RonD1120 58 #201 May 22, 2010 Just returned from a week in the woods and received these video links in my Email. QuoteAccording to the Border Patrol the public is being mislead as to WHO is coming into the US from Mexico. This IS THE TRUTH. as reported by WSBTV in Atlanta. Video 1 http://www.wsbtv.com/video/23438021/index.html Video 2 http://www.wsbtv.com/video/23438712/index.html Back in 1976 I did some recon in this area. It was scary then, don't know if I would even enter that territory alone in these times.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #202 May 22, 2010 QuoteJust returned from a week in the woods and received these video links in my Email. QuoteAccording to the Border Patrol the public is being mislead as to WHO is coming into the US from Mexico. This IS THE TRUTH. as reported by WSBTV in Atlanta. Video 1 http://www.wsbtv.com/video/23438021/index.html Video 2 http://www.wsbtv.com/video/23438712/index.html Back in 1976 I did some recon in this area. It was scary then, don't know if I would even enter that territory alone in these times. Thanks for posting that! People need their eyes opened. If, we continue to maintain this 'open door' policy, there's no telling what can happen. If, cheap labor and big money for big business is more important than our country, something is dreadfully wrong. If, carrying my birth certificate with me can help secure our nation... I don't have a problem with that. I don't have the slightest fear that the U.S. will become a 'police state', either. People need to wake-up and 'see' what is really happening. I'm afraid, it's 'all about the money'. Looks to me like, too many people in this country would rather have wealth than a 'secure' nation. Let me put it this way... I've never seen a luggage rack on a hearse! Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GeorgiaDon 340 #203 May 22, 2010 Quote If, carrying my birth certificate with me can help secure our nation...I don't have a problem with the idea that one should be able to verify identity and citizenship when one is arrested or otherwise legally detained for proper cause. But do you really think a "birth certificate" is adequate? If illegals are easily able to obtain realistic-looking driver's licenses and social security cards, how hard could it be to manufacture a birth certificate? There are web sites where you can print up an Obama birth certificate with any place of birth you want, and they look pretty good too. Demanding to see an easily faked certificate as "proof of citizenship" will be as successful a barrier to illegal immigration as is taking off your shoes while going through airport security. Something more rigorous will be needed, but the conservatives in this country are dead set against anything resembling a national identity card. Also in my case, as a naturalized citizen, my birth certificate would just show that I was born in Canada. My naturalization certificate is a 11" x 9" piece of paper with photos and embossed seals attached. The paperwork that came with it makes it clear that it is invalidated as proof of citizenship if it is folded or creased. It is also illegal to make copies, although curiously at the the naturalization ceremony we were advised to make copies and keep them in a safe place in case the original was damaged. Anyway my point is, how the hell am I supposed to carry around with me at all times an unfolded 11" x 9" sheet of paper, so that I can prove citizenship on the spot if required? By the way the government does not issue wallet-sized naturalization cards, unlike the "green cards". So in effect if I want to visit Arizona, for example, I am forced to obtain and carry in my pocket at all times a US passport, even though I am a US citizen and not planning on leaving the country. A national ID card, designed to resist counterfeiting, would be more secure and more convenient if we want to really be able to verify citizenship, IMHO. Don_____________________________________ Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996) “Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #204 May 22, 2010 QuoteSo in effect if I want to visit Arizona, for example, I am forced to obtain and carry in my pocket at all times a US passport, even though I am a US citizen and not planning on leaving the country. No, you don't, as shown in the other thread. QuoteA national ID card, designed to resist counterfeiting, would be more secure and more convenient if we want to really be able to verify citizenship, IMHO. So, you're simultaneously complaining that you have to carry 'federal ID' to visit Arizona, and advocating that fed.gov issue 'federal ID' to everyone? Sorta contradicting yourself, don't you think?Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,644 #205 May 22, 2010 Quote If, carrying my birth certificate with me can help secure our nation... I don't have a problem with that. http://www.fake-documents.com/fake_birth_certificate.htm Quote I don't have the slightest fear that the U.S. will become a 'police state', either. I don't think the average German thought that on January 30, 1933, either.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #206 May 22, 2010 I was using a birth cirtificate only as an example. A national ID card would be great. Folks could surely, squeeze that in amongst all their credit cards. not to mention, the simplicity of a national ID card. I can go with that. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #207 May 22, 2010 QuoteQuote If, carrying my birth certificate with me can help secure our nation... I don't have a problem with that. http://www.fake-documents.com/fake_birth_certificate.htm Quote I don't have the slightest fear that the U.S. will become a 'police state', either. I don't think the average German thought that on January 30, 1933, either. I do believe, we've learned from that and besides, there's too many out there to remind us. I realize, anything can happen but spreading fear doesn't help. If, people would use their heads for more than a hat-rack, things might be better. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #208 May 22, 2010 QuoteI was using a birth cirtificate only as an example. A national ID card would be great. Folks could surely, squeeze that in amongst all their credit cards. not to mention, the simplicity of a national ID card. I can go with that. Chuck Article IV, Section 1 of the Constitution - the "Full Faith and Credit" clause. "Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state." That means that your driver's license (or other state-issued ID) *is* your "national ID card".Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #209 May 22, 2010 QuoteQuoteI was using a birth cirtificate only as an example. A national ID card would be great. Folks could surely, squeeze that in amongst all their credit cards. not to mention, the simplicity of a national ID card. I can go with that. Chuck Article IV, Section 1 of the Constitution - the "Full Faith and Credit" clause. "Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state." That means that your driver's license (or other state-issued ID) *is* your "national ID card". Thank you, Mike!!! That about sums it up. So, what seems to be some people's problem? edit to add: Atta boy! doin' your homework, doin your homework... Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #210 May 22, 2010 QuoteQuoteQuoteI was using a birth cirtificate only as an example. A national ID card would be great. Folks could surely, squeeze that in amongst all their credit cards. not to mention, the simplicity of a national ID card. I can go with that. Chuck Article IV, Section 1 of the Constitution - the "Full Faith and Credit" clause. "Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state." That means that your driver's license (or other state-issued ID) *is* your "national ID card". Thank you, Mike!!! That about sums it up. So, what seems to be some people's problem? Chuck Well, it's not a perfect solution - *any* form of ID can be faked, given time.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #211 May 22, 2010 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteI was using a birth cirtificate only as an example. A national ID card would be great. Folks could surely, squeeze that in amongst all their credit cards. not to mention, the simplicity of a national ID card. I can go with that. Chuck Article IV, Section 1 of the Constitution - the "Full Faith and Credit" clause. "Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state." That means that your driver's license (or other state-issued ID) *is* your "national ID card". Thank you, Mike!!! That about sums it up. So, what seems to be some people's problem? Chuck Well, it's not a perfect solution - *any* form of ID can be faked, given time. True story! Surely, our government could come-up with something with at least a high level of difficulty to copy!? I feel, we really need to do something... at least Arizona has stood-up! Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #212 May 22, 2010 QuoteTrue story! Surely, our government could come-up with something with at least a high level of difficulty to copy!? I feel, we really need to do something... at least Arizona has stood-up! Chuck It's getting better - counterfeiting is one of the things that drove the hologram seals that you now see on some DL's.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #213 May 22, 2010 QuoteQuoteTrue story! Surely, our government could come-up with something with at least a high level of difficulty to copy!? I feel, we really need to do something... at least Arizona has stood-up! Chuck It's getting better - counterfeiting is one of the things that drove the hologram seals that you now see on some DL's. Yes, sir. A digit print wouldn't hurt, either. I just hate seeing what a lot of folks are 'allowing' to happen to this great country of ours for whatever selfish reason they might have for not 'sealing' our border. The average American doesn't have a clue as to who sneaks into this country. We're absolutely spoiled rotten and anything that just might disrupt heir every day lives in the slightest, is like the end of the world to them. We need a 'common sense' approach to the problem and quit letting us be led around by the nose. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #214 May 22, 2010 QuoteQuoteQuoteTrue story! Surely, our government could come-up with something with at least a high level of difficulty to copy!? I feel, we really need to do something... at least Arizona has stood-up! Chuck It's getting better - counterfeiting is one of the things that drove the hologram seals that you now see on some DL's. Yes, sir. A digit print wouldn't hurt, either. I just hate seeing what a lot of folks are 'allowing' to happen to this great country of ours for whatever selfish reason they might have for not 'sealing' our border. The average American doesn't have a clue as to who sneaks into this country. We're absolutely spoiled rotten and anything that just might disrupt heir every day lives in the slightest, is like the end of the world to them. We need a 'common sense' approach to the problem and quit letting us be led around by the nose. Chuck I recall reading something about adding fingerprint biometrics to DL's in various states, but I don't know it was implemented. While it sounds good on paper, biometrics is only of any benefit to state/federal agents - Mom & Pop's Corner Grocery isn't going to have a license scanner anytime soon. I won't even make mention of the problems with securing that type of database - look at the leaks of SS data, VA data and the like over the last several years. Now, take a database that has all your biometric info, driving record, medical record, tax/credit record info, etc etc etc and think of the consequences if *that* gets hacked...Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #215 May 22, 2010 I'm sure, there's a lot of what 'if's' but we can't let the situation continue. It would more than likely cost what's left of the 'mom 'n pop' stores to get 'up-dated' but I'm sure, the big guys could afford it. Possibly, if a 'mom 'n pop' store had a question, a simple phone call to the local PD or SO? If, the person presenting a questionable ID-card, bolts for the door during the course of the phone call... dead give-away!Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,644 #216 May 22, 2010 QuoteQuoteI was using a birth cirtificate only as an example. A national ID card would be great. Folks could surely, squeeze that in amongst all their credit cards. not to mention, the simplicity of a national ID card. I can go with that. Chuck Article IV, Section 1 of the Constitution - the "Full Faith and Credit" clause. "Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state." That means that your driver's license (or other state-issued ID) *is* your "national ID card". Yes indeed. I don't recall being asked for any proof of identity when I got my first US drivers license beyond a couple of utility bills with my address on. Of course, that was a while ago.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #217 May 23, 2010 QuoteQuoteQuoteI was using a birth cirtificate only as an example. A national ID card would be great. Folks could surely, squeeze that in amongst all their credit cards. not to mention, the simplicity of a national ID card. I can go with that. Chuck Article IV, Section 1 of the Constitution - the "Full Faith and Credit" clause. "Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state." That means that your driver's license (or other state-issued ID) *is* your "national ID card". Yes indeed. I don't recall being asked for any proof of identity when I got my first US drivers license beyond a couple of utility bills with my address on. Of course, that was a while ago. I had to show my birth certificate. That, was a looong time ago. How things have changed. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Southern_Man 0 #218 May 23, 2010 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteI was using a birth cirtificate only as an example. A national ID card would be great. Folks could surely, squeeze that in amongst all their credit cards. not to mention, the simplicity of a national ID card. I can go with that. Chuck Article IV, Section 1 of the Constitution - the "Full Faith and Credit" clause. "Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state." That means that your driver's license (or other state-issued ID) *is* your "national ID card". Yes indeed. I don't recall being asked for any proof of identity when I got my first US drivers license beyond a couple of utility bills with my address on. Of course, that was a while ago. I had to show my birth certificate. That, was a looong time ago. How things have changed. Chuck Not every state restricts driver's licenses to citizenship. It may (is supposed to be) proof of identity. There is also no requirement for anybody (citizen) to have a driver's license or state issued ID card."What if there were no hypothetical questions?" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhaig 0 #219 May 23, 2010 Quote I don't recall being asked for any proof of identity when I got my first US drivers license beyond a couple of utility bills with my address on. Of course, that was a while ago. 26 years ago I showed up with my birth certificate. Ever since (until the most recent renewal) the previous license was sufficient. This time I needed my social security card, passport, or birth certificate to confirm citizenship. I know how easy it is to fake 2 of the three, but that's what we have right now.-- Rob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,644 #220 May 23, 2010 Quote Not every state restricts driver's licenses to citizenship. It may (is supposed to be) proof of identity. I thought it was supposed to be permission to drive a vehicle on public roads.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhaig 0 #221 May 23, 2010 QuoteQuote Not every state restricts driver's licenses to citizenship. It may (is supposed to be) proof of identity. I thought it was supposed to be permission to drive a vehicle on public roads. every state I've ever lived in, a DL has also had the second purpose of being a legal identification card. Perhaps the state you live in is different. (yes, the word "state" has another meaning that could be used in that sentence)-- Rob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #222 May 23, 2010 QuoteQuote Not every state restricts driver's licenses to citizenship. It may (is supposed to be) proof of identity. I thought it was supposed to be permission to drive a vehicle on public roads. You know damn well that a Drivers License serves multiple purposes in modern society. It's more than just one of the three pieces of ID one must have in their possession when they take their vehicle out on public roads. A Drivers License is used for all sorts of identification purposes, not just driving. This whole immigration debate is sad. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Very few people want the "your papers please" society, but the open door who cares who is in the country policy is a cancer to the USA. How many people from around the world have walked into the USA via it's back door? It's not just the hispanics who are crossing the Mexican/Canadian/US borders who you should be worried about. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #223 May 23, 2010 You know damn well that a Drivers License serves multiple purposes in modern society. It's more than just one of the three pieces of ID one must have in their possession when they take their vehicle out on public roads. A Drivers License is used for all sorts of identification purposes, not just driving. This whole immigration debate is sad. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Very few people want the "your papers please" society, but the open door who cares who is in the country policy is a cancer to the USA. How many people from around the world have walked into the USA via it's back door? It's not just the hispanics who are crossing the Mexican/Canadian/US borders who you should be worried about. Exactly right! The general population has absolutely no idea who is sneaking into this country or where they are from. Granted, the majority are Hispanics but what about those who sneak in from the Middle East and elsewhere. Too many people in this country think that all the illegals are just very poor folks looking to pick avocados, How naive. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tkhayes 140 #224 May 23, 2010 wow, this thread is still going?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #225 May 23, 2010 Quotewow, this thread is still going?? Glad you're back. We need some pale Canucks to bash. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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