DB Cooper

[CaretakerAl 0]

The testimony of another poster, Jo Weber who received the same information from another source.

[377 21]

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Rick,

I am now going to join the quest of a few of the other jumpers that are left reading this forum have pleaded. I think he has leardned his lesson. In reading young Coopers accusation towards Snowman, I am asking you to give pardon and let him back. Georger should only have a few days left, and he should be able to post. This place needs some real talent again. I think the majority of the people who were here before Snow was sent to time out have asked for him to be brought back. Come on Quade ol' boy even Jim Morrison was pardoned.

I support this as well! Snowmans skepticism is a valuable asset to the DB Cooper case as a whole!
We should always welcome any potential source of information regarding this case, obviously moderation is needed in some instances but as for, Snowman, I agree that He should be given a chance to participate in the conversation and stay within the forum rules again. Skeptics keep us honest, and in my personal experience can help bring out otherwise discounted or unnoticed facts which may be the key to solving this case.
I will point out that I have not made an accusation against snowman, only against a film clip He uploaded here. I don't know who edited it in this misleading manner.

I join the request. Snowmman may "misbehave" again and he may not. If he does we know the drill.

One thing that few will dispute is that he will enrich the discussion here immensely. He is a unique asset to the forum and the risk of letting him back on is greatly out weighed by the rewards which come from his participation.

Come on Quade, we are in dire need of substance here and Snow has a ton of it. Please reconsider the lifetime ban and give determinate sentences that are approrpriate for the forum crime committed.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[JamieCooper 0]

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The testimony of another poster, Jo Weber who received the same information from another source.

testimony saying what specifically?
are you here to weigh in as to the validity of her claims?

[CaretakerAl 0]

Absolutely not. Much of what Jo has said is void of what I experienced first-hand. A lot of what she has said is very similar, which is understandable given the time span and the nature of one's memory even over a short span. I wrote things down many years ago, and memory does not affect the written word. The portion in question is extremely similar and sufficient for me to fully believe it for fact.

[JamieCooper 0]

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Absolutely not. Much of what Jo has said is void of what I experienced first-hand. A lot of what she has said is very similar, which is understandable given the time span and the nature of one's memory even over a short span. I wrote things down many years ago, and memory does not affect the written word. The portion in question is extremely similar and sufficient for me to fully believe it for fact.

which is?
what are you claiming? that a milkcan was used based on Jo's testimony and that of an anonymous source that you logged in the past?

[377 21]

Here is your next "human response" Al:

Your wrote:

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He buried the money in a can in a spot he thought would be easy to find, but when he returned much later, the objects he used for identifiers were gone.

Why would anyone wait so long ("much later") to retrieve the money? The search would have stopped after a week or two. If you leave the money buried for a long time the risk of loss increases and you dont get to spend what you took such a huge risk to obtain.

If it was Duane who allegedly buried and then lost the loot, why would his cohorts believe him? The guy is a known thief, liar and con man.

As for the combat boots, why conceal them at all? Nobody would be denied boarding for wearing boots. The business attire wasnt needed to pull the crime off successfully.

What happened to the rig?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Robert99 38]

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Your story is just another fairey tale which continues to hinder real progress in solving the Cooper matter.

Sir: You are awfully quick to light a match. Perhaps you should see what is in the barn before you burn the barn down. Or do you have an agenda? I am giving you what was provided to me by my supervisor. I was not there, and did not hand him the shovel, if there even was a shovel. You do not have to have a shovel to dig a hole.

Al, I do have an agenda and that agenda is to resolve the Cooper hijacking. What's yours?

Do you know how much paper money can be stuffed into a milk can? What is the volume of a milk can?

You statements seem to imply that you are, or used to be, a member of a law enforcement agency. If you have any qualifications for evaluating information from your supervisor or anyone else concerning the Cooper hijacking, please list them.

I do have a low tolerance for nonsense and will gladly burn down the "barn", or whatever, if it is baloney. Beer talk is cheap and readily available, but facts are harder to come by.

Robert Nicholson

[CaretakerAl 0]

I do not have dates for the return. Jo said she went with him when he couldn't find the spot. I do not know if that was his first attempt to recover the money. You are correct. He was a thief and could have pulled a fast one, but Jo never saw any signs of any money, so I think it is fair to conclude Duane Weber never got the remaining $160~K. KC probably dug it up.

He was instructed to dress like a BYU student on Thanksgiving break, along with the BYU medallion he dropped, to blame it on "The Boys." They didn't wear combat boots to class back then. What is a 'rig'?

[smokin99 0]

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...his clip was misleadingly edited to support this "Thailand theory". download it yourself and then download the original unedited film from the Govt.website and compare.
extract the audio and compare it in a audio editing program, the "Thailand" part is louder and obviously added"

I'm objective about all claims but I have watched the entire film from the gov site and the air america site. I just don't hear what you're saying with my ears and I'm not gonna download it to check db levels because.......
My problem with this is... Why would someone bother to edit without taking out the Japan caption? While they were showing tests the narrator was talking about where airdrop flights were being made.. plus I think a link was included on the youtube page to the full length video.

Just saying...the entire film was a long one - about the mission and various activities of Air America during the Vietnam era. The airdrops was a small part of the story and that small part was snipped out and linked here to show that yes, indeed, these planes were being used in that era by Air America /other contracts for air drops, and yes, the rear door was opened in flight and used. To me, the particular Asian locale wasn't as important as the fact that this snippet proved that opening the rear door and parachuting something from it in flight had been done before and people in that arena were privy to the info - info that the airline and other players on the Norjack scene weren't aware of at the time.

Which leads me to the final problem I have ....... if I'm not mistaken, wasn't Snowmman one of the posters who was initially debunking the theory of 727s being used this way during Vietnam? Why would he purposefully edit a video to prove himself wrong?

With all respect, I really think you're barking up the wrong tree on this one... or as my dad would say....this dog don't hunt.....but that's just me.

but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

[quade 3]

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What is the volume of a milk can?

When CaretakerAl first said "can" I was thinking the exact same thing. When he changed his story to "milk can" it became more plausible. Milk cans typically come in three sizes; 5, 8 and 10 gallon. I believe a 5 gallon milk can would be sufficient to hold the entire $200,000, all of which -could- fit into a cube a little less than a gallon of milk depending on the condition of the bills. The paper itself still weighs in at roughly 22 pounds no matter what.

That said, it's still all here-say on roughly the same level as Jo's story and doesn't prove a damn thing.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[quade 3]

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What is a 'rig'?

What is a whuffo? Wha' fo you askin' a question like that?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[JamieCooper 0]

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...his clip was misleadingly edited to support this "Thailand theory". download it yourself and then download the original unedited film from the Govt.website and compare.
extract the audio and compare it in a audio editing program, the "Thailand" part is louder and obviously added"

I'm objective about all claims but I have watched the entire film from the gov site and the air america site. I just don't hear what you're saying with my ears and I'm not gonna download it to check db levels because.......
My problem with this is... Why would someone bother to edit without taking out the Japan caption? While they were showing tests the narrator was talking about where airdrop flights were being made.. plus I think a link was included on the youtube page to the full length video.

Which leads me to the final problem I have ....... if I'm not mistaken, wasn't Snowmman one of the posters who was initially debunking the theory of 727s being used this way during Vietnam? Why would he purposefully edit a video to prove himself wrong?

ok while I encourage you to download the full uncut Govt. film from their verified website.

you can compare these 2 much smaller clips
the first is the same as the one uploaded here by snowman and how I first became aware of the film in the first place.
again I'll point out I'm not saying snowman edited it.
only that it was edited to include audio from another segment about Thailand.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrqdmXxBZjI
you will notice towards the end a narrator says "We are here in Thailand..."
this was taken from a different portion of the film,
the tests in this clip are in Japan.
but the audio had led some to think it was a slip up of some sort, revealing they were in Thailand. but the reality is, someone deliberately added the audio to support that theory.

the following is the same clip but I edited it to remove the misleading audio at the end.
perhaps this is why you didn't hear what I was talking about?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjJPNx72JBc

in summery
someone edited the clip to support a "Thailand theory"
I don't know who.
I first became aware of this film from DZ.com
I saw it on Snowman's profile, along with 2 flight schedules from 1971. He also alluded to having some $20's from the DB Cooper case. I don't know what the point of any of it is, maybe he's going to claim He's DB Cooper at some point?
I have no way of knowing his aims.
Snoman and I stopped communicating when I refused to share a newspaper article with him, that places my Uncle in Japan, near Tokyo, working with military Aircraft's during the filming of "Flying men, Flying Machines".

[CaretakerAl 0]

Al, I do have an agenda and that agenda is to resolve the Cooper hijacking. What's yours?

Do you know how much paper money can be stuffed into a milk can? What is the volume of a milk can?

My agenda is to present the truth of what happened during Project Norjack. Duane was the hijacker, and he is deceased. McCoy was a hijacker and he is also deceased. Evidence has been destroyed, tampered with and swapped out, so that nothing of value is left, except my testimony that I suffered dearly for. Our country should not be based on lies. If you can tell me why we must lie, I will be still.

Milk can? I did not see the can, but I think milk cans are 5 gallons, there may be larger ones. Five gallons is 1344 cubic inches. I know cream can are smaller, what? Two gallons...too small?

[377 21]

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You are correct. He was a thief and could have pulled a fast one, but Jo never saw any signs of any money,

I think Jo said he bought a couple of new cars right after the hijacking and implied that it was a cash purchase.

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What is a 'rig'?

A "rig" is a parachute harness, container and canopy, what Cooper wore when he exited. Where is it? Why hasn't it been found if it was buried in a flood area? An open canopy with its numerous suspension lines would snag on stuff big time.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[smokin99 0]

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He was instructed to dress like a BYU student on Thanksgiving break, along with the BYU medallion he dropped, to blame it on "The Boys." They didn't wear combat boots to class back then.

Then wouldn't it seem like the operators would have recruited someone who looked more in line with that generalized age group? Tongue in cheek alert....Maybe someone around Jamie's dad's age
As opposed to Duane's age of approx 46? You've got to admit that in pictures of Duane in that time frame he hardly looked like your idea of a classic college student.

but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

[377 21]

Al, most think the FBI has some evidence from the plane that they have not disclosed to the public and use to weed out wannabes.

What is it?

Agree with 99 that Duane was hardly your model for a BYU student lookalike when in his forties. Also you havent answered my question as to why anyone would pick an inexperienced person to make the jump. Makes no sense to me. A brief training course wouldnt accomplish much other than to teach how to pull the ripcord and how to land. An experienced smoke jumper or paratrooper would bring a LOT more to the party.

So Duane who was a thief, a con artist, had never jumped (prior to your alleged Project Norjack training) and not in the best of health was picked to be the most important cog in the Norjack machine, to jump from a jet at night and be trusted with a huge amount of cash?

Please explain the hiring choice. Doesnt look like any Mensa guys were involved.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[CaretakerAl 0]

To me Duane looked closer to the picture of him smiling which was a much earlier picture. I never would have guessed him to be 45, he looked much younger to me until he bent down to clip some grass and I got a different view of his face, then the age showed more. The stews apparently pegged him at 45 though. Once you saw that smiling face you would never forget him. Amazing smile! That is what I remember most about his appearance. He also had a "jailhouse tan."

[CaretakerAl 0]

I used to think it was the BYU medallion, but Mac said he got that back, so that can't be it. Carr says that what he has on his desk is tie clip, but I know that wasn't on the plane. So, you got me by the short hairs. Duane used the "X" marked rig, so the other one, less chords would be there, probably his street shoes, the narrow black BYU tie, the empty paper bag probably, some painted red wooden dowels and a wad of wire. Any of the above could also have gone out. That should be it.

[377 21]

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What is the volume of a milk can?

When CaretakerAl first said "can" I was thinking the exact same thing. When he changed his story to "milk can" it became more plausible. Milk cans typically come in three sizes; 5, 8 and 10 gallon. I believe a 5 gallon milk can would be sufficient to hold the entire $200,000, all of which -could- fit into a cube a little less than a gallon of milk depending on the condition of the bills. The paper itself still weighs in at roughly 22 pounds no matter what.

That said, it's still all here-say on roughly the same level as Jo's story and doesn't prove a damn thing.

You from a dairy farm Quade? Sounds like you know your container volumes cold.

Would a milk pail (with a secure top) be just laying around to be found and used? Was this a dairy farming area?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[CaretakerAl 0]

Duane was not picked for his look-alike characteristics to a BYU student, the objective was to throw it back at the FBI. BYU students... FBI...The Boys.

[377 21]

Al wrote:

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some painted red wooden dowels

There goes Gosset's road flare fetish.

A government planned hijack would have used fake dynamite that looked more realistic dont you think? From what I have read the sticks are not red. The red description was a tip off to law enforcement that the bomb was fake.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[quade 3]

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You from a dairy farm Quade?

It doesn't take a member of Mensa to Google stuff.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[JamieCooper 0]

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You from a dairy farm Quade?

It doesn't take a member of Mensa to Google stuff.

CaretakerAl also uses the name Bob on fb.
he's from Mn. which has a huge dairy farm industry.
you may recall Blevins attempting to connect me with Bob prior to my posting here. saying he thought we were related in an attempt to discredit before I even made a post.

please Al/Bob or whoever, just shell out your theory omitting any incriminating names you feel you need to.
so far you've provided something about a milkcan and some Govt. conspiracy theory against themselves? and attempted to substantiate some of Jo's claims.

[CaretakerAl 0]

The entire program was based on what would happen according to the rules and regulations. The rule stated, "If it looks like it could be a bomb, you must assume that it is a bomb." The instructor specified red paint on wooden dowels with a wad of wire. I was not on the plane. If the instructions were followed, it was red wooden dowels.

[377 21]

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Duane was not picked for his look-alike characteristics to a BYU student, the objective was to throw it back at the FBI. BYU students... FBI...The Boys.

I dont get it Al. Please translate into something that requires no prior knowledge of stuff like who "The Boys" are. How did Duane's looks/appearance throw anything back at BYU students? Who are the Boys?

You have yet to answer my question about Duane being such an improbable choice as the key player in such a highly demanding project.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.