More Journalists Walk Away from Groupthink

[Guest]

Here's a column about how an journalist was mobbed by her own colleagues for daring to stray from nutjob orthodoxy. She joins several other notable voices who have decided to walk away rather than face PC persecution.

https://unherd.com/2020/11/why-i-had-to-leave-the-guardian/?=frlh

[wmw999 2,121]

And the same happens at right-wing outlets. People leave. Sometimes only for money, sometimes for money but they say it's ideology (because money is ideology). Sometimes they just want to be with people who think more like them.

Wendy P.

[kallend 1,623]

 

Use your words, John

 

[gowlerk 1,912]

3 hours ago, markharju said:

Here's a column about how an journalist was mobbed by her own colleagues for daring to stray from nutjob orthodoxy. She joins several other notable voices who have decided to walk away rather than face PC persecution.

https://unherd.com/2020/11/why-i-had-to-leave-the-guardian/?=frlh

I would note that she left of her own free will.

[wmw999 2,121]

It would be easy to say that she couldn't take a little disagreement. How's that flag go: "I don't care about your fucking feelings." If it sucks one way, it sucks the other way, too.

Wendy P.

[SkyDekker 1,122]

5 hours ago, markharju said:

Here's a column about how an journalist was mobbed by her own colleagues for daring to stray from nutjob orthodoxy. She joins several other notable voices who have decided to walk away rather than face PC persecution.

https://unherd.com/2020/11/why-i-had-to-leave-the-guardian/?=frlh

Groupthink is expensive. Thankfully Fox is wealthy enough they can pay to keep courts away from the truth.

Fox pays seven figures to protect group think

 

Edited November 26, 2020 by SkyDekker

[gowlerk 1,912]

One man's "groupthink" is another man's "wisdom of crowds". If you don't think you are part of groupthink I am laughing at you.

[billvon 2,400]

6 hours ago, markharju said:

Here's a column about how an journalist was mobbed by her own colleagues for daring to stray from nutjob orthodoxy.

Mark, you show more groupthink than anyone else on this forum.  One can anticipate your posts by going to any of a number of specific news outlets.

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

8 hours ago, markharju said:

Here's a column about how an journalist was mobbed by her own colleagues for daring to stray from nutjob orthodoxy. She joins several other notable voices who have decided to walk away rather than face PC persecution.

https://unherd.com/2020/11/why-i-had-to-leave-the-guardian/?=frlh

Hi Mark,

Re:  'mobbed by her own colleagues for daring to stray from nutjob orthodoxy'

Would you say the same thing about Geo. Will & his columns about Trump of the last few years?

IMO Geo. Will is one of the most committed conservatives in the world.

Jerry Baumchen

 

[mistercwood 287]

12 hours ago, markharju said:

Here's a column about how an journalist was mobbed by her own colleagues for daring to stray from nutjob orthodoxy. She joins several other notable voices who have decided to walk away rather than face PC persecution.

https://unherd.com/2020/11/why-i-had-to-leave-the-guardian/?=frlh

That was thousands more words than were needed to say "I published bigoted opinions then got sad that people pointed out I was being a bigot, what is the world coming to".

She wasn't fired, she wasn't reprimanded - she freely voiced her opinions (on one hell of a platform btw) and then didn't like the response.

Her stance is the same as almost every other TERF who ever lived - "trans-women are just men trying to sneak their way into women's spaces". She sprinkles the article with statements about how she cares for the trans community but this is the underlying viewpoint she circles back to every time.

It isn't PC persecution to call out bigotry for what it is.

[Guest]

6 hours ago, mistercwood said:

It isn't PC persecution to call out bigotry for what it is.

...logic and reason aren't bigotry.

[mistercwood 287]

9 minutes ago, markharju said:

...logic and reason

Her positions stem from a core assumption that trans-women are often men trying to infiltrate biological women's spaces, an assumption with nothing at all offered to back it up - the conclusions rely on the assumption being true, which only happens if you already expect the conclusion.

This is a textbook example of a question-begging argument, which is a logical fallacy.

Edited November 27, 2020 by mistercwood

[billvon 2,400]

8 minutes ago, mistercwood said:

Her positions stem from a core assumption that trans-women are often men trying to infiltrate biological women's spaces, an assumption with nothing at all offered to back it up - the conclusions rely on the assumption being true, which only happens if you already expect the conclusion.

This is a textbook example of a question-begging argument, which is a logical fallacy.

Yep.

It is also worth pointing out that three trans writers resigned from the Guardian due to bias they perceived against them.  Mark had no problem with that.  Then one person who published anti-trans material resigned and it is "NUTJOB ORTHODOXY!"  "PC PERSECUTION!"  O the horror!  O the injustice!

Selective outrage is a big thing these days.

[Guest]

39 minutes ago, mistercwood said:

Her positions stem from a core assumption that trans-women are often men trying to infiltrate biological women's spaces, an assumption with nothing at all offered to back it up - the conclusions rely on the assumption being true, which only happens if you already expect the conclusion.

This is a textbook example of a question-begging argument, which is a logical fallacy.

... so you're okay with adult males being allowed into juvenile girls' spaces because they "identify" as juvenile girls? As billvon says, selective outrage is a big thing these days, but perhaps it's justified when shtf like this. Perverts MUST be stopped. I don't give a fuck about their feewings. Edit to add: I think 2020 will be remembered by history as a very dark time; not just because of the 'Rona but also because it was when the Cult of the Individual reached nauseating extremes.

Edited November 27, 2020 by Guest

[mistercwood 287]

2 hours ago, markharju said:

... so you're okay with adult males being allowed into juvenile girls' spaces because they "identify" as juvenile girls?

It's a good thing I quit smoking years ago because a strawman of this size would be a phenomenal fire hazard.

2 hours ago, markharju said:

Perverts MUST be stopped.

You're doing exactly what she was doing and rightfully criticised for. You're creating a bogeyman that doesn't exist, and attributing it to all transgender people in order to justify your prejudice.

If you're going to invoke logic and reason as your allies, actually use them please.

[feuergnom 22]

5 hours ago, markharju said:

... so you're okay with adult males being allowed into juvenile girls' spaces because they "identify" as juvenile girls? As billvon says, selective outrage is a big thing these days, but perhaps it's justified when shtf like this. Perverts MUST be stopped. I don't give a fuck about their feewings. Edit to add: I think 2020 will be remembered by history as a very dark time; not just because of the 'Rona but also because it was when the Cult of the Individual reached nauseating extremes.

It is apparent that you do not have any clue what sexual identity is all about. Maybe you should give yourself a chance, get yourself educated on the subject, read a lot of articles and books, then - and only then - you can get into a discussion on the topic. Which by itself is one hell of a complex issue even for a trained sexologist. What you post are just derogatory accusations to put it mildly

[Guest]

28 minutes ago, feuergnom said:

It is apparent that you do not have any clue what sexual identity is all about. Maybe you should give yourself a chance, get yourself educated on the subject, read a lot of articles and books, then - and only then - you can get into a discussion on the topic. Which by itself is one hell of a complex issue even for a trained sexologist. What you post are just derogatory accusations to put it mildly

I. DON'T. CARE. I know right from wrong.

[gowlerk 1,912]

3 minutes ago, markharju said:

I. DON'T. CARE. I know right from wrong.

That is why people with your feelings are losing the battle. You don’t care, even though you know you are wrong. And it frustrates you as you stew in your hatred and anger.

[wmw999 2,121]

11 minutes ago, markharju said:

I. DON'T. CARE. I know right from wrong.

And I know friends and relatives who deserve to go to the bathroom in a place where they feel comfortable and private.

Ladies' room don't have urinals where people undress in public -- there are enclosed booths with doors, and frankly I have no issue with sharing with anyone, of any gender. And I haven't since I was about 19 and first thought about this during the fight for the Equal Rights Amendment.

Wendy P.

[Guest]

35 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

That is why people with your feelings are losing the battle. You don’t care, even though you know you are wrong. And it frustrates you as you stew in your hatred and anger.

What I reserve hatred and anger for are simps who go along with this charade. Consider: If some dude has corporeal dysphoria to the extent that he wants to cut off his own arm or gouge his eyes out, we'd have compassion and intercession. But if he's so fucked up in the head that he wants to cut his own junk off, there are those who demand that society be bulldozed to accommodate such freaks, including the outrageous demand that taxpayers fund the process. THOSE are the ones whom I reserve hate and anger for.

[gowlerk 1,912]

10 minutes ago, markharju said:

THOSE are the ones whom I reserve hate and anger for.

I would pity those myself. I do not understand them at all. But hate and anger? Why? Are them harming you in some way or do you use some other form of justification for your emotions?

[wmw999 2,121]

I’m with Gowlerk; you’re in a diminishing group. If someone has a disorder that requires the amputation of that arm, nobody looks down on them. The disorder is in the body chemistry. It’s extremely real, just as real as disorders that cause schizophrenia. The behavior it causes only affects the afflicted person (and their immediate family, but for financial and emotional reasons), unlike lots of other pathologies. 
If you think depression is real, and not just someone being a loser, if you think schizophrenia is real, and not someone just letting their “inner wild” out, then you’re letting prejudice and fear beat logic in not accepting this as real. 
One of my friends was born with both sets of gender equipment. She lived as a man due to the choice of her parents (including SF military). After being invalided out, she had surgery to reverse her parents’ arbitrary decision at her birth, and is now happy living as the woman she always felt like. 
Is she a sick fuck too? Nope 
Wendy P. 

[feuergnom 22]

12 minutes ago, markharju said:

What I reserve hatred and anger for are simps who go along with this charade. Consider: If some dude has corporeal dysphoria to the extent that he wants to cut off his own arm or gouge his eyes out, we'd have compassion and intercession. But if he's so fucked up in the head that he wants to cut his own junk off, there are those who demand that society be bulldozed to accommodate such freaks, including the outrageous demand that taxpayers fund the process. THOSE are the ones whom I reserve hate and anger for.

So basically you are telling me and everybody else here that you don't want to enter even an educated conversation?

In the futile attempt to give you just another perspective: how about transgender females? Do they also fall into your group of perverts sneaking into the opposite sexes loos to get one off? Probably not because they have no "junk to get cut off"... 

 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, wmw999 said:

If you think depression is real, and not just someone being a loser, if you think schizophrenia is real, and not someone just letting their “inner wild” out, then you’re letting prejudice and fear beat logic in not accepting this as real. 

Wendy P. 

I do accept gender dysphoria as real. It's just as real as the others (see DSM 5) - I just don't believe that the streets should be repaved to accommodate them. They should be treated, not pandered to (or financed with tax dollars, or allowed to share space with REAL women, their feelings be damned. I think the feelings of the WOMEN should be considered first and last [BTW - here we see the REAL "War On Women"]). Furthermore, I don't question those who can demonstrate true pathology versus those who are gaming the system for their own personal advantage. This is why I think that early on in his administration, Trump should have come out as a tranny. He would have won the intersectional sweepstakes and been spared a lot of the flak he took. Okay, that last bit was a gag.

[gowlerk 1,912]

12 minutes ago, markharju said:

Furthermore, I don't question those who can demonstrate true pathology versus those who are gaming the system for their own personal advantage.

I'm not sure there is an advantage to be gained by playing this game. Do you have any examples of that?