Tips on judging height for flaring?

[grue 1]

I stuck my first jump last week, courtesy of my ground crew radioing a flare command.

However, on the second jump, the radio crapped out right before landing and I didn't know, so I never got a flare command.

At the point where I figured I was about 12' off the ground, I waited for a flare command, and never got it. I ended up flaring at perhaps six feet or so after thinking "well, fuck, I can't be -that- high, I'm gonna flare before I break my legs", and did a bit of an ass skid as a result of the late flare, coupled with the lack of traction from the boots I was wearing (footwear has been changed, for future use)

While I know it's my responsibilty for the landing, not the ground crew, I wasn't really sure of my altitude at the time. I know now that the "flare!" command popped into my head at the right time, but do you guys have any suggestions for judging when to pull, just to be sure?

FWIW, I'm about 6'3", so a six foot fall out of the sky isn't that big of a deal for me.

cavete terrae.

[ianmdrennan 2]

Don't look straight down. 45 degrees will give you a good perspective of your height.

As always, talk to you instructors and see what they recommend.

Blues,
Ian

Performance Designs Factory Team

[mattjw916 2]

Don't worry man, it just takes practice to judge the distance better. In my "massive" 9 jumps I have had a nice soft butt-landing on all but one.

On my ASP graduation jump I did it without radio assist, and would have stood it up, except I let pressure off one of the toggles slightly and tipped over after I touched down.

NSCR-2376, SCR-15080

[JYorkster 0]

It depends on the canopy you are jumping, but if these are very large, docile student canopies with a single stage flare where you are pretty much told to flare all the way and hold....

I tell students to try to picture when the distance between them and their canopy matches the distance between them and the ground. That's a pretty good average flare height...12-15 ft. Now don't be looking up at you canopy trying to make this decision, but the visual works for most students.

Ask your instructor about this before trying it, since it is dependent on the type of canopy.

Rock

[riggerrob 558]

Sounds like you handled it well on your own.

Radios rarely "crap out right before landing."
More likely you went deaf from pressure in your ears or fear.
Changing footwear for more traction may not be the best move. Sliding on your butt is a great way to dissipate energy gradually. While trying to "stick" a landing can severely stress leg bones.

The best way to flare is keeping your eyes on the horizon - or at least the far fence of the landing field - and flaring when you start to notice individual blades of grass in your peripheral vision.
Another way to judge flare altitude is to measure the height of a wind sock or flag pole in the landing area. Tell your self "I will start flaring when my feet are below that flag, but above the fence." Then glance at the flag - out of the corner of your eye - while on final approach.
In conclusion, use your peripheral vision to tell your when to flare.

[grue 1]

Quote

Radios rarely "crap out right before landing."

It was definitely the radio, we tried it again after I landed, no joy. Ended up happening to another student that day, too

As for the traction of the shoes, that's a good point.

Thanks for the tips, guys!

cavete terrae.

[174fps 1]

Generally if you look straight down you will flare high
if you look at the far horizon you will generally flare low
look out at about 45 degrees,
periferal vision gives better depth perception so a quick glance off to the side may help.
also if you can find something about 12' high to stand
on and get a sight picture that will help.
Mostly the best thing to do is jump a lot, nothing is better than experience.

Andrew

[rickjump1 0]

Quote

Generally if you look straight down you will flare high
if you look at the far horizon you will generally flare low
look out at about 45 degrees,
periferal vision gives better depth perception so a quick glance off to the side may help.
also if you can find something about 12' high to stand
on and get a sight picture that will help.
Mostly the best thing to do is jump a lot, nothing is better than experience.

Andrew

This is good info.If you look down, the ground will rush up to you. I started with round canopies and the ground smaked me the first time. Somebody told me "you are a sky diver; you must look down because you are trlying to hit the peas". Sure.

Do your part for global warming: ban beans and hold all popcorn farts.

[f1shlips 2]

If you break something as you flare... you flared too low.

If you break something after you flare... you flared too high.

It sounds like you did fine... other than not doing a plf. It took me ~30 jumps before I could stand one up, and a ~50 before I could do it consistantly in all wind conditions.

--
drop zone (drop'zone) n. An incestuous sesspool of broken people. -- Attributed to a whuffo girlfriend.

[crotalus01 0]

amen...i am nursing two fractured knuckles and a compression fracture in my wrist from flaring too low. still having problems judging when to flare, but on my last two jumps with my injured hand i found it better to flare slightly too high than too low. and BTW, my JM evaluated my hand before the jump, as well as the doctor, plenty of movement range to jump safely, its just sore as hell...

As for me and my house, we will serve the LORD...

[caldwellbuilder 0]

We have a loft with a set of steps going up to it and
we take our students up to the height of their feet
being ~10 ft off the ground. You should look ahead
at about a 45 degree angle with the toggles all the
way up and as you bring the toggles down, when
your toggles reach your eye height let your eyes follow the toggles downward. This should allow you
to look at your landing spot as you reach it under
canopy. Smooth and steady toggle action should
result in a soft landing.Jump as much as possible
to gain experience.

Will.

[MikeTJumps 4]

When the canopy and the ground are equidistant from your eyes, initiate a smooth three-count flare (which takes about two seconds).

One: Flare to the shoulders,
Two: Flare to the breastbone,
Three: Flare to the waist and below.

When the ground stops moving under you, flare no more as to do so will back you up on windy days.

Now you might immediately retort that at a descent rate of 16'/sec, only the first second will matter. The error in that line of thought is you are immediately trading forward velocity for lift, therefore you increase the time of your descent through that last 16' during your flare.

Mike Turoff
Instructor Examiner, USPA
Co-author of Parachuting, The Skydiver's Handbook

[kelpdiver 2]

The wind socks make for a very useful benchmark, but obviously you can't rely on them always being available. It does make for a good starting point, though.

People on the ground, like your instructor, are another reference to use in the early going. Also doesn't work if you land first or out by yourself.

[mattjw916 2]

Quote

amen...i am nursing two fractured knuckles and a compression fracture in my wrist from flaring too low. still having problems judging when to flare, but on my last two jumps with my injured hand i found it better to flare slightly too high than too low. and BTW, my JM evaluated my hand before the jump, as well as the doctor, plenty of movement range to jump safely, its just sore as hell...

I have had 1 late flare to-date... I have to agree that marginally too high is better than too low/not at all. I was uninjured in my "thud" landing as I sort of slid it in and landed on my butt in the middle of the grass. (at least I was on target )

NSCR-2376, SCR-15080

[nael 0]

I'm hopeless at flaring too. Yesterday I had my hardest landing yet (PLR'd and didnt injure myself thankfully!). It's so frustrating, I know the theory behind it, I've had at least a dozen instructors give me tips on how to do it, and also tell me what I'm doing wrong, but I still cant get it right.

On my last 2 jumps I actually let 1 toggle up after flaring and turned the canopy about 5' off the ground, causing me to smack in. I'm even more annoyed because I didnt even realise that's what I'd done until I had some instructors tell me. It's sort of comforting to know other newbies have similar problems. I just hope I get it right before I break myself.

www.TerminalSports.com.auAustralia's largest skydive gear store

[captain1 0]

I have over 400 jumps and I am still trying to figure out how to land a canopy. It is tricky business.

[Flare 0]

I don't now how i do it, but i landed 13 standups on 17 jumps, somehow i just know when to flare..

what maybe can help: just lean out of a window on the first floor(be sure you're about 9/12 feet higher than the floor you're looking at) and watch what 12 feet looks like, so maybe you get a general idea of when to flare..

For further tips..can't help you..hope someone else has "the golden tip"

[captain1 0]

Good job! 13 out of 17 is not a bad start. Appreciate the advice but what I really meant is that landing a canopy is a constant learning process. Especially when you start downsizing and flying different canopies.

[Deuce 1]

I like to tell my students that they should start their flare when they are standing on the balcony of a two story condo on the beach.

You will be at about 10 to 12 feet above the ground when you are standing on the balcony of a two story building with standard 8 foot ceilings. So, go stand on a balcony like that and see what the horizon looks like, and get a feel for it in your peripheral vision. Maybe that will help.

[adobelover 0]

Personally, about 40-50 feet up on final, I "look" at about 45 degrees down in front of me first, (to see any obstacles I might be ready to hit) THEN use a "scanning" look from left to right and back again (which also makes it easier to see any incoming traffic be it on foot or in the air) You should be able to gauge your height, then do a smooth, steady flare...and most important...GET SOMEONE TO VIDEO TAPE YOUR LANDINGS!! Luck and Blues,

_________________________________________


Old age ain't no place for sissies!

[Flare 0]

haha, this was not ment to you captain , i just answered to the post..but there is no normal reply button here so i just clicked the last reply (i'm too lazy to scroll back up )

[grue 1]

Well, I did the "go find something 12 feet up, stand on it, and look around trick", and today, I stood up both of my landings. The first one, I slid a little, but stood up, the second one, I NAILED it.

GREAT feeling!

Out of 4 jumps, I've had 3 standups, makes me feel speshul

cavete terrae.

[somethinelse 0]

YA-HOO!

Wonderfully helpful tip, man!

I've been the latest & growing "tall tale" about LILA's HIGH FLARE. It's gone from originally 15' to 30' to 100' feet high! But the everybody loves to razz me about everything else anyways.

My flare was on an almost WINDLESS DAY, went too long on final and HIT TURBULANCE from off both tree line and hangar.

SPEED ACCERALTED as I came in to land & FLARED TOO HIGH, b/c I was looking straight down as the ground really BLURRED by! Ended up trying a PLF & slid in just getting a little scrapped up.

Everybody has there tips and observations about how and what happened.

Never heard that tip about equal distant height from ground to canopy at flare time, and probably don't remember about the 3 second flare thing neither.

THANX SO MUCH. HOPE THAT HELPS MY FUTURE LANDINGS BE BETTER.

-LILA.

[kjarv 0]

The best practice I've found for learning canopy flare 'sight picture' is find your nearest escalator and ride it down... While I'm sure this won't work too well for high speed landings (I haven't found a 'hook turn' escalator that planes out at 40mph for 50 ft!) it does provide a nice slow descent so you can learn what the ground is supposed to look like as you approach (except of course, you won't be landing in the mall---at least, not on purpose)

You don't have to pay for your trip up, You can practice judging 12ft and you can practice the 'accuracy' trick as well.

Leave your jumpsuit and rig at home though, someone might ask questions :)

-kjarv
"Good afternoon, we're gonna have a great jump today!" -Squirt

[boags 0]

"FWIW, I'm about 6'3", so a six foot fall out of the sky isn't that big of a deal for me."

Im not that tall but on my first few jumps i had the same thinking. Im close to the ground i could normally jump from here and not get hurt.

And a wise jumpmaster said to me

"What if you were pushed from a 6ft high ledge. 6ft would be a big deal then! A wind gust could happen at any time and give you the affect of being pushed off a 6ft ledge and then broken bones and no more jumping for you"

Your not safe untill both feet are on the ground and you have your parachute collapsed!