DB Cooper

[377 21]

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A ploygraph might settle this once and for all.

Nope - from what I understand, if a person believes they are telling the truth it will come across as such on a polygraph - even if they are totally delusional and spouting absolute rubbish - maybe 377 or AggieDave can comment, they probably have experience in this.

Personally I put VERY little weight in polygraphs. One Chinese kid (with no priors) who I represented flunked a polygraph on a burglary, not once but two times. The shame on his family arising out of his arrest made him react in a guilty way to questions. It evidenced shame rather than guilt. Fortunately I got the case dismissed. Evidence later proved that another person did the burglary.

I had a Folsom prisoner tell me that he beat a polygraph once by putting a thumbtack under his big toe in his shoe. When they were asking tha control questions to get a baseline, he jammed the tack hard causing pain and physical reaction. When they asked the crimes specific questions he backed off from the tack and the physiological readings that would otherwise have shown stress were unremarkable. Might be BS, but that was his story.

Even polygraph examiners will tell you their machines are NOT lie detectors. They simply measure physiological responses to questions/answers. It makes sense that a delusional person would not flunk a polygraph question if they believed their lie to be the truth, but I am not certain since I am no expert.

There are researchers now that claim PET scans of the brain can ferret out lies. We shall see...

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[georger 197]

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Since we know new information is available on the money that should be the focus.

1. We know he took money out to offer to Tina - where did he put that money - in his pockets, the belly pack or the package he prepared.

2. It has been said that he put money in the belly pack and one of the packs was missing. NO mention has been made of his putting that money back with the bundle.

3. The Bundle was strapped to him - but was there money in his pockets or a belly pack. This Bundle did he ride it down the way the man did in that picture with the barrel?

4. Is is possible for him to even have secured a bundle with what he had on him - there has been no mention of Duck Tape, but could that have been in the paper bag or did Cooper even think that far ahead.

5. There is an obscure notation that was reportably stated to by Tina, but I don't know which book or article this was in. She noted a green bag sticking out of the panels of his brief case - I believe this is something said to Bryant Brown and then publicized in the 2 part article he wrote for the Vegan.

So how many possiblities do we have for him to place the money on his body? Never put all your eggs in one basket.

Sort of like putting ones money in several different banks at this time - if one fails you still have money to pay the bills.

REPLY> Did you do all of Duane's thinking for him too?

[skyjack71 0]

The new evidence is related to 02-80 and we know that is when the money was found. I would think a conversation on the various ways the money left the plane (all that I mentioned has been in other articles, in this forum and are not my own ideas).

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

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377 mentioned:
There are researchers now that claim PET scans of the brain can ferret out lies. We shall see...

377

In India, they've already convicted a woman (Aditi Sharma) for murder based on a brain scan. Seems like a waste..good old american dogs and panties should be sufficient.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/09/15/asia/15brainscan.php

"This latest Indian attempt at getting past criminals' natural defenses begins with an electroencephalogram, or EEG, in which electrodes are placed on the head to measure electrical waves. The suspect sits in silence, eyes shut. An investigator reads aloud details of the crime — as prosecutors see it — and the resulting brain images are processed using software built in Bangalore."

"The Brain Electrical Oscillations Signature test, or BEOS, was developed by Champadi Raman Mukundan, an Indian neuroscientist who formerly ran the clinical psychology department of the National Institute of Mental Health and Neuro Sciences in Bangalore. His system builds on methods developed at American universities by other scientists, including Emanuel Donchin, Lawrence Farwell and J. Peter Rosenfeld."

[Orange1 0]

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The new evidence is related to 02-80 and we know that is when the money was found. I would think a conversation on the various ways the money left the plane (all that I mentioned has been in other articles, in this forum and are not my own ideas).

Jo, you are leaping to conclusions again. Ckret did not say the new info is related to the evidence found in Feb 1980; he said:

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Soon we will all have something to actually discuss, we are a few weeks away from what I hope will be the first new evidence/information since 02 of 1980.

(my bold added)

The new info may of course be related to the money, especially as we have been told there is further investigation into that going on; but you can NOT conclude that from what Ckret said. It may be something entirely different, for example, the first concrete piece of evidence they have found since they found the money. I guess we'll have to wait and see, but in the meantime better not to jump to conclusions, because it makes people wonder how many other times you have done so.

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[RB_Hammer 0]

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snip...
but in the meantime better not to jump to conclusions, because it makes people wonder how many other times you have done so.

LOL. I love this thread. I have seen enough jumps of that type to qualify some of the most prolific posters to this thread for D licenses.

"I'm not lost. I don't know where I'm going, but there's no sense in being late."
Mathew Quigley

[snowmman 3]

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snip...
but in the meantime better not to jump to conclusions, because it makes people wonder how many other times you have done so.

LOL. I love this thread. I have seen enough jumps of that type to qualify some of the most prolific posters to this thread for D licenses.

Hey Hammer! only Sluggo responds to praise...
Sure some of this stuff sounds out there, but look at what's in the press lately for comparison...
(two days ago) and tell me who's a nut?

Book says Coffelt was the chauffeur of Abe Lincoln's great-grandson, Robert Todd Lincoln Beckwith, and was Cooper (Jo's been bringing up Coffelt again recently)

Now Jo has said she's been pursued by a one-legged ex-chauffeur of Howard Hughes, but I think she just has some of the facts mixed up. We never told the one-legged guy to reveal himself to her.

The book was written by Charles Lachman, executive producer of "Inside Edition".

pictures of Lachman and Coffelt are at Inside Edition
but I've attached them too.
http://www.insideedition.com/news.aspx?storyID=2184

another review of the book:
http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/india-news/book-links-abraham-lincoln-to-a-hijacker_100103697.html

Book links Abraham Lincoln to a hijacker
October 5th, 2008 - 3:10 pm ICT by ANI -

New York, October 5 (ANI): D.B. Cooper, the notorious hijacker who parachuted from a Boeing 727 in 1971 with 200,000 dollars in cash and vanished without a trace, has ties to the family of Abraham Lincoln, according to a new book.

Charles Lachman, executive producer of “Inside Edition”, claims in The Last Lincolns: The Rise & Fall of a Great American Family that Cooper was actually Jack Coffelt, the chauffeur of Abe Lincoln’’s great-grandson, Robert Todd Lincoln Beckwith.

The author writes that Coffelt had set his eyes on the Lincoln fortune, which is why he charmed his way into Beckwith’’s life.

However, his failure to assume control of the Lincoln trust fund might have driven him to turn hijacker, the writer states.

Lachman writes that Coffelt was in Portland on the same day “Cooper” boarded the plane there, and was later seen sporting leg injuries that could have resulted form a rough parachute landing.

He claims that Coffelt, who died in 1975 at age 59, even made statements to a family friend that he was Cooper.

The book traces the checkered lives of Lincoln’’s descendants.

“(A) dysfunctional family of alcoholics, eccentrics and spoiled brats,” the New York Post quoted Lachman as saying. (ANI)

amazon has the book at
http://www.amazon.com/Last-Lincolns-Great-American-Family/dp/1402758901

(edit) Byron Brown told the story to Jack Sheehan at the Las Vegan magazine in 0ct/Nov 83. The mainstream press picked it up in Nov 83. Attached article. Also has another Coffelt photo that Byron showed at the time. It's funny that the Coffelt story is like Jo's Duane story: guy who spent a lot of time in jail...claimed to work with the CIA doing "grey" stuff. etc.

Interestingly, this '83 article has a quote from Himmelsbach describing the theory that Cooper wanted to jump as soon as possible from Seattle..which we've heard a bunch.

[skyjack71 0]

Wonder where they dug up that photo of Coffelt? The picture in the article that the son of James Brown wrote - shows a different Coffelt. What I have is of such bad quality there is no way to reproduce it to show to you.

Perhaps Snowmman would see if he can access the article - 2 parts written and published in The Los Vegan by Byron H. Brown.

There were some problems with the FBI regarding Coffelt per old conversations with Himmelsbach.

This story goes back to Joplin Missouri.--- and Coffelt was a Washington DC informant????? Yet, the man writing the new "book" states Coffelt was a taxi driver?

Much of the next few snippets are taken from Byron Brown's article and I have NEVER been able to find the author.

The area around Mt. Hood is the place I talked about in the beginning because of our stop in The Dalles where Duane disappeared for 5 hours or so.. and where Coffelt claimed he landed and lost the money.

Okay - have a little fun with this: Cooper double crosses Coffelt and goes back for the money where he hid it.---sounds like a double cross - right? Now go back and read what I just said - go find the article and do NOT take this statement out of context - it is said with Tongue in Cheek and for fun.

Other statements below will explain why Coffelt could NOT be Cooper.

Alias used by Coffelt - John Hardy, Jr and J.C. Ross (Duane's lady friend had the same last name, but was that coincidence or not)? She also hailed from the Kansas area - Coffelt Country. Sheer coincidence of course.

There is a picture taken of Coffelt in 1974 - a snapshot that shows he appeared to old to have been Cooper. Although a young photo for which no date is given shows fuller lower lip and puffy cheeks.

The problem: the 1974 photo is a man too old to be Cooper and much heavier. Coffelt would have been 55 yrs old in 1971 - according to what I have been told, but this article does not give his birthdate and no date on the younger Leavenworth pics.

There is even a picture of the Beacon light they claim was used. Now think there is no way they could have known the plane would go anywhere near Mt. Hood or Pine Hollow.

The author of the new book should have joined us on the forum and he would know the flight path said NO WAY Coffelt could be Cooper UNLESS there has been a BIG cover-up - which would have included the pilot and Co-pilot. We won't even go there.

It was claimed that Cooper carried an electronic beeper emitting a signal on a special radio frequency.

Also claims of a Jeep left in the DZ and that Coffelt took dynamite to it after he plunged it into raging rocky waters. Sorry I don't get that part.

Supposely the writer (Brown) found 12 yrs AFTER the crime tire tracks? It is also stated due to the storms Coffelt was forced to jump earlier than he planned to.

It goes on about the chutes - that the FBI had provided an inoperative chute (a sports type demo model) and talks about his repeated attempts to deploy the CHEST pack and then managed to get the back Pack open.

JUMPERS: Why would he try to open the chest pack first? I am not a jumper but I have learned a few things in this forum and by the way I have still never actually seen a chute up close..YET. Again the author of the new book should have checked his sources regarding Coffelt.

Some of this makes sense is that he landed miles from his DZ and he he lost the package. Claims an accomplice was waiting with the Beacon light at the cabin near the Lake.

Although seriously injured and lost he incinerated the chute with a magnesum compound.

It took 15 hrs (seriously injured)to make his way out of the canyon and an electronic transmitter was placed with the bag so his partner could find his body if he didn't make it. Coffelt tried to follow the signal on the bag, but due to his injuries followed the signal to the hidden jeep. (yet, he landed miles from his DZ?)

NOW - has has landed miles from his target and yet he finds his jeep?

The writer even claims to have found remenants of the chute?
7 yrs later? He even displays a fragment of a chute cord he found.

This is where I read about "the rubberized green bag...and it claims he tried to give Tina some money and said "Take it, Honey" -
"they don't pay you enough!""

He states Coffelt threw part of the money out the of the plane along with the briefcase. NOTE: this article is written AFTER the money is found. November 1983. This explains the money in the Columbia?

He states the money fine causes the FBI to take a second look at its flight calculations. How many times have they been re-calculated? State the money thrown it out over the Bonneville Dam...yet, the fight path doesn't indicate the plane was near Bonneville - from what we have obtained from the FBI. What do you guys think?

It is claimed "Coffelt felt Tina up - that she felt his loneliness and whispered consoling words to calm him. Coffelt then told Tina he had nothing to loose." (you would have to obtain the article - I felt some of it more intimate than what I will say in the forum).

One thing I will say regarding the above - if the woman I spoke to a few yrs ago was indeed Tina - the lonely and sad part do match...How much of this was in the media back in 71 and in the yrs afterward?

The article claims Tina in 1977 comfirmed one of the Obscure details - the green bag made of a glossy paper or plastic.

The writer claims the FBI did not reveal Cooper cutting up the chute on the plane - this does not match the FOIA. You guys like Snowmman need to go back and see if this true or not.

The writer claims Shaffner and an attorney ID's his pictures. Remember that Grey claimed Shaffner ID'd his photo of Christainsen.

He states Florence told him "she had been"WARNED" never to talk to anyone about he skyjacking.
He claims that she states " the FBI composite of Cooper was misleading and erroneous and that Cooper had fuller cheeks and his hairline was not nearly as receding as shown by the composites." Yet she ID'd Christainsen who definitely has a very receding hairline.

The article is misleading in that it does not Quote Florence as saying this and the Quote on the above paragraph is quoting the writer of the article.[

"The FBI official version of the crime was erroneous from the beginning". He states Florence told him "Cooper took off his street shoes and put on a pair of boots". Not one other accounting by Florence or Tina says anthing about this. If Florence witnessed this it had to be before she left the plane in Seattle. Obviously this writer was unaware of this fact.

According to the writer - Coffelt claimed he put on boots. The writer claims" the FBI did not question Florence thorougly". That "Cooper was the last person to board and that Florence actually fetched him from where he was peering out the terminal window and lead him to the entrance of the plane." Again quoting the author and not Florence.

He goes on to tell "Florence claimed Cooper was wearing an old fashion black suit - not brown" as the media tooted.

He is stated as saying "she told him Cooper wore white gloves". He also quotes her as identifying the photos he had of Coffelt as being Cooper. So was Christainsen.

Bear in mind in reading the article he says many things and makes it sound like she said this or that, I am sure she was not happy about this.

He mentions that Coffelt moved to Seattle with his wife after the crime...returning to the scene of the crime. Coffelt supposedly spoke of 3 co-conspirators with vested interest in the money.

Coffelt did not claim to be the head man. The main man was actually a pilot grounded because of heart trouble. A mysterious engineer who instructed
him about the 727 and then the Army man - the man on the ground.

He states the real booty was several million used bank notes to be loaded in Portland but a delivery was never made. His watching for the truck to make it's delivery in Portland is why he got distacted and almost got left behind. On to plan B.

Coffelt threaten his father. He refers to Kansas as Coffelt country - Remember the stories about Duane and Kansas?

Some of the investigation I have read in another article states that Brown lived in GA and that Coffelt also did for a period of time. There was a man with dark hair that picked Duane up on the weekends with a van (the old vans more of what we call a truck today) while he and his wife lived in the Sandy Springs location. She always told me she didn't know the man and he was never introduced to her. She was under the impression they went to Alabama ----this part of what she told me never made much sense to me - If Duane left me for only one weekend I sure as H--- would know where he was going and who with!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

another article from the same 11_23_83 press blitz.
(first attach)

last couple of paragraphs has quote from a lawyer of Coffelt's plus some more details on his prison/college etc. placed him in Portland?

Some interesting things: the claim about having a hard time with the back chute aligns with the rip mod and 28' pack causing hard pull.

But it seems like he's implying he switched to using the chest. Coffelt didn't seem to know that the chest was the faulty cooper chute, and that there was the D ring problem.

So just based on that description, Coffelt's story seems implausible.

Maybe at the time of the Coffelt thing, the FBI still hadn't released details on which chute was actually faulty?

No: I just checked that. In 1975 there are plenty of news articles saying the chest chute was the sewn one, (although is that year when Coffelt died?)

However I've found articles as soon as 11/26/71 saying it was the chest chute that was sewn. The second attached snippet is from 11/26/71 San Mateo Times page 1.

There are some interesting things about Coffelt's bio and the jump description. The idea of the Coffelt doing the jump with Duane on the ground is a good story but sounds like just a story.

Yeah Coffelt died at 59 in 1975. The '83 thing said the lawyer on the plane said the photo was a good match, but the lawyer has never been mentioned at getting a real good look at Cooper, so it's probably a bogus ID.

(edit) I got a good laugh at Jo worrying about all these little details that might not match in the story. I think she uses a different measuring stick for others! To be fair, the story is told thru 2 people. And Coffelt could have lied/dramatized about some parts (it's a told-in-prison story).

But the parachute part seems to kill the story, for me.

[skyjack71 0]

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Some interesting things: the claim about having a hard time with the back chute aligns with the rip mod and 28' pack causing hard pull.

But it seems like he's implying he switched to using the chest. Coffelt didn't seem to know that the chest was the faulty cooper chute, and that there was the D ring problem.

The article says he was having a hard time with the CHEST CHUTE.
Then he used the BACK chute. THAT MAKES NO SENSE AT ALL.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

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Some interesting things: the claim about having a hard time with the back chute aligns with the rip mod and 28' pack causing hard pull.

But it seems like he's implying he switched to using the chest. Coffelt didn't seem to know that the chest was the faulty cooper chute, and that there was the D ring problem.

The article says he was having a hard time with the CHEST CHUTE.
Then he used the BACK chute. THAT MAKES NO SENSE AT ALL.

the news articles I posted above say the opposite.
back, then chest.

If you've got something different, post it.

[skyjack71 0]

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There are some interesting things about Coffelt's bio and the jump description. The idea of the Coffelt doing the jump with Duane on the ground is a good story but sounds like just a story.

Read it again Snowmman that is not what I said.

This is what I said:
Okay - have a little fun with this: Cooper double crosses Coffelt and goes back for the money where he hid it.---sounds like a double cross - right? Now go back and read what I just said - go find the article and do NOT take this statement out of context - it is said with Tongue in Cheek and for fun.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

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There are some interesting things about Coffelt's bio and the jump description. The idea of the Coffelt doing the jump with Duane on the ground is a good story but sounds like just a story.

Read it again Snowmman that is not what I said.

This is what I said:
Okay - have a little fun with this: Cooper double crosses Coffelt and goes back for the money where he hid it.---sounds like a double cross - right? Now go back and read what I just said - go find the article and do NOT take this statement out of context - it is said with Tongue in Cheek and for fun.

And I said Larry King was Cooper. So what.
Go find it yourself. I try hard to be worse than you in crazy shit, but it's not possible.

[skyjack71 0]

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I got a good laugh at Jo worrying about all these little details that might not match in the story. I think she uses a different measuring stick for others! To be fair, the story is told thru 2 people. And Coffelt could have lied/dramatized about some parts (it's a told-in-prison story

I ain't worried about none that - I have fun sometime too. You know I have talked for Yrs. (ask Himmelsbach) about Coffelt. There might be a little more to this...what it Coffelt taught Duane how to jump - Coffelts' heath and age was against him. What if Cooper buried the money then went to the Jeep and to the hole and then told his companion that he lost it. This makes more sense than Coffelt making the jump.

Coffelt was not in prison after 1971 that I have knowledge of.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

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And I said Larry King was Cooper. So what.
Go find it yourself. I try hard to be worse than you in crazy shit, but it's not possible.

LOL It is 1:00 AM my time and that has me cracking up.

Not possible

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 197]

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The new evidence is related to 02-80 and we know that is when the money was found. I would think a conversation on the various ways the money left the plane (all that I mentioned has been in other articles, in this forum and are not my own ideas).

Jo, you are leaping to conclusions again. Ckret did not say the new info is related to the evidence found in Feb 1980; he said:

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Soon we will all have something to actually discuss, we are a few weeks away from what I hope will be the first new evidence/information since 02 of 1980.

(my bold added)

The new info may of course be related to the money, especially as we have been told there is further investigation into that going on; but you can NOT conclude that from what Ckret said. It may be something entirely different, for example, the first concrete piece of evidence they have found since they found the money. I guess we'll have to wait and see, but in the meantime better not to jump to conclusions, because it makes people wonder how many other times you have done so.

REPLY> Appreciate the post. As we have all learned,
every aspect of this matter is complex - no simple
easy answers at this late date 37 years later. It
takes honest effort. Most of us are adults and know
who and what are credible or not, by this point.

Thats all I have to say.

Georger

[skyjack71 0]

Jo said:

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Okay - have a little fun with this: Cooper double crosses Coffelt and goes back for the money where he hid it.---sounds like a double cross - right? Now go back and read what I just said - go find the article and do NOT take this statement out of context - it is said with Tongue in Cheek and for fun.

Snowmman said:

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And I said Larry King was Cooper. So what.
Go find it yourself. I try hard to be worse than you in crazy shit, but it's not possible.

Want to play Connect the Dots:

Guess what Snowmman? Your crazy shit just solved the mystery - maybe the money is in a vault in Lawrence, Kansas. Coffelt - AKA - Ross spent a lot of time in Lawrence and so did Duane. His wife a former Ross also did...infact that is where she was at the time of the crime - she was with family in Lawrence.

Now for the money - maybe they found some of it in a lock-box in Alaska. Pay Day.

1. The jumper - Cooper (that was Weber - Coffelt was too old...but gave him a refresher course. The jumper had to be an unknown with parachutes.) When Cooper had to jump early he saw the chance to screw the others by hiding it and saying he lost it.

2. The engineer - a man who knew about the workings of the Boeing 727. Well, I know a suspect for that one - someone who worked for Boeing in WA and I have mentioned his name in this forum...infact I have mention 3 individuals with that knowledge. One lived in Portland and was at one time considered a suspect.

3. The Army Man - the one waiting on the ground -an actual accomplice in the crime...that could be Coffelt or Gossett...I would guess Coffelt because Gossett had to keep a lower profile because of his work. He reforms and becomes a priest. Duane and Gossett decide to dump some money in the Columbia to make the FBI think Cooper died. They didn't know the bills would be 20's with recorded serials - so they can never spend them...not in 1979.
Guess that is why we stopped at the Mormon Church and he had mentioned earlier he was looking for someone. He excused himself and I thought he was going to the boys room.

4. A pilot who was "the ring leader".
This is a man grounded because of heart problem...now I don't know if any of the suspects where pilots. James Brown was a former pilot but I do not know if he was listed as a suspect. Supposedly Coffelt recruited him after the fact.
Sounds like they were trying to protect the son's image of his father.

Christiansen doesn't fit any of these characters.

Seems like whichever one of the guys stashed some of the money will be Cooper. But Coffelt and Brown - didn't see the money at all.
That's why the went looking for it first in a home in Sandy Spring which they burned to the ground and then back to OR/WA several times.

Strange - thought Duane divorces the love of his life and sends her to Ca. She does not go without funds and Duane spends money on the new wife. All in 1972. Musical chair - I mean wives.

By the way Snowmman:
Absolutely not related to Cooper:
This one legged man - lost his right leg to cancer (so he said)- was an old friend of Duane's. Was living around the lower part of Colorado in 1978 - a man slight of build with dark hair - he drove a yellow car - one that did not have the hump in the middle so he could drive using his left foot on the gas and brake pedal. He was at one time a chauffeur for Howard Hughes. He was younger than Duane.

I know you were making a joke, but the story about a one legged man is true - but has NOTHING to do with Cooper...just a friend of Duane's from the past ---someone Duane admired too much ---someone Duane would have taken a bullet for. Maybe he almost did.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

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The new info may of course be related to the money, especially as we have been told there is further investigation into that going on; but you can NOT conclude that from what Ckret said. It may be something entirely different, for example, the first concrete piece of evidence they have found since they found the money. I guess we'll have to wait and see, but in the meantime better not to jump to conclusions, because it makes people wonder how many other times you have done so.

You yourself have many times made remarks and suggested things regarding the money and and its conditions and surmised about flooding and how the money came to be at Tina's Bar..

Why is it that I should not explore possibllities?

I have been asked to keep an open-mind and when I do I am jumping to conclusion. Somethings are from having known Duane better than others and some are my exploring with the information that has been put out there to me over the yrs and information I find on my own.

This is called "BRAIN STORMING" and you have done your share of it along with others in the forum. Snowmman was brainstorming or whatever you call it and he provided a fact I did not know. A fact that made a link - how do you think old crimes are solved...there is usually little if any at all physical evidence.

The new facts that surface are then combined with the old facts - or there would be no need to investigate cold cases. How do you connect the dots - brainstorm or as you call it jump to conclusions.

You evaluate and re-evaluate information as you receive it - I do this in the forum. Call it thinking out-loud - but if one doesn't share these things with someone else, how does one evaluate it?

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[Orange1 0]

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The new info may of course be related to the money, especially as we have been told there is further investigation into that going on; but you can NOT conclude that from what Ckret said. It may be something entirely different, for example, the first concrete piece of evidence they have found since they found the money. I guess we'll have to wait and see, but in the meantime better not to jump to conclusions, because it makes people wonder how many other times you have done so.

You yourself have many times made remarks and suggested things regarding the money and and its conditions and surmised about flooding and how the money came to be at Tina's Bar..

Why is it that I should not explore possibllities?

I have been asked to keep an open-mind and when I do I am jumping to conclusion. Somethings are from having known Duane better than others and some are my exploring with the information that has been put out there to me over the yrs and information I find on my own.

This is called "BRAIN STORMING" and you have done your share of it along with others in the forum. Snowmman was brainstorming or whatever you call it and he provided a fact I did not know. A fact that made a link - how do you think old crimes are solved...there is usually little if any at all physical evidence.

The new facts that surface are then combined with the old facts - or there would be no need to investigate cold cases. How do you connect the dots - brainstorm or as you call it jump to conclusions.

You evaluate and re-evaluate information as you receive it - I do this in the forum. Call it thinking out-loud - but if one doesn't share these things with someone else, how does one evaluate it?

errr... Jo? When you get off your high horse, maybe you should actually read things in context. The original bit you quote (from me) is simply pointing out that you said that the new evidence is related to the money find, when Ckret actually said no such thing. This is simply reading and understanding. You can brainstorm all you like, but that doesn't change the fact that Ckret said "since" Feb 80 and not "related to" Feb 80. THAT is where you leaped to conclusions.

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[BuzzardNest 0]

Tina was more than "felt-up." There was some sort of sexual assualt that took place in the back of Flight #305 after it departed SeaTac. This is a little known secret that the FBI does not discuss with anyone. Why do you think Tina does not make public appearances? The lady was traumatized by Cooper, first getting sexually assualted, then thinking that she was about to go out the back end of the 727 with Cooper. The surviving crew does not talk about it either. No one talks to Tina. No one. Not even Jo.

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[georger 197]

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Tina was more than "felt-up." There was some sort of sexual assualt that took place in the back of Flight #305 after it departed SeaTac. This is a little known secret that the FBI does not discuss with anyone. Why do you think Tina does not make public appearances? The lady was traumatized by Cooper, first getting sexually assualted, then thinking that she was about to go out the back end of the 727 with Cooper. The surviving crew does not talk about it either. No one talks to Tina. No one. Not even Jo.

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and your evidence for this is?

I doubt any evidence will be presented. why present
evidence for something 'that needs no evidence'?
You make a claim, like a candidate made a claim
against Adler Planetarium two nights ago that was
dead wrong and a flasehood. Maybe the news will
dispense with your claim tomorrow ?

I see you just registered, just to post this?

Thius is not the first time a conjecture like yours has been made. Are you aware of that? Do you think this
is NEW?

If what you suggest occurred then please explain
the lack of medical care immediately upon landing at
Reno. Tina was readily available, participated in the
CBS interview, was interviewed by FBI etc all without
going to a hospital or medical care ...

Tina then was interviewed & debriefed further, still without any medical or psychological intervention
and this continued uninterupted for some time.

We all know the event affected Tina. It affected
Flo Schaffner and Hancock. Its affected everyone
including people whose names who will never know!

It may be that the reason Tina avoids publicity is
to avoid nuts?

By all accounts Tina resumed her life.

I will let you guess the rest...

You deserve no more.

Georger

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[skyjack71 0]

This child Tina needs to be left along and why I have been very steadfast in no divulging her were abouts to many creeps who wanted to exploite her I wiil always be greatful for reply and do believe what she said. It was short and sweet and simply = it wa her plea for me to let it go. She has tried to let it go and she wanted me to find peacel. The nun trainins is still very well seated in her mind.. She is doing for people who need help in hope that might help the memory go away.
I have cried for her - for her innocenscen - that he lef her as she was . She did say he was a sad and lonely man to me that day on the phone==no what he was thinking when he made the jump he wanted her to bless him.
I am sure she provided this with what ever she had one plus; more than anyone else because he changed his life - when he faltered this spunky young lady said what had to be said Tina did a very good job of it. For 14 year he was a good man and did good thing for those he took it on with him and in bady and sole.

He would buy a perfect dog and give it to the boy standing and lookins on the outside lookining in
To wall up the the chils and say the is your and enugh food to fee him a month.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[Erroll 49]

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For 14 year he was a good man and did good thing for those he took it on with him and in bady and sole.

He would buy a perfect dog and give it to the boy standing and lookins on the outside lookining in
To wall up the the chils and say the is your and enugh food to fee him a month.

Bedtime.

[skyjack71 0]

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This child Tina needs to be left along and why I have been very steadfast in not divulging her were abouts to the many creeps who wanted to exploite her. I wiil always be greatful for her reply and do believe what she said. It was short and sweet and simply, it was her plea for me to let it go. She has tried to let it go and she wanted me to find peacel. The nun's training is still very well seated in her mind.. She is doing for people who need help in hope this might help the memory go away.

I have cried for her - for her innocense - that he left her as she was . She did say he was a sad and lonely man to me that day on the phone and not what he was thinking when he made the jump, he was asking for her prayers.

I am sure she provided this to best of her abilities. What ever she said to him changed his life - when he faltered this spunky young lady said what had to be said Tina did a very good job of it. For 14 year he was a good man and he tried to give back to others what she gave him - hope / a chance to go straight.

Shopping at a pet show he would see a child wanting a certan puppy , A not so perfect dog for a not so perfect boy buy a perfect dog and give it to the boy standing and lookins on the outside lookining in.

He would walk up a child and say this is your dog and enough foof to feed him for a monty - call me if he need another home.

I had medication in me last night when I wrote that, but I hope all were able to see what I was trying to say. Leave Tina alone, don't bring this kind of thing up again and I hope the moderator will be kind enough to not let these kind of things be said about this upstanding woman who has done nothing but good in her life.

I knew I should not have tried to post a reply - I could not let some poster come into the forum and be allowed to make these kind of statements.

All of you know that I have steadfastly refuse to divulge her phone number or location - and I hope the forum moderator will not let an unknown poster come into this forum and destory the rest of her life. I would expect she is still quiet fragil in certain areas she should be commended for her reactionl She did and said the right thinks - When he died in 1995 - he held on to that angel , . Duane never forgot that cold windly nighr and the kindnest given to him by this young girl

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[Ckret 0]

wow!!!! what the hell happened here, train cars piled up, smoke filling the air.....

follow this link and you can here four DB Cooper experts blow hard for four hours, that should ease the pain. No assaults of any kind occurred on the plane, according to the witnesses.

http://www.stevenrinehart.com/pages/?section=2&page=9