Comey's testimony

[billvon 2,454]

>BTW, without proof you believe Comey.

And now we have proof - coming from Trump's own son. And it came during a FOX News interview.

"You and I both know my father a long time. When he tells you to do something, guess what? There's no ambiguity in it. There's no: 'Hey, I'm hoping — you and I are friends. Hey I hope this happens, but you've got to do your job.' That's what he told Comey. And for this guy, as a politician, to then go back and write a memo, 'Oh, I felt threatened.' He felt so threatened, but he didn't do anything."

So quick! Time to move on to step 2: "It doesn't matter."

[SkyDekker 1,150]

Looks like Gingrich has gone from praising Mueller and calling him a superb choice with an impeccable reputation for honesty and integrity, to now saying people are delusional if they think he is going to be fair.

[billvon 2,454]

Actual quotes from Gingrich:

May 17 - Robert Mueller is superb choice to be special counsel. His reputation is impeccable for honesty and integrity. Media should now calm down.

June 12 - Republicans are delusional if they think the special counsel is going to be fair. Look who he is hiring. Check fec reports. Time to rethink.

Don't see what the big deal is. Trump can just fire him if he starts getting too close to the truth.

[rushmc 18]

billvon

>BTW, without proof you believe Comey.

And now we have proof - coming from Trump's own son. And it came during a FOX News interview.

"You and I both know my father a long time. When he tells you to do something, guess what? There's no ambiguity in it. There's no: 'Hey, I'm hoping — you and I are friends. Hey I hope this happens, but you've got to do your job.' That's what he told Comey. And for this guy, as a politician, to then go back and write a memo, 'Oh, I felt threatened.' He felt so threatened, but he didn't do anything."

So quick! Time to move on to step 2: "It doesn't matter."

where the hell you come up with proof is beyond anything......

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 18]

billvon

Don't see what the big deal is. Trump can just fire him if he starts getting too close to the truth.

Legally so.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 2,454]

>where the hell you come up with proof is beyond anything......

Direct testimony from someone with knowledge of the issue is indeed considered proof.

[rushmc 18]

billvon

>where the hell you come up with proof is beyond anything......

Direct testimony from someone with knowledge of the issue is indeed considered proof.

You quoted an interview on FOX.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 2,454]

>You quoted an interview on FOX.

I quoted Donald Trump Jr's words on FOX.

Here's how it would play out in an actual perjury trial:

Prosecution: Mr. Trump, we heard testimony under oath from your father that he never suggested that Comey drop the case. Did you hear him say anything about that after he spoke to Comey?

Trump Jr: Yes, he spoke about it afterwards. He was hoping Comey would drop the case. He said "I hope this happens, but you've got to do your job."

Prosecution: Thank you, Mr. Trump.

That would be considered proof. Would it be enough to convict? That would be up to the jury (or the senate, or wherever the case was being heard.)

[SkyDekker 1,150]

rushmc

***

Don't see what the big deal is. Trump can just fire him if he starts getting too close to the truth.

Legally so.

Uhmm, no. He can't legally fire Mueller. Technically only the guy who hired Mueller can fire him. That would be Rosenstein.

So he would either have to convince Rosenstein, or fire Rosenstein and replace him with somebody who is willing to fire Mueller.

Which is roughly what Nixon did.

[billvon 2,454]

>Uhmm, no. He can't legally fire Mueller.

That's never stopped him before. And after all, as you mention, Nixon figured a way around that.

[yoink 321]

rushmc

***>where the hell you come up with proof is beyond anything......

Direct testimony from someone with knowledge of the issue is indeed considered proof.

You quoted an interview on FOX.

Just so we know,

Washington Post,
BBC,
CNN
are all unacceptable news outlets to draw news from.

We should add FOX to that list?

Which are the current believable news outlets of the day, rush?

[rushmc 18]

SkyDekker

******

Don't see what the big deal is. Trump can just fire him if he starts getting too close to the truth.

Legally so.

Uhmm, no. He can't legally fire Mueller. Technically only the guy who hired Mueller can fire him. That would be Rosenstein.

So he would either have to convince Rosenstein, or fire Rosenstein and replace him with somebody who is willing to fire Mueller.

Which is roughly what Nixon did.

You are wrong.
He can fire him.

That said, it would be a very bad idea IMO.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 18]

billvon

>You quoted an interview on FOX.

I quoted Donald Trump Jr's words on FOX.

Here's how it would play out in an actual perjury trial:

Prosecution: Mr. Trump, we heard testimony under oath from your father that he never suggested that Comey drop the case. Did you hear him say anything about that after he spoke to Comey?

Trump Jr: Yes, he spoke about it afterwards. He was hoping Comey would drop the case. He said "I hope this happens, but you've got to do your job."

Prosecution: Thank you, Mr. Trump.

That would be considered proof. Would it be enough to convict? That would be up to the jury (or the senate, or wherever the case was being heard.)

this would never make it to court.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[SkyDekker 1,150]

Quote

You are wrong.
He can fire him.

From:

https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=10f14c3360b6889df610167cf32ebd62&mc=true&tpl=/ecfrbrowse/Title28/28cfrv2_02.tpl#600

Quote

The Special Counsel may be disciplined or removed from office only by the personal action of the Attorney General. The Attorney General may remove a Special Counsel for misconduct, dereliction of duty, incapacity, conflict of interest, or for other good cause, including violation of Departmental policies. The Attorney General shall inform the Special Counsel in writing of the specific reason for his or her removal.

So no, the President cannot. The AG, or in this case the Deputy AG, since the AG has recused himself, can.

Does it hurt to be wrong that much or is ignorance bliss?

[rushmc 18]

SkyDekker

Quote

You are wrong.
He can fire him.

From:

https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=10f14c3360b6889df610167cf32ebd62&mc=true&tpl=/ecfrbrowse/Title28/28cfrv2_02.tpl#600

***The Special Counsel may be disciplined or removed from office only by the personal action of the Attorney General. The Attorney General may remove a Special Counsel for misconduct, dereliction of duty, incapacity, conflict of interest, or for other good cause, including violation of Departmental policies. The Attorney General shall inform the Special Counsel in writing of the specific reason for his or her removal.

So no, the President cannot. The AG, or in this case the Deputy AG, since the AG has recused himself, can.

Does it hurt to be wrong that much or is ignorance bliss?

then there are a whole bunch of lawyers wrong. Including some on CNN ABC FOX and others.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[gowlerk 1,943]

From my favourite news source, NPR.

Quote

Mueller was appointed by Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein. Justice Department rules prohibit the dismissal of a special counsel without cause. It's unclear whether the president could override those rules and order Rosenstein to fire Mueller.

https://www.mprnews.org/story/2017/06/13/npr-trump-weighs-firing-mueller-according-to-confidance

This story sounds like the classic "trial balloon". Who knows?

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[rushmc 18]

gowlerk

From my favourite news source, NPR.

Quote

Mueller was appointed by Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein. Justice Department rules prohibit the dismissal of a special counsel without cause. It's unclear whether the president could override those rules and order Rosenstein to fire Mueller.

https://www.mprnews.org/story/2017/06/13/npr-trump-weighs-firing-mueller-according-to-confidance

This story sounds like the classic "trial balloon". Who knows?

Agreed.


and a bad idea to begin with just for the optics of it if nothing else.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 2,454]

>You are wrong.
>He can fire him.

No, he can't. He can tell the AG to fire him - and if the AG refuses, fire the AG and then tell the next person in line to fire him. That _might_ work.

Of course that also got Nixon impeached.

[TriGirl 278]

gowlerk

From my favourite news source, NPR.

Quote

Mueller was appointed by Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein. Justice Department rules prohibit the dismissal of a special counsel without cause. It's unclear whether the president could override those rules and order Rosenstein to fire Mueller.

https://www.mprnews.org/story/2017/06/13/npr-trump-weighs-firing-mueller-according-to-confidance

This story sounds like the classic "trial balloon". Who knows?

a) what is MPR?
b) I've been wondering whether this is a fake news story perpetrated by the "friend." He is, after all, the CEO of Newsmax.

See the upside, and always wear your parachute! -- Christopher Titus

Shut Up & Jump!

[gowlerk 1,943]

Quote

a) what is MPR?

Minnesota Public Radio, my go to NPR affiliate.


As for the other part. Maybe, who knows?

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[TriGirl 278]

From news reports this morning:

http://www.cnn.com/2017/06/13/politics/chris-ruddy-bob-mueller-trump/index.html

Quote

"I think he's considering perhaps terminating the special counsel. I think he's weighing that option."
The White House made clear -- albeit not all that quickly -- that Ruddy never met with President Trump on Monday and is, essentially, freelancing.

and

Quote

Ruddy hit back Tuesday morning in a statement via Politico's Playbook:
"Spicer issued a bizarre late night press release that a) doesn't deny my claim the President is considering firing Mueller and b) says I didn't speak to the President about the matter -- when I never claimed to have done so. Memo to Sean: focus your efforts on exposing the flim-flam Russian allegations against POTUS and highlighting his remarkable achievements! Don't waste time trying to undermine one of your few allies."

(bolding mine)

Point being, he intimated that his good friend was considering this move, so the media took the bait and talked about it endlessly yesterday. Then today, "well, I never said he actually told me that."

So NOT the way to run a government. Or a news cycle, for that matter.

See the upside, and always wear your parachute! -- Christopher Titus

Shut Up & Jump!

[lummy 4]

ROT ROOOW


Trump is under investigation for Obstruction of justice...

I promise not to TP Davis under canopy.. I promise not to TP Davis under canopy.. eat sushi, get smoochieTTK#1

[billvon 2,454]

And it's not just some left winger out to get him this time. This is a Republican who was appointed to lead the FBI by GWB himself. Even Trump's own people are putting the blame for this development squarely where it belongs - on Trump himself.
==========================================================
Even Trump’s Aides Blame Him for Obstruction Probe: ‘President Did This to Himself’

Trump ‘shot himself in the foot again with this cockamamie scheme to get Mueller to play ball.’

Lachlan Markay
06.14.17 9:50 PM ET
Daily Beast

It’s exactly the circumstance Donald Trump tried to avoid. But Trump’s own actions have made an FBI investigation into the president himself a reality.

Firing James Comey, the FBI director, was, by Trump’s explanation, a way to stop a “witch hunt” against his team’s alleged ties to Russia. It led, within weeks, to the appointment of a special prosecutor, Comey’s FBI predecessor, Robert Mueller. And now Mueller is investigating Trump himself for possible obstruction of justice—by firing Comey, who had led the FBI inquiry.

With the crisis engulfing Trump’s young presidency intensifying, senators, Trump aides, former prosecutors, and FBI veterans are sending the White House an urgent warning: Whatever you do, don’t. Fire. Mueller.

. . .

Trump reportedly floated the possibility of firing Mueller as a way to prod him toward exonerating the president and other Trump associates party to the investigation. The New York Times reported on Tuesday that aides dissuaded him from doing so.

For Ali Soufan, a retired FBI counterterrorism agent, word that Trump is now a target of Mueller’s inquiry explains the trial balloon.

“No wonder President Trump and his surrogates are getting nervous. This explains their sudden attacks on Mueller and the threats to fire him,” Soufan told The Daily Beast.

. . .

But some privately concede that Trump is so unpredictable—and so frustrated with the persistence of the investigation and its cost in political capital—that they’re not ruling it out. Another White House official conceded that it would be “suicide” if Trump sacked Mueller at this point, but “I’d be insincere if I said it wasn’t a concern that the president would try to do it anyway.”

For now, officials are simply concerned with limiting fallout from what is sure to be a thunderous reaction from the president to news that he is personally the target of the FBI’s probe.

Asked what the internal game plan should be, one senior Trump administration official replied, “Keep him away from Twitter, dear God, keep him away from Twitter.”

“The president did this to himself,” the official added.
===========================

[normiss 635]

Trump's Tweet:

They made up a phony collusion with the Russians story, found zero proof, so now they go for obstruction of justice on the phony story. Nice

Followed by:

You are witnessing the single greatest WITCH HUNT in American political history - led by some very bad and conflicted people! #MAGA

[gowlerk 1,943]

Lock him up! Lock him up! Lock him up!.........

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.