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QuoteQuoteI prefer to give the scientists credit here, perhaps with a few exceptions like the Manhattan Project.
Tell it to popsjumper. He seems to think scientists are corrupted by politicians but not by big oil, big coal, big electricity...
Wrong again.
Thanks for the mind-reading fail. It was funny. Pathetic, but funny.
My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239
QuoteLet's check back on Dec. 31, 2040 to see what the climate has been like the last 30 years. Will it be warmer or cooler or stable?
Of course, what are you both willing to put up for it? Kind of like the Ehrlich bet...
Hey! Can you speed things up a little? 30 years from now my world is going to be either...
-a cold, dirty world, or
-a hot-as-hell world, or
-a very small chance of a warm, clean, sunny, wonderful world
...or somewhere in between depending on your religious views.
My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239
QuoteLike jet engines, lasers, GPS...
Yeah, Serendipity Happens.
My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239
kallend 1,853
Quote[Reply]Less ice extent but more/thicker ice equals no net loss (I generalize for a point here) And as lawrocket has posted so well the reasons are varied and many
By far the dominant factor in Arctic ice extent is wind. Since the ice isn't anchored it goes where the winds blow it.
Another thing is the way ice is formed over the ocean - an entirely different mechanism than over land. Ice over land forms by precipitation. Ocean ice forms by freezing ocean water with cold air. The formation of ice insulates further ice accretion. If there's no wind, ice will be extensive but thin. Wind will make it thick and lacking extent. (Other factors operate, of course. Ten foot seas can break up a thin ice cover, but without wind that doesn't happen).
A good couple of weeks of storms can also slow ice accretion. We all know that cloudless nights are colder than cloudy nights (which is the greenhouse effect!). What will accrete ice on land will prevent it on the ocean. But one must also consider that ice will still form over the ocean when it's minus 10.
Yet another thing to consider is the what the poles tell us. A fifteen degree increase in winter temperature at on Antarctica in the winter would be countered by a half a degree drop in temperature at the equator is we look at overall heat budget. (Of course, this is why the research focuses on the poles - slight changes are most pronounced there). And the oceans are different from land in that you won't find much greenhouse effect in winter over land where the sun ain't shining. Oceans transport energy. Thus, a change in circulation or even normal oscillation can dramatically affect ice formation.
But - to suggest that decreasing ice in the Arctic is due to global warming is rather simplistic. There is a helluva lot more going on. I.e., the winds may be a changin'.
Why would the winds be changing?
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
kallend 1,853
QuoteQuoteLike jet engines, lasers, GPS...
Yeah, Serendipity Happens.
It appears that you have
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
Kennedy 0
See "Enviro-Prediction" thread. Our guess is as good, or better than, grant funded scientists.
witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*
This is, perhaps, the greatest suggestion I've seen. After all, arguing over who will be right and or wrong about the climate in 30 years is pretty silly. Paul - you've got yours. Marc has his. Let's check back on Dec. 31, 2040 to see what the climate has been like the last 30 years. Will it be warmer or cooler or stable?
Of course, what are you both willing to put up for it? Kind of like the Ehrlich bet...
My wife is hotter than your wife.
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