birdynamnam

You understand the concept of marketing, right? According to manufacturers, of course every new product they make is "new ground" and totally different from everything else on the market . Fine - then lets just classify all suits in the same class, as nothing manufactorers makes make any difference. No need to discuss further in this topic and its all just tracking guys

Hi Juri. I cannot bend my legs, isnt that some syndrome of some sort

"Two very different suits" ? I would agree if the question had been to compare a Phantom to an Aura or Hunter. But Freak2 and Rafale are both big (not huge) suits with Acro capabilities, similar shape, tailwing length and backfly inlets. The Rafale is a tiny bit bigger, but I would disagree calling them "very different". From PF website: "A unique new model, exploring new ground with large surface wingsuit acrobatics." So Rafale is a "new concept" that is a large surface acro suit. Definately larger than the F2, so they are not in same class. Rafale is more in class with the JNite backflying thing from Tony. Interesting developments going on...

a suit from a manufactorer, flies in a specific way, specific for that suit. This is because the designers and testpilots made sure that their preferences is felt, when *one fly that suit. Many parameters... Not only leading edge, the whole wingprofile(s), design of booties, overall balance, air inlets, air locks, etc. Even the crossports inside makes a huge difference, its a science in itself. PF could make a suit that flies like a Squirrel, if they wanted to. But they don't. Same goes otherway around. On topic, Rafale is a bigger suit than the F2, so one would assume more glide from that. But it is true that Squirrel wants area as small as possible on any suit; less is more is a goood way of describing it. I also see Tony building mega huge suits, for backflying. Interesting trend..

Sounds legit. All I can say is that Squirrel HAS made some suits where the pull is quite "technical", and thus you can say that those suits where not build with safety as first priority in mind. It surprises me that people would say that regarding the F2 though - pull is absolutely easy and internal pressure is nothing like the Race suits

everyone to each's own I guess. I would not like to set parameters myself, but rather trust people at airtech or similar companies

Dunno about #BASE 349, but if the F2 that I and many others fly reguarly is very safe in the skydiving environment - also being one of the most sold in this category. Not being a BASE jumper myself, can you explain me why this particular suit has contributed to the #349 BASE fatality? I understand that there has been one in a C-Race suit, where the jumper was using less than optimal rig (was very short on him) and also using the stiff race leading edge foam that makes pulling harder, well as far as I understand - again not being part of the BASE community......

I suspect that Airtec have been capturing a lot of data from good and bad student jumps, and then based on that set specific parameters to the Student edition (or set mode) of Cypres. I think suggesting other use cases for it, than what it was ment for by the designers, is dangerous. Over here there are many wingsuiters using the WSC now. I have not yet made up my mind about it.

all of the above, but there is more to it. Going from a Swift2/3 as an example to the ATC, you must use a different deployment technique. Flaring the wingsuit to throttle the speed. It takes a little to dial that in, until that is in place, I see people having linetwists now and then :D In general when you upsize the wingsuit to the next class, you will very often also have to upsize the canopy (or go 7-cell even) and make sure you have open corners etc etc. Upsizing the wingsuit like this puts more requirements on your gear meaning it must be "more" wingsuit optimal than before your upsizing. There are quite many parameters that play in and when you change one of the parameters to the "worse" speaking of the possibility to get into linetwists, you will have to revisit all your gear choices. and also learn new techniques. But that is all part of wingsuit progression. PS Remember to keep your small suit, so that you can go fly with your new buddies that just got their FFC. They don't learn much from seeing you curled up in a bigsuit trying to stay with them

7-cell isn't a magic bullet, imo the Sabre2 at wingloads below 1.4 is much better than the Storm 7-cell at same wingload, having had both previously. Infact people here have been moving away from the Storm, it just spins up so easely. The canopies made specifically for wingsuiting are 7-cells, as they in general are better suited due to the lower aspect ratio making them less prone to spinning when linetwist occur. There are exceptions though as I wrote. On topic the Swift 3 is a very good suit for beginners. Not as forgiving as the Phantoms/Shadows, rather it is "more efficient", but it can be overcome by any beginner no problems

The Skyhook is to help people that has no real understanding on the concept of "going too low" and/or people who cutts away too low, two things you should not do in the first place. Yes there are always rare situations where a Skyhook indeed could be helpful, eg if you are flown intoby somebody on final in a canopy collision and you have to cutt very low. But thats another topic. If I where a freeflyer jumping freefly bigways, flying a tiny radical main, etc etc I would also have a Skyhook. But I am not. Being knocked out is always a risc in any freefall, some have spoken of the problem if you are unconcious in a bigsuit, falling slow, but that what you now have the Wingsuit Cypres for

Nobody can answer your question 100% really. It is each his own, make up your own mind. I am with Lyosha on this. In general I personally see no problems with Skyhook for smaller/intermediate suits, however with bigsuits due to the burble action on that which is quite significant, I will like to have a free extraction of my reserve PC and bridle, free from any knots tied, or any add on equipment. It just have to go out there. Also I never go low, as in never. I am not therefore the typical usecase for this add on equipment.

Skysnatch is fairly priced Its a complete set, bridle link pc. I use itand it works perfect Extraction force is not harder. Packvoll is not larger. Not sure why you write this.. Its merrit is stability- put it out in the wind and it stays out there and doesnt wouble at all. Thats basically it. Icon's "long" are great for WS. I have the Aurora, takes some getting used to :) But eventually I liked it

It's not about time, it's about glide. Time will increase as you improve your understanding of glide. Speed beeing desired over float absolutely. I think this is a great debate, and I always teach people to fly, to glide efficiently, as they progress. It makes for better pilots overall. So I prioritize speed always and teach people to do this. Wingsuits likes speed, they thrive. Makes the jumps fun. Flying on my back, you must prioritize speed always also, so to avoid the flock building flying with bent knees :) Kicking the Bee cube there. Let's fly fast and then get good "times!"

it is good to start early and to try to get great performance, while you also progress in 3D flying in parallel also. Learning the tricks to glide efficient. Comes in handy when flying with other folks - we should fly fast, not fall with style. After all this is what wingsuit'ing is about - getting that great glide isn't it?

well guys it is not really helpful to tell people that it is all about skills, gear doesn't matter. It all matters. skills is no 1. Gear is a very close no 2. It all matters. With your current wingsuit, your skillset, your gear as such you have "one combination" that will produce a result sort of consistantly mostly. When you change one of these parameters, suddently people find themselves having linetwists and what not. If the wingsuit was upsized or the new one just just flies much faster than the previous one, that can cause a change for the worse. Skills need to be adapted to this. Setting the gear up optimally can certanly make a positive difference also, foremost the canopy type its wingload and other gear parameters. Telling people otherwise is just stupid. This is very often experiencd by people progressing. We must understand that with the wingsuit, we deploy our canopy in a different environment that it was ment to and developed to function in. Optimizing certain gear aspects has a positive impact, however missing skills or just plain outright too much wingload you can never fix in this way.

It's not online, but here it is for your convenience... https://www.dropbox.com/s/6kex0zdkrl2ttbe/WINX%20MANUAL.docx?dl=0

first of all when you upsize wingsuit, you will need better gear allround. Lower wingload, maybe 7cell, open corners, semistowles, etc. You seem to do a flare (which is needed in this suit). At linestretch you immidiately reach for you risers. You also sit uneven in the harness, given your canopy no chance other than to spin up. So... Flare the suit, and when speed horiz and vert has been adjusted to deployment (this is what the flare does basically), you go back to fullflight position and then pull. You go to this position inorder to get clean airflow over the top of the wingsuit. Before speed goes up again, you throw the PC

Winx, yes it is fine for terminal use, but it has been developed for Wingsuiting in the skydiving environment, just saying... Snivel phase is very short but openings are still soft. Their website isn't too great to say the least haha :D Anyway all the information you ask for is however available in the Winx manual, wl charts etc

well used Sabre1's can work well (for a 9-cell) and they are cheap if you are on a tight budget. Personally I never liked the Sabre1's - the way they fly... As for the Storm for wingsuiting, unless wl is very low I would not go there at all - take the Sabre-1 instead. We have seen so many cutt's on Storm's here, pop, pop, pop. They tend to want to rotate/spin down when linetwists occur. Interestingly a few years ago the canopy was being pushed by PD as a "great wingsuit canopy". In my book it is at the very bottom of WS compatible canopies. I did a few hundred jumps on the Storm, and am glad it's gone. Itøs great for Tandem video folks though. Flying the Storm for Wingsuit jumps was too exciting at times. I do have a folder full of videos of people spinning, while cursing, yes, in their Storms :D As for the fun: The Winx has relatively soft front-risers, so swoops are a definately doable and it will keep on going btw, so no shortness on dives there - if you know to do it right. Flight characteristics are top notch and I find it outperforms all other semi ellipticals out there. Horizons and Epicene are not racecars for sure, they have been built for a different purpose, eh?

Wingload keep it below 1.4. THe canopies mentioned has been developed for Wingsuit flying and are all good choices. You miss the Pilot-7 in the list though. Personally I don't want to jump own have anymore canopies in low porosity material (f-111 etc). Material deteriorate quickly compared to ZP. So for me it is ZP. I jump the Winx150 @ 1.5 and love it. Roughly 300 jums so far, not a single linetwist. Winx and Pilot-7, I think these two are the top dogs, at least my preferred. If you want even lower wl on those, you can order them in hybrid materiels, like ZP on all topskin and low prorosity on the rest. That still makes them more high performance than the alternatives, Epicene and Horizon. Those just have small strips of ZP in certain areas. My choice is all ZP, with the Winx it works well. If you get a Winx, remember that the way they measure the canopy size is a bit different. E.g. a 150 is really 144. They document this in the manual. But other things play in to get rid of linetwists, besides a good deployment technique, lengt of bridle (8' or above), a fresh pilotchute, I prefer ZP and 30" actually a SkySnatch, D-bag semistowless, Your rig's main container with open corners, good packing technique. All parameters play in. As an example if you upsized your wingsuit, you now have different speed at deployments and larger burble trailing behind you, it will require lower wingsload, and all the tricks in the book as described above suddently, where you might previously have done well without.

According to Atair's manual of the Winx 150 is 143sqft, and as I wrote that is somewhat verified by seing them layed out on the ground, smaller than e.g. a Storm 150

+1 I am stoked with the Winx 150. Came from the Storm 150 (the lawn dart). Just one jump in a Pilot7 147, but based on that I much prefer the flight caracteristics of the Winx - that is - everything that is btw the opening and landing. Flarepower seems the same, very good. P7 opens hard and the Winx is surprisingly soft in comparison even at terminal speeds. Atair measure canopies a bit different so the Winx 150 is actually 143 sqft as an example, and the Storm and the p7 147 was visually also larger laying them out

could you pls post here the results of that?