Waver

[freeflyit 0]

What's happening everyone. I need to make a liability release waver for a skydiving club. If anyone has the time to make any suggetions in terms of what to write and how to phrase stuffl, I'd like to hear your 2 cents.

[Zeppo 0]

I recommend that if you are planning on drafting a tight document that can hold up in a court of law, then your best bet is to pay a lawyer to do it. They will have the knowledge specific to that juristiction. A skydiving waiver is not something I would recommend just throwing together without direct consultation with a lawyer.

As for what should be in it...

List any and all direct and indirect hazards and dangers involved in skydiving and they willfully and freely accept the risks involved, and that no-one else will be held laible regardless of the outcome of the skydive.

Where is this new club?

What goes up, must come DOWN!!!

[freeflyit 0]

In Ottawa. It's just a little thing I'm throwing together at college.

[Sockpuppet 0]

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In Ottawa. It's just a little thing I'm throwing together at college.

and your survey says "nurrghhhh".

If its a college club (offical) get the college lawyers to write this. Its a waiver, not something you can hope throw together and hope some lawyer doesnt tear you a new one in court.

Also I'm guessing that at 100 jump and one year there are going to be more experianced people around and you will be using another DZ with full time DZO etc. Can you just not use thier waver?

------
Two of the three voices in my head agree with you. It might actually be unanimous but voice three only speaks Welsh.

[freeflyit 0]

Well actually, I was planning to do it all myself, rent a plane, use a feild,,the whole nine. Just kidding. Yea, I understand that I have to get a lawer and all that, but it's not cheap and I'm not sure if there are college lawers (I'll check into it now that you mention it). So I have to come with more then just a, "ok I'm starting a club". I want to have everything organized and ready to go when I go to them so they won't turn me down. and we will use the dropzone waver, but they aren't the only ones involved.

[IanHarrop 37]

Plagiarism is the purist for of flattery. Go to your favorite dropzone and ask if you can start by using their waiver as a model.

"Where troubles melt like lemon drops, away above the chimney tops, that's where you'll find me" Dorothy

[DougH 270]

I am in a college club and we didn't go crazy with a waiver, although I think there is some mention in the bylaws. Go ahead a sue me for all of my assets... *snicker*.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[Jeff.Donohue 0]

You might not now, but you might someday...

You could end up with future earnings garnished, future assets (including your shiny new rig) attached... Spend a few minutes and make a decent waiver.

[Andy9o8 0]

For God's sake, either plagiarize a good skydiving waiver already in existence or get a lawyer to draft one for you. I'm sorry to have to sound imperious, but if you can't even spell "waiver" correctly, you're probably not qualified to draft one.

[Andy9o8 0]

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I am in a college club and we didn't go crazy with a waiver...

That's because, in your collective inexperience, you grossly underestimate the need and value of having a good one.

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.... Go ahead a sue me for all of my assets... *snicker*.

Your sophomorically smug attitude is prime evidence of your lack of appreciation of the consequences of getting sued without a good waiver in place. A crippling injury or fatality could easily result in a multi-million dollar judgment. If your club is not incorporated, every member of the club could be held personally liable for the judgment. (And unless it's paid in full or discharged in bankruptcy, a judgment never expires; it's a gift that truly lasts a lifetime.) The DZ might cease to exist. The club would almost certainly cease to exist. And if it's a college club, I can guarantee you that the college itself would be a party-defendant in a lawsuit, and probably on the hook for any judgment. I'm sure that would really endear the college to both the club, and to you.

[dayle 0]

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but if you can't even spell "waiver" correctly, you're probably not qualified to draft one.

You beat me that was just what I was thinking. Also, same goes for "LAWYER" if you can't spell it you probably need one.

Dayle

[DougH 270]

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Your sophomorically smug attitude is prime evidence of your lack of appreciation of the consequences of getting sued without a good waiver in place.

Sophmoric, nice.

Since we aren't conducting any skydiving operations ourselves, and we aren't hucking people out of planes ourselves, I see little danger of being involved in a huge lawsuit. I am not in a position where I can be accused of negligence. Additionally the dz where we go have their own waivers to protect their interests as well as provide evidence that all involved parties were informed of the risks associated with the sport.

I am not saying that you are wrong, just saying that I am sophmorically unconcerned by all you bloody lawyers.

Let me ask you this, do you have a waiver that you pass out to other fun jumpers before the ride up?

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[freeflyit 0]

I dunno man, but that bothers me a little. When I type stuff I just type it as it comes, I don't double check everything I post here or when I'm just writing because I do so much of it on a regular basis. And somehow, you came to a conclusion that because a person spelled a word wrong they need help. You have absolutely no idea at all who I am. I dunno, seems kinda premature don't ya think?

[skybytch 259]

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Since we aren't conducting any skydiving operations ourselves, and we aren't hucking people out of planes ourselves, I see little danger of being involved in a huge lawsuit.

Does the club own gear? If so, there's a danger of being involved in a huge lawsuit. Does the club offer any kind of ground instruction? If so, there's a danger of being involved in a huge lawsuit. Does the club offer/sponsor/advertise any skydiving activities at all (ie group trips to the dz, etc)? If so, there's a danger of being involved in a huge lawsuit.

A plantiff's attorney will list anybody who may have possibly had anything at all to do with the dead or injured person jumping out of an airplane on the lawsuit - no matter how slight the possibility of those persons/clubs/etc involvement might be. Know how much it costs to get your name off that list, even if you had no direct involvement in the injury/death? Something to think about...

[shermanator 3]

All I know is that you needs several areas where they have to initial, and sign, lots and lots of initialing.

CLICK HERE! new blog posted 9/21/08
CSA #720

[mjosparky 3]

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I dunno man, but that bothers me a little. When I type stuff I just type it as it comes, I don't double check everything I post here or when I'm just writing because I do so much of it on a regular basis. And somehow, you came to a conclusion that because a person spelled a word wrong they need help. You have absolutely no idea at all who I am. I dunno, seems kinda premature don't ya think?

I don't think it is premature to say that you haven’t thought this “plan” of yours through very well.

You asked for some advise on a waiver and then when you get it you whine that they are picking on you. Get over it.

Either do the damn thing right or don’t waste your time putting anything together. Skydiving and protecting yourself from a lawsuit is all about the details. This forum has spell check and if that detail slipped by you attention to details does not appear to be your strong suit. (no pun intended)

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[Andy9o8 0]

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I am sophmorically unconcerned.
by all you bloody lawyers.

Fixed it for you.

[freeflyit 0]

Mjo. Let me make this real clear for you so there is no confusion in the future. I don't want any input from you in any way shape or form. Whenever you see my drozone name, do not reply to ither my posts or responses. I do not care at all what you have to say to me. So please, next time you have the urge to say something to me,,,don't.

[riggerrob 562]

Which college?

There is legal precedence of a skydiving club at University of Ottawa and I suspect there was a similar club at Carleton University, during the late 1970s and early 1980s. I was even on the board of the U. of O. club when I studied there.
Both clubs were merely marketing/recruiting fronts for Joe Chow's DZ in Winchester, but at least they looked legit on paper and were backed by University administrators.

Start by copying your local DZ's waiver, then float it past a law professor. Finally, any waiver must be approved by the college's legal counsel before you can publish it with the college's name on it.

[JohanW 0]

If you won't take his advice, don't ask for it.

Be safe. Be smart.

Johan.
I am. I think.

[DougH 270]

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Mjo. Let me make this real clear for you so there is no confusion in the future. I don't want any input from you in any way shape or form. Whenever you see my drozone name, do not reply to ither my posts or responses. I do not care at all what you have to say to me. So please, next time you have the urge to say something to me,,,don't.

It is just the internet, and most of these people had some very good points, even if I think they are getting a little worked up and are exaggerating the legal risk. You should let things roll of your back, especially internet comments.

Check this bad boy out. iespell.com

I still would like to know how many of u have your own lawyer drafted waivers for when you do jumps that don't fall under DZ business.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[popsjumper 2]

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Mjo. Let me make this real clear for you so there is no confusion in the future. I don't want any input from you in any way shape or form. Whenever you see my drozone name, do not reply to ither my posts or responses. I do not care at all what you have to say to me. So please, next time you have the urge to say something to me,,,don't.

Soory guy...you really fucked up with this post. "MJO" is one of the best sources of information and advice in here and you just burned a major bridge.

If I were you, I'd apologize and hope and pray that he continues to advise you.

Good luck.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[headoverheels 292]

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You asked for some advise advice on a waiver...This forum has spell check and if that detail slipped by you attention to details does not appear to be your strong suit. (no pun intended)

[mjosparky 3]

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You asked for some advise advice on a waiver...This forum has spell check and if that detail slipped by you attention to details does not appear to be your strong suit. (no pun intended)

Busted!

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[mjosparky 3]

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Mjo. Let me make this real clear for you so there is no confusion in the future. I don't want any input from you in any way shape or form. Whenever you see my drozone dropzone name, do not reply to ither either my posts or responses. I do not care at all what you have to say to me. So please, next time you have the urge to say something to me,,,don't.

And guess what this gives me the urge to do?

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals