Shark 0 #1 April 21, 2003 Has anybody had or witnessed a horseshoe mal? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrightskyguy 1 #2 April 21, 2003 The very first student I ever put out of a plane many years ago had one. She was doing a ten second delay and rolled onto her back at pull time. she trapped her spring loaded pilot chute under her arm and had a good one. She got rid of it and had an uneventful reserve deployment and landing. She wasn't fazed at all by the whole ordeal and wanted to go right back up, I however, was pretty shaken up and had her sit down for awhile. She continued with her training and became a pretty good skydiver. She almost ran me out of the instuctor ranks before I even got going good. Thanks alot Tara. John Wright John Wright World's most beloved skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
councilman24 36 #3 April 21, 2003 Sure. They're not particularly rare. Especially in the early days of throw outs. Worst one was Richmond about 1990 or so. A friend twisted a leg strap and was towing her PC. Reached back and pulled her main pin by hand. Created a horseshoe with the PC towing. She was spinning pretty good. She fired her round reserve at about 400'. It snaked through and opened. She was still adding line twists from the spin when she landed. Not hurt. Borrowed a rig and went up and jumped again in a couple of hours.I'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #4 April 21, 2003 Yes, I have seen a couple of horse shoe type malfunctions. The first was a static-line student - back when T-10s and sleeves were in fashion. She rolled on exit and grabbed the (full) sleeve. I don't remember whether she pulled the reserve or the FXC 8000, but I vaguely remember the FXC. Lesson learned, don't use static-line systems so long that students have time to roll over and grab things. The second horse shoe I saw was over my own head. I will freely admit that I was caused by my own packing error. I had just bought a shiny new Cruislite and was really loving how much easier it was to close the container. I knew that my closing loop was too long, but I hesitated on replacing it. Big mistake. On exit the guy behind me bumped my main pin loose. I immediately felt my main container go slack. My first reaction was to toss my main pilotchute. Unfortunately I was a bit slow on the toss because the deployment bag had already tumbled through the lines once. So there I was at 8,000 feet with a bag in tow. Since I did not want to lose my shiny new canopy, I dragged it down to 3,000 feet before cutting away and dumping my round reserve. My Dad and I and another sport jumper the rest of the afternoon searching for my emerald green pilotchute and emerald green d-bag among some young trees down by the river, in the sprintime. Eventually the other jumper found my d-bag hanging in a tree. Few! Oh and that was my first "save" as a recently certified rigger. Lesson learned: when your closing loop is loose, tighten it before your next jump. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,434 #5 April 21, 2003 I had a sort of bizarre momentary horseshoe with a student once. I was main side on an AFF, and I stayed with him while he pulled. As soon as he pulled I turned to track. I got about 5 feet away and his PC made a right turn, headed towards me, and landed on my back (I was at the same level as he was at this point.) It bounced there for a second before it finally cleared and opened normally. I wouldn't have believed it if we hadn't had video on that AFF (a Level I.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weid14 0 #6 April 21, 2003 QuoteHas anybody had or witnessed a horseshoe mal? a freind of mine had one... it's all on video, pretty cool (since everthing turned out OK). the video guy actaully flew down to her and deployed her BOC (pin got knocked out on exit for a 20 way or something similar) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikeat10500 9 #7 April 22, 2003 Quote The very first student I ever put out of a plane many years ago had one. She was doing a ten second delay and rolled onto her back at pull time. she trapped her spring loaded pilot chute under her arm and had a good one. She got rid of it and had an uneventful reserve deployment and landing. She wasn't fazed at all by the whole ordeal and wanted to go right back up, I however, was pretty shaken up and had her sit down for awhile. She continued with her training and became a pretty good skydiver. She almost ran me out of the instuctor ranks before I even got going good. Thanks alot Tara. John Wright Dispatching student jumpers on short delays is about the most scary thing I've ever done in this sport. " and they pay you for it!" More fear for your skydiving dollar. ...mike----------------------------------- Mike Wheadon B-3715,HEMP#1 Higher Expectations for Modern Parachutists. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #8 April 22, 2003 I'm afraid so. Some how the Bridle became wrapped around his foot. He spent the rest of his life trying to take his shoe off.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikeat10500 9 #9 April 22, 2003 What would have been the outcome of this story if her reserve was square? Quote ... She fired her round reserve at about 400'. It snaked through and opened. She was still adding line twists from the spin when she landed. Not hurt. Borrowed a rig and went up and jumped again in a couple of hours. ----------------------------------- Mike Wheadon B-3715,HEMP#1 Higher Expectations for Modern Parachutists. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
councilman24 36 #10 April 22, 2003 Up for grabs. When I saw her round come out I didn't think it would open in time. I think a square with it's free bag probably would have had as much chance to open, which wasn't much. It used to be routine for jumpers to recommend pulling the pin by hand for a PC in tow. But just because of the possibility described, I never did. We even had one guy tell people to roll over on their back, PULL in the PC, roll back, and then fire the reserve. Obviously he never tried this or he'd wouldn't have been around to suggest it.I'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikeat10500 9 #11 April 22, 2003 Quote Up for grabs. When I saw her round come out I didn't think it would open in time. I think a square with it's free bag probably would have had as much chance to open, which wasn't much. MORE...I think the square w/free bag has a better chance of opening, but my concern was the bad line twists on landing! ...mike----------------------------------- Mike Wheadon B-3715,HEMP#1 Higher Expectations for Modern Parachutists. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auryn 0 #12 April 23, 2003 A really good friend of mine had one quite early in his skydiving career.. its still unknown exactly how it happened, but immediately on exit out of a king air during a boogie his bag came out of the container w/ the PC still in the pocket.. he threw out the pilotchute, had a bag lock, cut it away pretty high and had a good reserve deployment. the freakiest part is, the bag went through the windshield of a car doing 55 miles an hour down the highway.. no one was hurt in the car (thank god) the USPA liability insurance covered the damage. Blue Ones ! Bryan Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonto 1 #13 April 24, 2003 Yeah. A couple of simple one's years back with big gear and worn velcro causing out of sequence prem deployments. A lot of people moved to pull out after that, and one on an unstable pull on a throwout, but the drag cleared it after she cut away. tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JeffGordon 0 #14 April 24, 2003 I had one on jump 119. It was a body position issue. I threw the pilot chute and it wrapped around my foot. Some how the bag cleared the container but the last two line stows didn't release. The funny thing about this is that over the previous few months, there had been a rash of horseshoe malfunctions leading to the deaths of three skydivers, two of them very experienced. A more experienced jumper had told me to pull the cutaway handle then pull the three ring assembly away from your shoulders to turn the horseshoe into a streamer. I pulled the cutaway handle and then made some effort to release my three rings. I was getting close to 1000 feet and pulled the reserve handle. I had a hell of a lot of line twists on my reserve. I guess the reserve was bumping against the main d bag while deploying. Finally got the reserve line twists out about 50 feet and landed next to a runway as a jet was taking off. The pilot chute was still wrapped around my feet when I landed so i PLFed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shark 0 #15 April 25, 2003 Jeff, Sounds like a pretty gnarly experience!Glad you made it out okay. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dterrick 0 #16 May 20, 2003 Hi Mark: You ask about horseshoes? I've got a very vivid description of the 'body entanglement' type from this weekend. I'll skip the background of the jump for now except to say that it was a hop n pop from a Cessna, following a FJC student with a jumpmaster still resident on the wing (I scared him too!) I left slightly unstable (not square to the relative wind) and it turned into a slow frontloop that took about 5 seconds. The FL caught me by surprise (thought I had legs in enough) but I thought I'd stabilized enough to toss after the first revolution. I must have either still been frontlooping or headlow on the slide because a nanosecond after I tossed something threw me onto my right side and pulled me further headdown Yup... p/c trailing from my left leg, wrapped around my shoe!! IMMEDIATE reaction was a ccw kick - almost like the frogkick I vaguely remember from the breast-stroke swimming and then BAM!! I was legs high, folded in 2 under line twists at 2k... hands on my handles. Kicked out of the twists easily, checked my airspace to find the student well above me and upwind, did my control checks, and flew home VERY quietly. The cute skydiver-ette landed short on final (the winds were a bit stronger than anticipated) and I ran to help her collapse her canopy. "How did you beat me down" she asked - I answered "I fly a smaller faster canopy and I fly it like I stole it" because telling the truth would have NOT been a good PR move ("uh, I fucked up bad and ....") In 138 jumps I can't remember EVER deploying unstable ... until now. I've dumped fast, in a track, low (once) after a missed handle in freezing weather, chopped a stuck slider/snivel (student, jump #20) but never unstable. Case o beer ... and after THAT experience I drank a fair part of it myself Pull! Pull Stable! Pull at altitude! Dave Life is very short and there's no time for fussing and fighting my friend (Lennon/McCartney) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skylark 0 #17 May 22, 2003 More accronyms? It's getting worse. Why not simply write things out in full? That way, everyone can read and enjoy these posts. What are: FJC FL CCW "Into the dangerous world I leapt..." William Blake, Songs of Experience Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #18 May 22, 2003 FJC = First Jump Course FL = Front Loop CCW = No F***ing clueMy grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masher 1 #19 May 22, 2003 CCW - typo? perhaps 'cow'?-- Arching is overrated - Marlies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eWave 0 #20 May 22, 2003 CCW = Counter Clock-Wise? Just a guess Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #21 May 22, 2003 Quote CCW = Counter Clock-Wise? Just a guess Hmm.. I don't think so but maybe. >Yup... p/c trailing from my left leg, wrapped around my shoe!! > IMMEDIATE reaction was a ccw kick Edit: yeah you're right, it's probably counter clockwise. Ok what's CCW? A co-worker of mine speaks and writes in Acronyms... It makes no sense on many occasions and requires editing to make it useful for the Average user.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamsville 0 #22 May 22, 2003 Actually I think the context says you are right. I could also stand for Clear the Canopy While you can. |I don't drink during the day, so I don't know what it is about this airline. I keep falling out the door of the plane. Harry, FB #4143 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
