeeep brakes and it won't stall (tried it with winding the brake lines around my hands, but still it didn't stall)

right now i'm starting to go into the depth of possibilities this canopy gives me

one more big plus: due to the fabric it's really easy to pack - not like the snot-slipery zp of other canopies



edit to add: nitros have great, soft and on-heading openings. i see no need to give the tail a few extra rolls - exept if you want to it to snivel for a few more 100 feet .....

The universal aptitude for ineptitude makes any human accomplishment an incredible miracle

dudeist skydiver # 666

[diablopilot 2]

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Nitro is a Nitron basically.

Acctually it's the other way around, but that's a minor point.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[Dougjumper 0]

I have a 108 and flies very nicely. Owned mine about two years now and enjoying it every Jump.

You can Fly the Canopy Conservatively or Stealth it out a bit. The Nitro Canopy is made from the Gelvenor Textile ZP Material which is a little more easier to pack than the Performance Textile ZP Material. The only drawback is its a little more Bulkier.
Here's the site HiperUSA

The glass is half full or half empty doesn't matter. Let go and have the Lord guide your path. He will take care of it all.

[tfelber 0]

Just got back from WFFC. Since we had several low altitude days and I was looking for a new canopy I started testing. I WAS jumping a Turbo ZX 165. I demoed the Sabre2 150, Pilot 150, Safire2 149, and Nitro 150.

Sabre2 - Light front risers and quick toggle turns, very high quality, erratic, quick, sometimes off heading openings. Landed well.

Pilot - Very quick toggle turns, more effort needed on front risers, very nice to land, soft, plush, on heading openings every time. Very difficult to pack due to the slipperiness of the fabric.

Safire2 - Most front riser pressure, opened better than the Sabre2, but not as nice as the Nitro or Pilot. Landed nicely, but needed the most toggle input to finish the flare.

Nitro - Very comparable to the Pilot, but packing was a breeze. The canopy was new at the beginning of the WFFC and probably had about 20-30 jumps on it. The openings were incredible.

Now for the rest of the story. When I got back from jumping the Nitro Beezy asked me to try the 135. If you notice my jump numbers I broke 300 at the WFFC. I'm mostly a straight-in lander looking for something I can get a little more speed out of, the risers on the TZX165 are practically impossible. I was very sceptical about jumping anything smaller than a 150, EVER! Especially loading it at over 1.7.

Well Beezy promised I wouldn't die, Told me it flies like a 150. I was sure the 150 didn't fly like a 170, but I got the camera guys ready for the landing, just in case I could get it on stupid human tricks or something to help pay the medical bills, and away I went with a 135 .

Deployed. Same nice, soft, on-heading opening of the nitro and pilot 150's. Buried a toggle and did a very quick 360. I was sold! My friends weren't too happy about the lame footage they got, but that's life.

I told Beezy he better be tough because it was going to take him and his entire crew to get that canopy out of my container. We decided not to fight about it, came up with an agreeable price and were both quite happy.

I put another 7 or 8 jumps on it throughout the weekend and don't have a single complaint. It flies like a 135 up top and lands like a 150. What more could you ask for?

[PhreeZone 15]

Little confused why you chose to jump a 9 cell elliptical while trying it against a bunchof semi ellipticals that don't perform near the same. You should have also grabbed the PA canopy to try against other semi-ellipticals.

A nitro is in the same class as a Crossfire2, Katana, etc. A canopy might seem slow at 600 msl, but at Perris's heigth and density altitude I've also found canopies to fly about 1 full size smaller.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[tfelber 0]

The Blade is more like the Katana, etc. I also jumped the Stiletto 170 the main difference I saw between it and the others is the countersteering.

I was looking for an all-around canopy rather than a strictly hi-performance canopy, but I ran into Beezy in the Food Tent and he asked me to give it a try.

I would have liked to jump a Stiletto 150 but they never had one available when I wanted it.

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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Now for the rest of the story. When I got back from jumping the Nitro Beezy asked me to try the 135. If you notice my jump numbers I broke 300 at the WFFC. I'm mostly a straight-in lander looking for something I can get a little more speed out of, the risers on the TZX165 are practically impossible. I was very sceptical about jumping anything smaller than a 150, EVER! Especially loading it at over 1.7.

More advanced planforms have lower stall speeds. Once that becomes the limiting factor (as opposed to approach speed or control sensitivity) fully elliptical canopies let you shrink a size or two from a square, more modern shapes (Samurai, Crossfire) up to a size more (At my old weight 120->109 was about right, 120->105 too much), and cross-bracing at least another size.

Subjectively I don't think the stall speed of a Stiletto 120 is much different from a Sabre 150 or an Extreme FX 104. You'd probably have had the same landing experience under an Extreme FX 114 as your TZ165 or the Nitron 135. I had no problems landing an Extreme 104 @ 1.9 pounds/square feet when I had 500 jumps and was used to a Batwing 134 although 800 jumps after that loaded at 1.6-1.7 taught me that those jumps were a really bad idea.

The interesting differences are elsewhere.

You can generate a _lot_ more speed under the smaller parachutes whether or not you mean too (I clocked 48 MPH coming out of a carving 90 degree turn under my Stiletto loaded arround 1.7). Designs built for swooping stay in a dive longer and build even more speed.

The smaller parachutes are also a lot more sensitive to control input, intentional or otherwise. A Samurai 105 @ 1.9 pounds/square foot stalls more abruptly than a Stiletto 120 @ 1.7. When I switched from a Batwing 134 @ 1.4 to a Stiletto 120 @ 1.6 I didn't always fly in a straight line when flaring.

These characteristics get lots of people in trouble when something abnormal happens - some one flies close to them on landing, there's a wind shift, etc. Speed that's manageable in a straight line may not be when you need to fly arround an obstacle.

Bill's down sizing checklist http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/safety/detail_page.cgi?ID=47 isa great list of necessary survival skills you should have mastered before down-sizing. I'd probably add "land with a 5 MPH tail-wind" to the list.

Brian Germain's Wingloading Never-Exceed chart (1.0 + .1/100 jumps with a 2.0 maximum, -.1/2000 feet density altitude, -.2 for smaller canopies) seems to accurately reflect human learning and perception as it relates to flying parachutes.

Buying a Stiletto 170 for $500, putting a few hundred jumps on it, selling it for the same money, downsizing to a 150, puting a few hundred jumps on it, and then putting 500-1000 jumps on your favorite 135 would be a fine idea.

At 1.7 pounds/square foot prachutes have sharp pointy fangs even when you can't see them.

[pdj6p 0]

parachutes fly faster at higher altitudes. are you saying perris is a high altitude dropzone?

Death is so permanant, and I'm just not ready for that kind of committment.

[ianmdrennan 2]

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The Blade is more like the Katana,

Absolutely no way. I've jumped both and the Katana is a very different animal to the blade. While they are both considered HP canopies the Blade is no where near the Katana.

The Blade, IMO is much more like a stilletto with better lift at the end.

Blues,
Ian

Performance Designs Factory Team

[diablopilot 2]

Phree I have to diagree a bit with you. The Nito is actualy a very nice design, but I'd say quite different from the Katana or CF2. IT's a realtivly high lift at slow speeds canopy. The comparable (and superior in some respects) canopy to those listed would be the Blade.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[diablopilot 2]

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The Blade, IMO is much more like a stilletto with better lift at the end.

I'd disagree with that. The Blade dives longer and harder than most Conventional canopies I've flown. It's definatly on par with the Katana.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[headoverheels 292]

I haven't jumped a Nitro, but have put some on the Nitron. It is very much in the class of a Stiletto of the same size, with a similar short recovery arc. Less oversteer, seemed to have openings more on heading. Flare seemed about the same to me, but I didn't make enough jumps to zero in on that. People that regularly jump them say that the flare is better than a Stiletto. Katana of the same size definitely has a better flare, and dives more in a turn. I personally wouldn't load the Nitron over about 1.65, probably less if jumping regularly at much higher than sea level.

[ianmdrennan 2]

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The Blade dives longer and harder than mos Conventional canopies I've flown.

Yep, it does dive more than a stiletto but I still think it's closer to that than a Katana. The Katana 107 flew pretty damn close to my velo and easily outdove the Blade 98 by a long way. My point wasn't that it's as much like as Stiletto as that its not anything like the Katana IMO.

Blade 98:
Spectacular openings
Quick turns
reasonable dive arc (longer than average but nothing unusual)
Junk on the rears IMO
Short line set
reasonable front riser pressure

Katana 107:
Nice openings (mine were quick on the canopy I jumped though)
Slower turns building up momentum and speed
Incredibly long dive arc. Much more like a velocity than anything else I've jumped.
Longer lines
Unbelievably powerful on the rears (I think more so than my velo but it's hard to say)
Front riser pressure...whats that?
I think they're both good canopies depending on what you want from your canopy, but I'd take the Katana because of the velo like characteristics.

Blues,
Ian

Performance Designs Factory Team

[BETO74 0]

You must be doing something really wrong packing since the lines are cascades all the way you shoul not have a hard opening at all.

My opinion on the canopy is " The canopy is execellent" I was in the mrket looking for a crossfire 2 to down size and buy a new one, when I meet Chris from Precision I demo a Nitron an I was very impressed with openings how it flyes and flare power, I could not stall the canopy the first 10 jumps on it that how much flare power has.

Love it what can I say!!!!

http://web.mac.com/ac057a/iWeb/AC057A/H0M3.html

[diablopilot 2]

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since the lines are cascades all the way you shoul not have a hard opening at all

I think you mean no cascaded, and that should have little to do with the openings really.

The Nitro opens great and does the even sportier Blade. The blade has about half the airfoil thickness at the Nitro, and is a very nice conventioan high speed wing.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[BETO74 0]

Sorry you're right not cascade, I'm writing this in a hurry, I think it does has to do with the openings since the slider travels don the lines creating tension almost all the way down, at least that was Chris from Precision explained to me.

I had a crossfire and I was impresed with the soft openings but the Nitron exceded that. The only thing I had a not such a good feeling was the ears on top of the canopy but it seems to do the job of keeping the wing floowing on the top skin on slow approaches, I think loading the stabilizers made also a huge difference, can't wait to try a Xaos difference canopy over all, but I'm really impresed with the performance of the Nitron.

Did I say I love it

http://web.mac.com/ac057a/iWeb/AC057A/H0M3.html

[apoil 0]

Quote

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The Blade is more like the Katana,

Absolutely no way. I've jumped both and the Katana is a very different animal to the blade. While they are both considered HP canopies the Blade is no where near the Katana.

The Blade, IMO is much more like a stilletto with better lift at the end.

Blues,
Ian

They are similar in that they are essentially third generation fully ellipticals. The Crossfire1 and Cobalt are 2nd generations - ie a design that evolved when pretty much the only other elliptical was the stiletto.

Flight characteristics between the Blade and Katana are very different however they are both among the most aggressive 9 cell ellipticals on the market.

The Blade is VERY different from the stiletto. You toss it off by saying "better lift at the end" but that means a lot. I load my blade at over 2.1 and don't suffer any shortage of swoop or flare. It is also rock solid stable in the deepest of brakes (like the nitro). Just because it has a flat glide and a short recovery arc doesn't make it the same.

[ianmdrennan 2]

I hear ya, and that's why I responded to JP's post with a better comparision table. I think the Blade is a better performing canopy than the Stiletto, I was just saying it shares more traits with the Stiletto than the Katana.

I definately wasn't trying to take away from what the Blade is capable of.

Blues,
Ian

Performance Designs Factory Team

[beezyshaw 0]

Hey Tony, came across this thread from a year and a half ago, and thought I'd get some of your impressions now that you've had your Nitro for a while now. You were critisized for going to the Nitro 135 when you did by DrewEckhardt and to some degree by PhreeZone.

Tell us if you've had any situations that either (1) make you glad you made the choice you did, or (2) make you wish you'd chosen a 150 instead.

Also, to PhreeZone, you wrote your comments in this thread before jumping a Nitro. After jumping the 120 you demo'd, do you now feel any differently than your opinions back in Aug. '04?

[PhreeZone 15]

Well, its time to update this thread I think. I put probally halfd a dozen jumps on a Nitro doing all sorts of stuff like Birdman and Camera, the openings were WONDERFUL. Hands down some of the best openings I've had, some were not on heading but they were soft and predictable. Compared to the same size Katana, the Nitro just felt slower. It has a shorter recovery arc then my Samuari currently but it had a little more flare power then the Sam on some HP landings. The planing out of the canopy was easy to dial in, but since the arc was shorter I was almost always too high. Its a deffinate Stiletto/Cobalt class canopy. Would I compare it to a Pilot or Sabre2? No, its a higher proforming canopy then either of those, but its not near as HP as a Katana.
I jumped the demo at 1.68 and it had about the same feel as the Sam 120 I borrowed also.

Overall its a great canopy for a first HP canopy. The Non-cascadded lines would make a line set change a breeze. Would I recommend dropping 2 sizes since it "flies big", probally not since it did'nt "feel" any larger then the Sam 120 I jumped also.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[Falko 0]

I'm not adressed but I bet you like to hear that I jump a Nitro 120 for 150 jumps now.

I especially love its responsiveness and the feeling that you're "one" with the canopy due to the short uncascaded HMA lines. The flare is amazing... whenever I finish the flare I have my hands down all the way beside my thighs, and I know my steering lines are not too long !

Personally I like the very short recovery arc (many people don't). I start my frontriser 90s at +/-350ft and it works well with me. I like being able to dig out of a misjudged low turn in a split second, already had to do that a few times. When you pull down the toggles the Nitro is wings level immediately (now please noone tear that statement apart, I'm not suggesting having a false sense of security with that canopy)

When going in deep brakes after opening (thank's to Brian's course) I can stay up "forever" and watch the crowd rush for the landing zone. I remember just recently at a Pink Boogie when I shared a jump with a big guy who had a Sabre 210, he landed before me and had already picked up his canopy when I came in to final. He was like "Where have you been?".

Question:
Beezy do you know how HiPer measures the sqf of the Nitro? If yes would you post it in this thread please? Thanks.

Ich betrachte die Religion als Krankheit, als Quelle unnennbaren Elends für die menschliche Rasse.
(Bertrand Russell, engl. Philosoph, 1872-1970)

[tfelber 0]

I've got a couple hundred jumps on my Nitro now and you can ask anybody I know what I think of it! Every time I get to the ground I let everyone know what a great canopy it is. I downsized faster than most people consider wise, but from the first time I jumped the Nitro (See earlier post above) I knew the step down was not an issue. I kept my 165 thinking I could always jump it if I became uncurrent or something, but that hasn't been an issue.

I'm loading it about 1.7 and it flies great. New it packed easily due to the type of fabric used and the opening are as soft as landing in butter. I've gotten to the point I don't even need to look up during opening. It feels exactly the same every time. Looking up you see the canopy begin to inflate and the slider come down in a smooth, easy motion. My 165 would often push the bumpers down on my risers. On the Nitro I use Beezy's custom soft links and the slider never comes down hard enough to slide down the risers.

I consistently open low and often get some worried looks, but I have a lot of confidence in the Nitro. I don't get weird off-headings, inconsistent opening speeds, or any other oddities that concern me.

The only complaint, if you could call it that, I have is the HMA lines tangle easily with the slider stowes, and the toggles gathering up the canopy on the ground. The lines are so small that continuity checks require a little help, but I wouldn't change them. Unless to go to the newer UV treated black lines.
I'm not sure the hot dogs (mine are red) or stabilizers really have any effect on flight characteristics, but they are something people notice. Many times people have come up to me on the ground and asked me if that's a Nitro/Nitron I'm jumping. I would like to have Beezy build a demo without the stabilizers just to feel the difference.

In October last year, two months after I bought the canopy at Rantoul, I went to the Moab Boogie. I was alittle intimidated jumping a 135 loaded at 1.75 at 4800' MSL. But it just added to my feelings about this canopy. I had one face plant on landing, but that was due to landing in some extremely soft dirt off the normal landing area. My feet just sank about a foot into the ground and there was nothing I could do. The landing were fast, but if you just keep flying the Nitro it will bring you to a nice, gentle stop.

I've done some intentional downwinders, just to evaluate the performance, and the Nitro will keep on flying without dumping you, if you stay on the toggles. The first time was about a 5-7mph wind and I swooped so far (for me that is, not being a real swooper) that I finally went to my butt jsut to shut it down. Since then I found if I stay about 3/4 in the brakes the canopy will eventually slow down and stabbing them the rest of the way down will stop the canopy with know indication of a stall.

I've had other manufacturers ask me to demo their gear and my response is always the same; "Why? I already have the canopy I want!" Thanks again Beezy for your advice.