Carving Questions

[Vertifly 0]

Hey, what's up all? Yeah, it is time. Swooping is going ok. It's been real. Getting more and more accurate over time. And with a very slow progression to the canopy I am flying, it is time to start experimenting with respect in the speed. I gotta start doing the carve thing. Bored with a regular approach?...maybe just a little. Just need some style in it or something.

Anyway, I want to learn to carve...and carve well. So far, coming in on my 1:9 loaded kat has been either high, or right on target...so I just wait till the breaks are ready to be used. So, I am going to start playing with my rears a lot more and stalling on them if possible. With the speed on approach this thing provides, it feels like the canopy can pull off a decent turn and stall on level.

There are mixed ideas on the forum about setting up a carve - when to start one, wind direction (come in crosswind and endup turning 90degrees into the wind), whether to apply rear riser pressure and release one side or to apply no pressure and start applying it to the inside one, etc. etc. etc.

So maybe those of you who are experienced in carving can provide some pointers on the approach. Theory, experience, how you got started on them, anything you got. If you don't want to be too informative due to the difficulty involved, that is cool. But perhaps you could explain that too - I sure anyone can get something out of any info you have on the move. Please advise.

[twnsnd 1]

Carving is gay.

Yeah!!!!! Got here first bitches!

-We are the Swoophaters. We have travelled back in time to hate on your swoops.-

[AggieDave 6]

Its not as complicated as you're making it out to be. A little harness will move you through a little carve. A little harness with a little rear input will really move you through a carve. A lot of harness with a lot of rear will stand your canopy on end. Just be smooth. (yes, you can use toggles, not just rears).

However agressive you do a carve you need to add input (a sort of flare) to keep the lift going and to keep yourself from sinking out of the turn onto the ground. To land just bring your wing back over your head and finish up normally.

The biggest issue with carving is where to do it and WHEN to do it. It can totally ruin everyone else's landing pattern if there's traffic, etc. It can hurt people if you carve into somone on the ground (or hook them with your canopy). And you can get a big laugh when you start your carve or are finishing your carve but you crash and burn.

edit: since you posted a pic, I'll post a pic.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[davelepka 4]

I think it's amistake to go into it with a plan with regards to what you're going to pull on and when. Each landing is different, and uses a different set of controls in different pattern.

Set up anyway you want, I don't think wind direction really matters. Just make sure you have outs straight ahead, and beyond the degree of carve you're planning. This way you can not carve at all, or carve more than you planned with no problem.

As for the actual carve, just turn your canopy whatever feels right for your landing, and don't hit the ground.

Make sure your on the deck, and flying straight and level before you start. The more speed you start with, the further over you can lean your canopy, and still get it back over your head.

Start off keeping your body close to the ground during your carve, so if it doesn't go well, you don't have alot of vertical speed when you hit. Work your way into swinging yourself way up in the air.

Other than that, just have fun with it.

[ntacfreefly 0]

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Make sure your on the deck, and flying straight and level before you start. The more speed you start with, the further over you can lean your canopy, and still get it back over your head.

Agreed. Being ON the deck before rolling the wing over is critical. I've hip checked and hurt myself, and seen others skip off the ground by getting 'excited' and starting the move too soon and then sinking into the dirt.

As for the actual move, it should be smooth (toggles or rears is fine). As mentioned in another post keeping enough toggle input on both toggles is important to pitch yourself through the carve.

It's a little hard to explain online (the physics of it all) but the sequence of the move is: Level out (critical), bank the wing over as much as you feel comfortable with (less in the beginning), then pitch the canopy through the move by pressing down on both toggles (or risers) like you're starting to flare.

edit: My preference is to start cross wind and carve into the wind. It makes the landing much more comfortable.

Disclaimer: Whenever possible it's best to practice these moves over a body of water. Especially as they get more and more aggressive.

Blues,
Ian

To the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders. ~ Lao-Tzu

It's all good, they're my brothers ~ Mariann Kramer

[dharma1976 0]

Quote

Carving is gay.

Yeah!!!!! Got here first bitches!

no its not its mooth

Dave

http://www.skyjunky.com

CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing.

[Spizzzarko 0]

Like the Texan said, you are making it a lot more complicated than it really is. Here's the gay hippy pot head free flyer response "Just feel the flow of the swopp and will yourself in the direction of the carve dude... Snoochie Bootchies, 420 dude... shaka skydive dude". That was gay.

Now here's the technical response. Think of carving as changing the direction of your canopys lift. In aviation a turn is defined as "The horizontal component of lift". Now, let's take this a step or two further. Your canopy has a finite amount of lift that it produces, and if you are having the canopy produce lift horizontally, then there is less verticle lift. The harder you carve the more your canopy is over on it's side. Now you are only producing vertical lift with a small amount of your wing. To prevent your self from flying into the ground you must produce more lift. This is accomplished by the flare. So with a good carve you may need to flare more than you normally would in straight and level flight. This impacts your distance.

Now how do you go about carving for really long distances? SPEED SPEED SPEEEEEEED! The faster you are going, the less input you need to give to achieve the desired results. We all know that input to your canopy weather it be front riser, rear riser, or toggle input creates drag and will eventually slow you down. Also the faster you are going the more distance you cover over the finite amount of time that you can keep your canopy aloft in the carve. Now that you have wrapped your mind around that juicey tidbit of knowledge, lets move on to technique.

There are multiple ways to carve. The Texan is demonstrating one method in his first picture. That is a harnes input. The harnes input creates the least amount of drag, but it is difficult to really get your canopy down to one side with it. So the harness carve is good for long sweeping carves of shallow bank. In his second picture, and in the picture of Wyatt Drews you see both of them well established into their flare stroke. They are maintaining their lift by adding flare. To initiate a harder carve you will need to give more input with your toggles or rear risers on the side of the direction that you want to carve when you are planning out. This will get your canopy down to one side and initiate your carve. The next thing we need to think about is how to maintain your carve rate, or how to change your carve rate. We all know that in a straight and level swoop the more flare we provide the more lift the canopy creates. With enough speed we can even get our canopies to climb, correct? This concept correlates the same way to a carve. Since our canopy is over on its side we now changing the direction of lift from the verticle component to the horizontal component. Does this sound familiar? To adjust for a tighter carve we must adjust our flare. The tighter the carve the more we must flare. It is just like making our canopy climb in a straight and level swoop. With a shallower carving course we do not need to give as much input and we can swing wider and go longer.

Now that you have a grasp of that concept let's move on to landing. We do not want to land with our wing out to our side. It is not very gracefull and can lead to injury as your wing will stop producing verticle lift at a higher airspeed in that configuration. So to prevent ourselves from looking gay by sliding in we need to get our canopy back up to level with the earths surface. This is accomplished by flaring more in the opposite direction that you started your carve in. So if you performed a left hand carve you will need to give right input to get your canopy over your head towards the end of your swoop.

All of this is cool, but you need to realize that doing all of this will require a lot of airspeed, so don't wait to long to carve after you have established straight and level flight in your swoop. The slower you are going the more input you will need, and you will not beable to get much of a carve out of your canopy. Remember that the amount of carve you do is proportional to the amount of time that your canopy is producing the horizontal component of lift.

So start of small and work your way up to the monster wing overs, and most importantly try not to look gay while you swoop. We all know it's not what you do, but how good you look while you do it. (mooth)

[Spizzzarko 0]

hip check ing is mooth, just like hockey.

[SkymonkeyONE 3]

Carving for dummies:

-get down on the deck carrying a lot of speed
-pull left string vigorously
-pull other string down level with left string for a while
-pull right string very vigorously while letting up a bit on left string
-stop and bow to crowd

[Vertifly 0]

great stuff dude!! that is close to what i was looking for anyway.

[Spizzzarko 0]

That what I said... I just used the Brian Germain technique of explaining it.

[Vertifly 0]

yeah count, but a lot of us have to go through school using the yellow books... cliff notes, for dummies, and some more interactive ones like majic marker highlighter fun man. vvv-one, too-oo-00, thr-rr-r-r-rreeeeee, forr-r-r-r-rr.....hahaha!!!

[swoopdoggy 0]

hay
its allwayz more easy for carving from cross against the wind, if you carve from cross to downwind you will need to run verry fast
thats what i think, or you can go downwind and carve it against the wind, it isnt that difficult, just make you got enough speed and lift
bubaaiz

live to fly, fly till death

[murps2000 86]

and most importantly try not to look gay while you swoop. We all know it's not what you do, but how good you look while you do it. (mooth) ***

You know, we've butted heads on these forums before, but I have decided that you are cool.