SStewart

you advise him based on your personal convictions, and that's useless to someone who doesn't want to loose $4100 (minus container*** You are right, my advice is based on my personal convictions. I think stealing is stealing even if it done with a stolen credit card. I also think it is wrong to keep stolen gear even if you did not know it was stolen when you bought it. The container he keeps, the cypres has already been returned, and the combined value of the two canopies is probably less than what he will pay his lawyer to fight this. so my advice is also practical. I guess I am just taken aback by those that would advise him to keep the gear; Instead of doing the right thing he should try to find some legal loophole so he can keep someone elses property?

Here is a copy of the email I received from the dealer posted with his permission; "The gear was reported stolen and we checked the credit card and got the authorization to ship the gear.[We have all of the documents] When we got charged back by the CC Company we tried to track down the receiver of the gear at the address we shipped to. We found out that the person we shipped to did not live at the apt complex and was waiting for the UPS truck to deliver the gear, he got the gear and disappeared. We then notified SSK and USPA with the s/n of each stolen item. All of this took place nearly 4 years ago. About 2 months ago we got a call from SSK that the Cypres II showed up for it's 4yr check. They had the records of our stolen gear report from 4 years ago. The Cypres was returned to us. The rigger that had the stolen reserve told us that he wanted to buy the stolen gear but we told him to return it to us. He said he would do so the next day which would have been 21 Nov 2008. He didn't. Now, 6 weeks later, he contends he doesn't know if it is stolen or not. Eric, the purchaser of the stolen gear, also said he would get the Nitron main canopy back from the guy he traded it to for his Sabre II 150 and return it to us. If I don't receive the rest of my stolen gear within ten days I am going to file a complaint about the possession of stolen gear transported across state lines and the original fraudulent use of a stolen credit card. The gear was on a USPA stolen list at one time, just like the list at SSK. We have all of the original invoices of our purchase from the manufacturer of the canopies, Precision and Aerodyne, and the Cypres II. Possession of stolen property knowingly is a criminal act, a felony in this case. {ask any pawn shop} Maybe a couple of people involved had better seek a criminal attorney?...Do ya think? What's the Latin term for "let the buyer beware".......? Caveat Emptor? What ever happened to the old days when a rigger found out that gear was stolen and would return it to the rightful owner without a bunch of excuses? I personally have recovered and returned a number of rigs to the owners when I found out they were stolen over the last 50 years I've been rigging. I have seized gear on the spot from the person that had it a time or two. Ethics must have changed!" It seems pretty cut and dry to me. I do feel sorry for Eric, he did not know he was buying stolen equipment. But that doesn't mean he should keep it. Unfortunately it sounds like he will spend more on an attourney than what the gear is now worth. If it were me I would just give it back, he has nothing to gain from keeping it and that gear will always have the stigma of being stolen.

***I don't believe that this gear meets most states' legal definition of "stolen".*** So you are saying that merchandise purchased with a stolen credit card is not really stolen? And if it is later sold to someone else they can just keep it? Are you serious?

The card holder did not report the card stolen until after the charge had been made. Just imagine a whuffo getting hit with an unauthorized charge of over $5000 worth of skydiving gear. The gear was shipped after the charge was approved. Then the charges were reversed and the card holder was credited for the unauthorized charge. The dealer followed proper procedures. So the cardholder is out nothing, the credit card company is out nothing, the dealer loses the gear and is never paid, and the thief gets away with the gear. Now the thief sells it to someone else and it is discovered 4 years later when the cypres2 goes in for service. SSK already returned the stolen cypres to the dealer. Eric should man up and send the rest back to the rightful owner as well. It doesn't matter if he knew it was stolen or not, you can not keep stolen property regardless of how it came into your possession. It is just unbelieveable that some people on this thread are suggesting that he should just keep the stolen equipment. What is he going to do with it? Keep jumping it even though he knows it is stolen? Sell it to someone else who will then be in possession of stolen property? He needs to give it back, there is no other way.

Once I burn a copy for the dent I usually only keep the best 3 for myself; exit, freefall, and opening. Onward and Upward!

Hi Eric. I am familiar with the equipment, it belongs to a freind of mine who is the dealer. As a rigger he asked me to keep an eye out for it so anytime I got a smart reserve, nitron main, or cypres 2 I always checked the SN. This gear was listed on the USPA stolen gear list although I don't see it there now, also it was listed on the Skydive Orange website at one time because it was sold to a jumper in that area. The gear was paid for with a stolen credit card and it was shipped before the dealer realized it was stolen. I don't think the card was reported stolen until it was too late. The credit card company may have reimbersed the card holder but the dealer never got paid and he is out the gear. That equipment is most definetly stolen. That really sucks, I realize that you did not steal the gear but you bought it from someone who did. Just imagine how you would feel if it was your gear and you got ripped off for several thousand dollars. Sorry, but the right thing to do is to return it to the rightful owner. I guarantee you he wants to track down the thief and bring him to justice. Even if he gets it back he will take a huge loss on it. That gear was new when shipped but now several years later it has been jumped who knows how many times. The cypres goes down in value over time. If you bought it on ebay maybe you should see if they have some way of tracking down the seller. I do believe they have a security system to protect people who unknowingly buy stolen merchandise. Maybe file a claim if you used paypal? This story is a perfect example why all serial numbers should be checked anytime you buy used gear. On all components. Bummer dude, Do the right thing!

It was a hidden message that spelled out eat shit and die roger nelson It was a list of names of people who were supporting Zeke Lenn who was running for NW conference director and if you took the first letter out of each persons name it spelled out that message. Parachutist did not catch it until after publication. The ad was in response to an ad Roger paid for in a previous issue urging people to not vote for Zeke. The ad read "A vote for Zeke is a vote for a geek" Which started the "Geek Brothers" and soon after the "Geek Brothers Convention" annual boogie. Parachutist no longer allows board candidates to pay for campaign ads and I believe that incident was the catalyst for the policy. Onward and Upward!

A "STEARN" region? Typo, nothing more... Congrats Thomas! Onward and Upward!

Call Ralph, he has the largest inventory of used gear. No one else even comes close. Onward and Upward!

Bump.... Hey Pat, it looks to me like you did it all! Great jumping with you and have a great 09! Onward and Upward!

Bump.... Hey Max, I know you made the first goal, how did the rest go? Have a great 09 buddy! Onward and Upward!

>>>>Paper work won't be any different than now. Just more rigs affected. I think I said the same thing, you just said it differently. No worries, it is common to argue with people who agree with me. Onward and Upward!

Hi Mel, If I am not mistaken the battery requirement and service for AAD's should still take presidence over any changes in FAA repack cycles. I believe Dave agrees with this. The paperwork is what will get weird on this. Any rig without electronics should not be affected. (which is not many these days) Scott

Yes it is! Cheers! Onward and Upward!

Actually the voices say things like: "go faster, slow down, watch out for that guy, let go of my leg, wheres the friggin dropzone?, wow! cool sunset!" You know, stuff like that. Onward and Upward!

Lighten up dude, it was a joke I've had 8 reserve rides but the last one was over 2000 jumps ago. Modern gear seems to be a bit more reliable. "winners make excuses, losers make it happen"

I just listen to the voices in my head. What? you can't hear them too? Onward and Upward!

Q, Pack your own shit Jump bigger parachutes Problem solved Onward and Upward!

I don't see much change. In the northern climates most jumpers get a repack before safety day and then again mid to late summer. Most reserves I see are only repacked twice a year anyway. As far as price: Back in the 80's rounds were $35 and squares were $45. (because they were more "difficult") Now, here we are all these years later and I still charge only $50 for a reserve repack..... All Squares and all about the same (sorry, I don't do racers) So regardless of the FAA I think ALL repacks should be at least $75 Onward and Upward!

My dream would be for Stunts to start up again and make Eclipses (with a few improvements) Until then I will stick with Infinity. (Neither container mentioned in the poll but my two favorites) Onward and Upward!

40 pounds?

And build a fire to cook it! Onward and Upward!

Hi Mel, DeWolf made me two pocket sliders and they both have performed flawlessly. Nice, soft, on heading openings. What issues are you talking about? Onward and Upward!

Here you go.

I have a topmount HC3 and front mount stills (Canon XTI) on a Sonic. The nice thing about the Sonic is it is very light weight, stable in freefall, and cheap. No worries here... Onward and Upward!