Not Making It Into the Pattern

[MagicGuy 0]

So something has been bothering me a bit lately. There have been a couple instances where, because of a long/bad spot, I've had to do an opposite landing pattern (i.e. a right hand pattern where left is what is used).

Just this past weekend this happened. The spot set me up in kind of a crosswind situation. I had no wind behind me to get me to where I needed to be to set up my pattern. As soon as I was under canopy (between 2500-3000ft.) I immediately started heading towards where I needed to be to set up my pattern. Before I knew it, I was at 700 feet and there was no way I was getting to where I needed to be. Instead of risking really low/sketchy turns to do a left hand pattern, I did a right hand pattern.

In this situation it was OK because one, it was a Cessna load and one guy was already down, and two, the two other canopies were high enough to realize what I was doing and act accordingly. But, that still doesn't make me happy about what I did.

I know that what I did was the right thing to do, but I want to prevent this kind of thing from happening, PERIOD. I realize that doing an opposite pattern can confuse people and therefore can put people in more risk than they are already in.

I also know that my canopy plays a big role. I'm jumping a Triathlon 160 and I'm 140 out the door. This particular day I was wearing my weight belt putting me at 150 pounds. Still, the Tri doesn't exactly have the greatest glide out there and I feel that this is my biggest problem. And I know some people will probably disagree, or think that I'm trying to downsize too quickly, but this has happened to me at least 3 or 4 times and I don't want it to happen again.

Anyways, I'm curious to hear what some of the more experienced guys out there have to say about this. What would you have done in this situation? Do you think I made the right decision, or what would you have done differently?

[tdog 0]

Assuming the traditional non-high performance landing....

What is the rule at the DZ?

Can you have left hand and right hand patterns?

I know many times I cannot get to a left hand pattern without cutting people off, so I go right hand or visa-versa.

I believe the key is more so landing the same direction as everyone else...

The key with both left and right at the same time is to not cross the whole landing area on your x-wind, because you will be facing the canopies in the opposite pattern, so set up the pattern so the turn from x-wind to final is at the edge of the landing area on "your side", and they turn on "their side".

[mccurley 0]

Sometimes the best thing to do is give up on the landing area and land out!
Better a longer walk then an ambulance ride because of low turns or canopy colisions. Already to many of those happening.

Watch my video Fat Women
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRWkEky8GoI

[PhreeZone 15]

As to the glide rate, what tricks did you do to try to improve it? Did you loosen the chest strap at all? Did you give it brake or rear riser input at all? Not all canopies respond the same to inputs and you might find you get better glide by using 1/2 brakes or even 2-3 inches of rear riser input. Little tricks can do a lot to strech out the glide of your canopy. Let us know what you did and we can see if there are other tricks you can add to your bag to try to imporve you situation in the future.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[MagicGuy 0]

A loosened chest strap along with bringing my knees up towards my chest to try to get small and, in theory, get more penetration. I did talk to some people who suggested the rear riser input and using a bit of brakes to increase my glide.

There's an experienced landing area and then the 'student' landing area. Generally, the pattern is strict, of course, in the experienced area and for good reason. When I did the right hand pattern I landed in the student area. It wasn't frowned upon, but I just hate doing that. It was more of the fact that I confused other jumpers by doing a right hand pattern when the general rule of thumb is to do a left hand pattern.

[AggieDave 6]

There are other things with body position that you can do to help. You can tuck up and arch, to help speed up while you're attempting to flatten your glide and moving your "accuracy spot" further out.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[Ms.sofaking 0]

Loosen chest strap is not one I've heard.What does that do?

"I'm not sure how it's going to turn out, except I'll die in the end, she said. So what could really go wrong? -----Brian Andreas

[bodypilot1 0]

First, who spotted? You? If you weren't spotting, always be ready to pull higher. On a Cessna it's easy to take a second, when climbing out, and look at where the spot is to see it's off, if it is, pull higher. Same goes for anyother plane. Glance down during your freefall. Since you were wearing weights, I assume you were doing RW with other people? Never be afraid to track off early and pull either, you can explain why when the other get back from their long walk...... As for the wrong pattern, you landed safe without doing a low turn. If the wrong pattern put you over things you shouldn't have been over and you had clear landing area other then that, maybe you shouldn't make that mistake again......
Dont be so hard on yourself, shit happens. You landed safe, and thats what matters.


Be safe
Ed

www.WestCoastWingsuits.com
www.PrecisionSkydiving.com

[DSE 3]

FWIW, at our DZ, if you're entering at final from a long spot, it's acceptable so long as you're not making turns against traffic.

[jurgencamps 0]

Not all DZ have the same rules.
At some DZ you have to fly a left hand pattern and you will have a problem in case of a not so perfect spot.
At other DZ, they divide the DZ in 3 parts (left, middle and right) you have to fly a left hand pattern if you land on the left hand side of de DZ, a right hand pattern if you land on the right hand side of the DZ.
I think that years agoo, I read an article (by Bryan Burke) somewhere on this website about the pro's and the con's of different landingpatterns (left hand pattern versus splitting the DZ in three parts ).

CU

Jurgen

Jurgen

[phoenixlpr 0]

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In this situation it was OK because one, it was a Cessna load and one guy was already down, and two, the two other canopies were high enough to realize what I was doing and act accordingly. But, that still doesn't make me happy about what I did.

If you did not cause traffic problem for other then what is the problem here? Has anyone complained?

If someone would be already in his/her left pattern you might face each other on the crosswind leg. That could be a problem.

[kingbunky 3]

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Loosen chest strap is not one I've heard.What does that do?

by itself, not a lot. if you also pull your slider down over your risers, you allow the risers to spread more, giving a flatter, more efficient wing. of course, you should be under a stable canopy, in clear air and pointed in the right direction before you start messing around with sliders and chest straps.

"Hang on a sec, the young'uns are throwin' beer cans at a golf cart."
MB4252 TDS699
killing threads since 2001

[peek 20]

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So something has been bothering me a bit lately. There have been a couple instances where, because of a long/bad spot, I've had to ....

I see you have had a number of responses that suggest how to extend your glide, the specifics of doing a turn to final, etc.

What I would like to suggest is that once you find yourself in such a position, that you develope the judgement to abort the landing you assumed you were going to make, and land in a safe manner, no matter where or how. And an important point to this is determining when to abort while you are still high enough to give yourself good options.

Many accidents happen because people feel like they must get back to the landing area. Land safe, not close. This is more important that learning "tricks".

[Remster 26]

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Many accidents happen because people feel like they must get back to the landing area.

And then make too low a turn to make it, because they really have a decided way too high what the entire landing would be.

Remster

[Ms.sofaking 0]

Thanks, because this is a problem I've also had.
Although probably more important, developing the judgement to abort the plan as mentioned down the thread is something I need to do also.

"I'm not sure how it's going to turn out, except I'll die in the end, she said. So what could really go wrong? -----Brian Andreas

[PhreeZone 15]

Aborting an approach is the most important skill to learn. The worst situation to be in is to fly over lots of clear landing areas only to fly yourself into a situation that takes more skill then you have to safely land. I can't count how many time I've seen people try to make it back and find themselves in a bad spot only after flying over half a mile worth of clear fields. Anything else you learn should be in addition to aborting.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[riggerrob 562]

If you cannot conform to the "letter of the law," then try to conform to the "spirit of the law."

For example, if everyone else is flying a left-hand pattern - but opened too far to the right - it is permissible to fly a right-hand pattern, provided that no-one crosses the center/wind line.

Keep an eye out for obstacles (hangars, airplanes, etc.) that may make it better to land a long way out.

Then you get to decide between a long walk or a long ambulance ride.

[Ms.sofaking 0]

I agree.My struggle is knowing at a high altitude how far I can reasonably make it.I think that might just have to come with experience.But that's probably for another thread.I don't want to get off the track of the original poster.

"I'm not sure how it's going to turn out, except I'll die in the end, she said. So what could really go wrong? -----Brian Andreas

[jkbernstein 1]

You're right: it wasn't a big deal that day - the other jumper who hadn't yet landed and I were paying attention and were far enough out that we could still change our patterns - but it could've been. I appreciate that you noticed that, and that you're asking this question.
I agree with what several other people have said: if you've tried all your tricks to flatten your glide angle(risers, half-brakes, getting small, whatever) and you're still not going to make it back into the pattern, land off, or at least away from everyone else. At Jumptown it's easy; you can land a half-mile away and still be on the airport. At somewhere like Danielson, where the landing area is much smaller and there are not a lot of outs, pick a spot as far away from the main landing area as possible.

May the (relative) wind take your troubles away...

[MagicGuy 0]

Jess, the more you are around me, the more you'll notice how critical I am about my performance in the air and under canopy. I notice everything, both about myself and other people, especially when it comes to canopy control. I tend to be very observant, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. While some people would do what I did and not see a thing wrong with it, I see many things wrong with it and like to do what's possible to make sure it doesn't happen again.

Thanks everyone for the tips on making my glide more efficient. I will give them a try! I'm also going to be jumping a Sabre2 150 for a few jumps, which should have a bit more glide than my Triathlon

[phoenixlpr 0]

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If you cannot conform to the "letter of the law," then try to conform to the "spirit of the law."

Agree.

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A superior pilot has superior knowledge in order to _avoid_ getting into a situation where superior still would be needed.

I got some experience how a situation can "improve" by the time is going slowly midair. I was landing a slite turn in order to avoid land on tree in the mild of a forest.

Have a good plane A and execute it! Have plane B and C and a lot other version between them if plane A can be reached!

[jsaxton 0]

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JI notice everything, both about myself and other people, especially when it comes to canopy control. I tend to be very observant,
< 100 jumps?

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[Broke 0]

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I agree.My struggle is knowing at a high altitude how far I can reasonably make it.I think that might just have to come with experience.But that's probably for another thread.I don't want to get off the track of the original poster.

Check out the accuracy trick article. It is good stuf. If you look at your intended landing area and it is moving up in your field of vision you will not make it back. If it is falling down in your field of vision good to go. If it doesn't go up or down in your field of vision that is the exact spot you will land at. It takes a little while to train your eye, but once you get it you can land safely and confidantly because you will know weither or not you will make it back to the DZ or if you need to find an out.

Divot your source for all things Hillbilly.
Anvil Brother 84
SCR 14192

[MagicGuy 0]

Yes.

[Ms.sofaking 0]

I've been working on that.Having a little trouble.It was suggested I take a canopy course, and I think she's right.Thanks for the help, though ,I appreciate it.

"I'm not sure how it's going to turn out, except I'll die in the end, she said. So what could really go wrong? -----Brian Andreas