nigel99 151 #1 April 21, 2012 First of all I've just finished reading Deep Survival where he mentions that under stress and in extreme situations our IQ plummets to that of an ape. I've always thought of myself as safety conscious and conservative. Today I proved to myself that it's possible to let your emotions take control and do stupid things that could easily result in an incident. Fortunately for me the only result was a really fun jump with no consequences... Basically I got to the dz early this morning in overcast conditions, with cloud base at somewhere between 3 and 5k. A couple of very sweet girls asked if I wanted to do a hop and pop with them. I let the situation get the better of me. I don't like being rushed, but we 'squeezed' a load in with 4 of us. I still don't understand how it went from an informal chat to someone yelling at me to get geared up as the plane was waiting for me. But I ended up grabbing my gear (packed by someone else), stuffing my pilot chute into the BOC as fast as I could, and running to the plane, while kitting up. I normally do a full main and reserve pin check - this got skipped in the rush. I also check the winds and landing pattern this got skipped. I normally drive people I am jumping with mad, by wanting to know the plan before boarding - this got skipped. In fact the 'plan' was for a 4 way if we got to 5k, not to jump if we couldn't get 3.5k and hop and pops if in between. I found the 'plan' out at 1k. We ended up doing hop and pops with me out last. What angers me is that I allowed myself to get into a situation where so many of my hard rules got broken. In looking at it in hindsight I am really disappointed. A couple of good looking girls and a desire to jump asap is a really poor excuse for ending up dead. I think it is Wendy who has said a really dangerous mindset is doing the wrong thing and getting away with it.Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
obelixtim 102 #2 April 21, 2012 Hey, we've ALL done dumb things. And if we're still around we got away with it. Bad experience still goes in the experience box.... Surviving it, and learning the lesson is the key. Some people do neither.....My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nigel99 151 #3 April 21, 2012 Quote Hey, we've ALL done dumb things. And if we're still around we got away with it. Bad experience still goes in the experience box.... Surviving it, and learning the lesson is the key. Some people do neither..... Too true.Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #4 April 21, 2012 Meh...not to worry. I got your back, my friend. While you were working on the girls, I was keeping Dana distracted. I bet I had more fun than you. Just let me know and I'll cover your back anytime. My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nigel99 151 #5 April 21, 2012 Quote Meh...not to worry. I got your back, my friend. While you were working on the girls, I was keeping Dana distracted. I bet I had more fun than you. Just let me know and I'll cover your back anytime. Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TampaPete 35 #6 April 21, 2012 I also have a very specific routine before getting in the plane. My DZ has learned I won’t skip through it and they don’t mind. They just put me on the load that fits that time table. I gear check everything, check the winds, check the landing pattern, stretch, dirt dive a couple of exits and pulls then I’m ready. Takes about 20 minutes minimum. What you failed to realize is you were in a negotiation. A negotiation for the process. In any negotiation you need to be able to say no when your bottom line is surpassed. Your next step in the negotiation is to say “I need 10.” If they yell, sit down. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nigel99 151 #7 April 21, 2012 Quote I also have a very specific routine before getting in the plane. My DZ has learned I won’t skip through it and they don’t mind. They just put me on the load that fits that time table. I gear check everything, check the winds, check the landing pattern, stretch, dirt dive a couple of exits and pulls then I’m ready. Takes about 20 minutes minimum. What you failed to realize is you were in a negotiation. A negotiation for the process. In any negotiation you need to be able to say no when your bottom line is surpassed. Your next step in the negotiation is to say “I need 10.” If they yell, sit down. No negotiation needed. I have sat out loads before and waited till I am ready. It was a whole bunch of factors that came together. I wanted to do a hop and pop, and here they are not as easy as they were in the US. I needed to leave the DZ asap as I had commitments and honestly a couple of pretty woman asking me played a part as well. Someone actually offered to take my slotExperienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildcard451 0 #8 April 21, 2012 Quote It was a whole bunch of factors that came together. I wanted to do a hop and pop, and here they are not as easy as they were in the US. I needed to leave the DZ asap as I had commitments and honestly a couple of pretty woman asking me played a part as well. Someone actually offered to take my slot So what's the problem? Laugh in that guy's face Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JasonYergin 0 #9 April 21, 2012 What I like is that you can admit publicly what you think you did wrong. I'm sure a lot of people can't do that. We should probably all be more careful and have a routine like you described._________________________________ ...Don't Get Elimated!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 94 #10 April 21, 2012 Quotenot to jump if we couldn't get 3.5k 3.5 should not be seen as a low exit.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 3 #11 April 21, 2012 Remember, "good judgment comes from experience, and experience comes from poor judgment" Recognizing there was a potential problem and admitting it to yourself is the first step in learning to survive in this sport. Good for you. SparkyMy idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CSpenceFLY 1 #12 April 21, 2012 Pink will get you killed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nigel99 151 #13 April 21, 2012 QuoteQuotenot to jump if we couldn't get 3.5k 3.5 should not be seen as a low exit. I've got no problem doing a hop and pop from 3k and up. Those were the terms told to me by the staff member on board.Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Squeak 17 #14 April 21, 2012 that would not have happened at York, We wouldn't let you rush like thatNige, did you turn on your AAD? You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky) My Life ROCKS! How's yours doing? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ufk22 32 #15 April 21, 2012 I think it is Wendy who has said a really dangerous mindset is doing the wrong thing and getting away with it. Quote Not exactly.... Doing the wrong thing and thinking it is right because you got away with it is the dangerous mindset. You got away with it, but realized that it was wrong. Put this down to a learning experience. Learning means not doing it again.This is the paradox of skydiving. We do something very dangerous, expose ourselves to a totally unnecesary risk, and then spend our time trying to make it safer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites airtwardo 6 #16 April 21, 2012 Quote I also have a very specific routine before getting in the plane. My DZ has learned I won’t skip through it and they don’t mind. They just put me on the load that fits that time table. I gear check everything, check the winds, check the landing pattern, stretch, dirt dive a couple of exits and pulls then I’m ready. Takes about 20 minutes minimum. What you failed to realize is you were in a negotiation. A negotiation for the process. In any negotiation you need to be able to say no when your bottom line is surpassed. Your next step in the negotiation is to say “I need 10.” If they yell, sit down. VERY well stated! Good on you for holding hard to those routines...no one is more responsible for your safety than you are! ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nigel99 151 #17 April 21, 2012 Quote that would not have happened at York, We wouldn't let you rush like thatNige, did you turn on your AAD? Yip AAD on. And yeah I've got the choice between being on the plane with you at York or a couple of hotties - no contest sorry(We're planning on coming out to York next time Bruce jumps).Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites pontiacgtp00 0 #18 April 22, 2012 Indeed, although I have been to many DZ's which consider 3.5k dangerously low...and it's not. I'm comfortable doing hop n pops from 2k to 2.5k, but I jump an F111 PD-230, fast opening reliable canopy. Been jumping for 5 years with 673 logged jumps, and I still haven't downsized, or gone to zero-p. I save the weaving and going fast for when I'm on my motorcycle. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites wildcard451 0 #19 April 22, 2012 QuoteIndeed, although I have been to many DZ's which consider 3.5k dangerously low...and it's not. I'm comfortable doing hop n pops from 2k to 2.5k, but I jump an F111 PD-230, fast opening reliable canopy. Been jumping for 5 years with 673 logged jumps, and I still haven't downsized, or gone to zero-p. I save the weaving and going fast for when I'm on my motorcycle. Cool story, bro. Tell it again. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 1,651 #20 April 22, 2012 Quote A couple of good looking girls and a desire to jump asap is a really poor excuse for ending up dead. Women ARE sin.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites popsjumper 2 #21 April 22, 2012 Quote Quote A couple of good looking girls and a desire to jump asap is a really poor excuse for ending up dead. Women ARE sin. Ain't it da truth! As a kid, I was a baseball nut and I had made my mind up early that I was going to do everything I could for a shot at the pros. I learned, I practiced my ass off. I immersed myself in baseball. Bobby Richardson's sister lived two doors down from us and every winter Bobby would visit her for a month and I would pester that poor man religiously to teach me and help me. That man had the patience of a saint. My dad, being an ex football player had several friends in the pro sports world and again, I would pester them to teach me anything and everything they could about baseball....Pete Rose (well for only one day but still...), Max McGhee, Charlie Green, Willie Puddin'head Jones, to name a few. I was on a roll. One of the best in whatever league I was in. Then I discovered women. Now I'm a DZ bum. My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites obelixtim 102 #22 April 22, 2012 "Women are the foundation of mankind"...... Feminist dogma..... I wonder who knows the reply to that quote?.My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites theonlyski 3 #23 April 22, 2012 Quote First of all I've just finished reading Deep Survival where he mentions that under stress and in extreme situations our IQ plummets to that of an ape. I've attended a couple of lectures by the guy that wrote the book on killing, he explains that as the 4 F's. Fight Flight Fuck Feed Sounds like ya got one out of the deal... oh well!"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites airtwardo 6 #24 April 22, 2012 Quote "Women are the foundation of mankind"...... Feminist dogma..... I wonder who knows the reply to that quote?. The foundation is cracked and the basement is full of water... ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites obelixtim 102 #25 April 22, 2012 Nuh.... When they tell you that, the best reply is "Yeah, but who lays the foundation". Just before you duck......My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 Next Page 1 of 2 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. 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airtwardo 6 #16 April 21, 2012 Quote I also have a very specific routine before getting in the plane. My DZ has learned I won’t skip through it and they don’t mind. They just put me on the load that fits that time table. I gear check everything, check the winds, check the landing pattern, stretch, dirt dive a couple of exits and pulls then I’m ready. Takes about 20 minutes minimum. What you failed to realize is you were in a negotiation. A negotiation for the process. In any negotiation you need to be able to say no when your bottom line is surpassed. Your next step in the negotiation is to say “I need 10.” If they yell, sit down. VERY well stated! Good on you for holding hard to those routines...no one is more responsible for your safety than you are! ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nigel99 151 #17 April 21, 2012 Quote that would not have happened at York, We wouldn't let you rush like thatNige, did you turn on your AAD? Yip AAD on. And yeah I've got the choice between being on the plane with you at York or a couple of hotties - no contest sorry(We're planning on coming out to York next time Bruce jumps).Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pontiacgtp00 0 #18 April 22, 2012 Indeed, although I have been to many DZ's which consider 3.5k dangerously low...and it's not. I'm comfortable doing hop n pops from 2k to 2.5k, but I jump an F111 PD-230, fast opening reliable canopy. Been jumping for 5 years with 673 logged jumps, and I still haven't downsized, or gone to zero-p. I save the weaving and going fast for when I'm on my motorcycle. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildcard451 0 #19 April 22, 2012 QuoteIndeed, although I have been to many DZ's which consider 3.5k dangerously low...and it's not. I'm comfortable doing hop n pops from 2k to 2.5k, but I jump an F111 PD-230, fast opening reliable canopy. Been jumping for 5 years with 673 logged jumps, and I still haven't downsized, or gone to zero-p. I save the weaving and going fast for when I'm on my motorcycle. Cool story, bro. Tell it again. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,651 #20 April 22, 2012 Quote A couple of good looking girls and a desire to jump asap is a really poor excuse for ending up dead. Women ARE sin.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #21 April 22, 2012 Quote Quote A couple of good looking girls and a desire to jump asap is a really poor excuse for ending up dead. Women ARE sin. Ain't it da truth! As a kid, I was a baseball nut and I had made my mind up early that I was going to do everything I could for a shot at the pros. I learned, I practiced my ass off. I immersed myself in baseball. Bobby Richardson's sister lived two doors down from us and every winter Bobby would visit her for a month and I would pester that poor man religiously to teach me and help me. That man had the patience of a saint. My dad, being an ex football player had several friends in the pro sports world and again, I would pester them to teach me anything and everything they could about baseball....Pete Rose (well for only one day but still...), Max McGhee, Charlie Green, Willie Puddin'head Jones, to name a few. I was on a roll. One of the best in whatever league I was in. Then I discovered women. Now I'm a DZ bum. My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
obelixtim 102 #22 April 22, 2012 "Women are the foundation of mankind"...... Feminist dogma..... I wonder who knows the reply to that quote?.My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 3 #23 April 22, 2012 Quote First of all I've just finished reading Deep Survival where he mentions that under stress and in extreme situations our IQ plummets to that of an ape. I've attended a couple of lectures by the guy that wrote the book on killing, he explains that as the 4 F's. Fight Flight Fuck Feed Sounds like ya got one out of the deal... oh well!"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airtwardo 6 #24 April 22, 2012 Quote "Women are the foundation of mankind"...... Feminist dogma..... I wonder who knows the reply to that quote?. The foundation is cracked and the basement is full of water... ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
obelixtim 102 #25 April 22, 2012 Nuh.... When they tell you that, the best reply is "Yeah, but who lays the foundation". Just before you duck......My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
