New Sidemounted Freefall Camera

[PharmerPhil 0]

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Hmmm... $1700 was just my HC-5 + lense + spare battery... That didn't include the helmet so the price isn't that high

I am pretty sure he was talking about prices in the States where an HC-5, lens and battery would cost you well under half that.

[JSE 1]

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It's kinda a bitch to show the footage, focus the camera, preview in the plane, etc. It does not seem like a workhorse like other cameras in Sony's line.

Why do you say that? Why is it hard to show footage? Once you focus the camera does it not stay that way indefinitely? Why is it difficult to show in the plane? because of the way the box is set up? Does the camera feel somehow weak to you? I've never had the chance to see the camera or the box

[DSE 3]

hold one in your hand. It's pretty self-evident that this is built by a very different manufacturing line than the PC/HC/DV cams we're used to from Sony. There is a reason I haven't bought one. The encoder isn't anything to boast about, the quality of the lens is and it's made for the soccer mom to put in her purse. That's the target.
It's not a BAD cam like say...a DGX. But it's not the quality you're used to from Sony.
As far as debriefing and so forth, you have few fast options. The camera is designed to dump the footage to a 'puter, not to be used as a deck. The box, though it appears to be well-designed (and is for sure if it came thru Cookie), is still a hindrance, IMO. But it sure is lightweight.

[dugy 0]

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It's not a BAD cam like say...a DGX. But it's not the quality you're used to from Sony.

DSE: Are you referring in comparison to just the other HD models in Sony's current range, or across the board?
How would you rate the TG1 compared to the likes of the current HC52, or older PC series models?

[Squeak 17]

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It's not a BAD cam like say...a DGX. But it's not the quality you're used to from Sony.

DSE: Are you referring in comparison to just the other HD models in Sony's current range, or across the board?
How would you rate the TG1 compared to the likes of the current HC52, or older PC series models?

to late to worry about it now Dugy you have already bought it.
Bring it this weekend, and we'll compare it to a few of the other Cams at the DZ. my PC 105 and there's a couple of HD cams there too.

You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

[DSE 3]

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It's not a BAD cam like say...a DGX. But it's not the quality you're used to from Sony.

DSE: Are you referring in comparison to just the other HD models in Sony's current range, or across the board?
How would you rate the TG1 compared to the likes of the current HC52, or older PC series models?

Dugy, Just take care of it, and you should be alright. It's not made in the "normal" Sony channels. In fact, i don't believe Sony's factories built this camera at all. Opening it up, handling it, seeing the image; It just doesn't have "Sony" on it. A few others have felt the same thing/way, but at the end of the day, it's just an opinion. I'm sure that if its protected, it'll survive.

[dugy 0]

DSE: Cheers. But I was meaning by way of image quality.
That's intersting to know though!

Squeak: Yeah would be interesting to compare the difference models everyone had on the big TV...

I wouldn't expect the TG1 to match the image quality of a CX12.....but if a HC52 or some of the old bunky models at the DZ look better, that would be dissappointing.

[Squeak 17]

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DSE: Cheers. But I was meaning by way of image quality.
That's intersting to know though!

Squeak: Yeah would be interesting to compare the difference models everyone had on the big TV...

I wouldn't expect the TG1 to match the image quality of a CX12.....but if a HC52 or some of the old bunky models at the DZ look better, that would be dissappointing.

We'll do it this weekend, and screen the results in the bar, it should promote some good arguing over whos Cam is better

You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

[JSE 1]

thanks for the info DSE - i guess I'll hold off a little longer

[alge 0]

So, has anyone tried this out yet? I'd like to hear how the camera+cookie box works out for casual video, from someone who's not too biased.

(I'm considering this cam for inside freefly, filming students, etc., and maaybe filming tandem at a low-tandem-volume cessna dz.)

[DSE 3]

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So, has anyone tried this out yet? I'd like to hear how the camera+cookie box works out for casual video, from someone who's not too biased.

(I'm considering this cam for inside freefly, filming students, etc., and maaybe filming tandem at a low-tandem-volume cessna dz.)

"too biased?" Is that like "a little bit pregnant?"
I think it's a good camera that in a Cookie box, should do well. It's built very poorly, IMO. It's not made by Sony's standard line manufacturing, and I *believe* that it's made by a third party that Sony licensed.
All that said...Bomb420 has plenty of jumps on his. Ask him about how well it handled abuse.

[LoftyBanter 0]

Hi everyone ..
I have purchased this set up and have put together a paper on my experience to date .. thanks to Trunk from Get Hypoxic and Cookie from Cookie composites for their feedback and assistance in putting this together.

For freeflying and filming my friends - the experience is awesome - but the camera does have its quirks and may not be suitable for all skydiving applications.

Feedback / questions welcome.
Cheers
LB

[DSE 3]

Nicely done whitepaper.
Coupla things...post some full-rez footage of the best/worst of the cam. I don't have the fortune of having Cookie's setup, so can't really test it well. I did top mount one on an FTP. I wouldn't do that very many times.
Hold a CX or HC series, and the TG in your hand, you'll immediately understand my point.
Also bear in mind, the Cookie lens only resolves to about 300 lines, so it's not giving you the full benefit of the resolution the camera offers, and at the same time, doesn't expose some of the warts the camera has. In other words, the SD glass hides some things, which can be a good thing, IMO

[boomslang 0]

Here is a video of the HDR-TG1 with the cookie box and a 0.3x Liquid wide angle lens. The video quality is much better in the original HD format. The helmet shows on the side in this video, but it can easily be mounted so it isn't in view

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPgpWvW8Rac.

Cats land on their feet. Toast lands jellyside down. A cat glued to some jelly toast will hover in quantum indecision.

[alge 0]

> The video quality is much better in the original HD format.

Can you put the original on skydivingmovies.com or something? It's kinda hopeless to judge the quality from youtube. By the way, it looks like you should have de-interlaced it before uploading it to youtube. The interlacing artifacts are quite bad.

[boomslang 0]

I have a video of the jump as an AVI file, and it looks much better than the Youtube one. PM me your email address if you'd like a copy. The AVCHD is still better quality but this is all I can do for right now.

Cats land on their feet. Toast lands jellyside down. A cat glued to some jelly toast will hover in quantum indecision.

[bomb420 1]

Found out the downside to AVCHD this weekend. They happen to buffer the stream, compress it and then write it to the card. So what does this mean?

Say you decide to "swoop the pond" and instead toe pick and are now a human skipping stone supermanning across the water only to somehow submerge your relatively new TG1 in murky AZ stagnant 18inches of water. Waddling out of the water, you immediately pop out the battery, have someone hose you down, pop your reserve, take apart the camera, blow compress air into it, turn it on a presto it works... (edit: btw, did not see sony's names on the boards)

However, and I digress, all you have is your setup to the pond :-( No big splash, how lame is that???

IMHO, If your going to F'up and have your blackbox recording, might as well have it capture the carnage... Guess gone now are the days of seeing your helmet impact into the ground when it accidently falls off in freefall or those big spashes we all love to cringe at.... so sad.

And yes the TG1 still works, but then again, I immediately took out the battery, took it apart and got all the water out....

-Trunk

HYPOXIC

[dugy 0]

I finally got to have a play with the TG1 and cookie setup this weekend.

Thanks to kate aka loftybanter for the setup tips in her white paper.

Personally I think that the TG1 puts out a better quality image than most/all of Sony's predecessors. which are still being work jumped....
Compared against the current crop HD camera's, not AS good if you pixel peep side by side footage, but you wouldn't look at the TG1's footage and go "oh that is so Sanyo". It still looks great, and I can't imagine a punter complaining about the footage unless you left dirt or jizz on the lens.

But that's just my theory.

I've uploaded a file from the weekend.
A 245meg, 3.5min clip of me chasing a 4-way.
From exit to landing. Nothing flash, so no point downloading it unless you are really interested in seeing the quality.....of the footage.....not my noob flying.

It was recorded in SD, max quality, with a Cookie MVX setup, Liquid 0.5 lens, manual focus, no ringsight, on my 3rd jump trying to film....anything.

Here's the file, straight off the camera:
*REMOVED*

I can't imagine I'll leave it online for long as I expect my bandwidth for the month to get blown fairly soon....

Hopefully this is of use to people. :)

**Edit: Removed the full clip, it would only take 10ppl to blow my quota.
In this directory are 3 files, roughly 10sec's, filenames explanatory, to show how the camera went in that situation. Chopped up using the camera, not PC software.
http://www.sunburntphotography.com/Video/Plane.MPG
http://www.sunburntphotography.com/Video/Rel.MPG
http://www.sunburntphotography.com/Video/Landing.MPG

[mxcale 0]

hey guys just wanted to say i called the sony hotline people and talked to sumkind of customer service and confirmed that there is a new TG coming! he wouldnt say anything about it other than it should be out in "about a cpl months". he wouldnt say which month or if it will be 1080p or if it would come threaded :( oh well thats my info for the day. blue skies and safe dives this weekend to everybody :D

[LoftyBanter 0]

Just finished 40 jumps at Nox with the TG1 - image quality is far better when the image stabilisation is turned OFF - yep weird - but great result - no flutter at all - was jumping sit and atmo dives

[lewmonst 0]

Is there any clear answer as to whether the "Super Steady Shot" listed in the specs is EIS or OIS?

Why would you say it's less shaky with steady shot off? That's not a good sign of the functionality of steady shot.

With the focussing tricks, can you zoom in while camera is still in box with same manual focus setting? Like to video a student landing in the distance.

Thanks,
Karen

http://www.exitshot.com

[dragon2 0]

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Why would you say it's less shaky with steady shot off? That's not a good sign of the functionality of steady shot.

For freefall, that's pretty much the norm. Do you ever look at footage on a pc? If the camera in question had IS turned on you a) get shakier footage, the amount of shake varies from barely/not noticeable to unusable footage in extreme cases (OIS), and b) you can often see one or more black corners, like vignetting but these bounce around all the time. Very irritating for me when I edit daily videos/competition videos

ciel bleu,
Saskia

[LoftyBanter 0]

Re zooming in - I don't know - I have not tried this - I'll try this weekend and let you know. It would take about 10 seconds to get out of box to do landing footage. There is no sight on the camera except for the lcd screen - so if you are zooming in - i'd suggest taking it out of the box - so you can access the lcd screen.

Re type of stabilisation
From the paper ... I'll email it to you
From Dugy – Skysurfer.com.au Forum – Which camera to buy Sony TG1 24 Sep 08
Purchased TG1 and flying for 2 weeks

The CX7 and HC9 are optically stabilised.
The TG1 and the HC5 use electronic stabilisation.

Note - the is only a very small difference between when the stabilisation is turned on in freefall or not. It doesn't flutter when on - the footage is a slightly more jumpy. When on the ground if walking around and filming you need the stabilisation turned on.

cheers
Kate

[bomb420 1]

A "minor" modification to the box by dremeling out an opening for the LCD makes this whole setup so much more barable. Someone that has more free time than me may be able to make a quick door to the LCD so that it gets protected. In the chaos of skydiving, this may not be such a bad idea. I have not had a chance to jump it much since I had it cut out since I ruined my shoulder on this jump: Trunk goes Crash

I'll post pictures when I get around to it...

-Trunk

HYPOXIC

[lewmonst 0]

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Why would you say it's less shaky with steady shot off? That's not a good sign of the functionality of steady shot.

For freefall, that's pretty much the norm. Do you ever look at footage on a pc? If the camera in question had IS turned on you a) get shakier footage, the amount of shake varies from barely/not noticeable to unusable footage in extreme cases (OIS), and b) you can often see one or more black corners, like vignetting but these bounce around all the time. Very irritating for me when I edit daily videos/competition videos

Actually, yes, my good ole PC330 shoots awesome steady footage with IS on. I wonder why the EIS of the newer cameras isn't as good as it was on the old ones.

http://www.exitshot.com