Freedom OF religion means freedom FROM religion

[frequentfaller 0]

Quote

Quote

the only reality we know is perishable.

You know im going to say that is the only reality you know right? irregardless... You are saying life is perishable are you not? I would like to know how you know that? And yes, I will listen.

visit a morgue or a graveyard.

Born ok 1st time.

[rynodigsmusic 0]

Quote

visit a morgue or a graveyard.

What about a nursery or infant delivery room? You cant kill life man... unless you believe you can I guess.

"We didn't start the fire"

[frequentfaller 0]

Quote

Quote

visit a morgue or a graveyard.

What about a nursery or infant delivery room? You cant kill life man... unless you believe you can I guess.

i dont kill anything, well cockroaches, mosquitos. sometimes babies die too.

Born ok 1st time.

[rynodigsmusic 0]

Quote

i dont kill anything, well cockroaches, mosquitos. sometimes babies die too.

I kill mosquitoes too... see, we do have something in common

Babies just leave early is all, but even they still have an impact in life no matter how "brief".

"We didn't start the fire"

[maadmax 0]

Ethics is a by product. Ok so if god commanded you to commit genocide would you put your ethical by product a side and do it ? or would you refuse his command and separate yourself from god?

[zagijimzoo 0]

Quote

Quote

visit a morgue or a graveyard.

What about a nursery or infant delivery room? You cant kill life man... unless you believe you can I guess.

tell that to the dinosaurs

Your "loving god" has a plan for you! In his little creation book he plans to turn the sun into a red giant and vaporize planet earth!

Now there's a great idea!

but in the mean time he just enjoys watching us suffer and die from earthquakes, hurricanes, floods, cancer, starvation, lifetime depression, suicides, murdering one’s whole family, burning alive, suffocation, throat cancer, liver transplant rejections, child rape….did I miss anything? Oh…torture….yeah I knew there was another one.
The caltholic church learned in the middle ages that a human being could live until all the skin was peeled down!

just a brilliant, well thought out, intelligent design! i don't see any room for improvements! If I was going to create a universe those would be at the top of my list…NOT. Why would anyone worship or preach to a creator of such a horrible non-loving design? i'd be the last one to admit my "god" was responable for creating all this pain and suffering!

That’s just the way it is!

[jclalor 12]

Quote

but in the mean time he just enjoys watching us suffer and die from earthquakes, hurricanes, floods, cancer, starvation, lifetime depression, suicides, murdering one’s whole family, burning alive, suffocation, throat cancer, liver transplant rejections, child rape….did I miss anything?

Early male pattern balding.

[philh 0]

Quote

Ethics is a by product. Ok so if god commanded you to commit genocide would you put your ethical by product a side and do it ? or would you refuse his command and separate yourself from god?

Not to deflect your question, but in the evolution of spiritual consciousness, protocols that enabled mans relationship with God have changed over time. God's essence of Love and Truth remain the same and never changes. Dispensations is how it is depicted theologicaly. Whole sale military conquest was in play during the age of the Law when the tribes of Judah were taking the land allocated to them by God. In this current age of Grace, land and nation building is not an issue. The Kingdom of Heaven ,described by Christ, is not of this earth. Therefore any such command would not be from God. So no, I would not comply or ever condone genocide. We are all sinners and on equal footing before God. Our only hope is to find salvation through the Grace of Jesus Christ.


...

[kallend 1,623]

Quote

Ethics is a by product. Ok so if god commanded you to commit genocide would you put your ethical by product a side and do it ? or would you refuse his command and separate yourself from god?

Not to deflect your question, but in the evolution of spiritual consciousness, protocols that enabled mans relaltionship with God have changed over time. God's essence of Love and Truth remain the same and never changes. Dispensations is how it is depicted theologicaly. Whole sale military conquest was in play during the age of the Law when the tribes of Judah were taking the land allocated to them by God. In this current age of Grace, land and nation building is not an issue. The Kingdom of Heaven ,described by Christ, is not of this earth. Therefore any such command would not be from God. So no, I would not comply or ever condone genocide. We are all sinners and on equal footing before God. Our only hope is to find salvation through the Grace of Jesus Christ.


...

[maadmax 0]

--Your "loving god" has a plan for you! In his little creation book he plans to turn the sun into a red giant and vaporize planet earth!

--Now there's a great idea!

[rynodigsmusic 0]

Quote

tell that to the dinosaurs> Your "loving god" has a plan for you! In his little creation book he plans to turn the sun into a red giant and vaporize planet earth! Now there's a great idea!

I dont really think your listening too well. respectively. Life, not what life gives life to, by its very nature, cannot die. Your very definition and explaination of evolution have proven this. Not only that, life has been revealing more and more of its power throughout existance. To the point where the human mind is due to be occupied by its greatest revelation, God. That is, everyone will be like Jesus inevitably. Nothing will be impossible for this new creation.

3it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power; 44it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. 45So it is written: "The first man Adam became a living being"[a]; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit.

"Behold, I will create new heavens and a new earth. The former things will not be remembered, nor will they come to mind.

Quote

but in the mean time he just enjoys watching us suffer and die from earthquakes, hurricanes, floods, cancer, starvation, lifetime depression, suicides, murdering one’s whole family, burning alive, suffocation, throat cancer, liver transplant rejections, child rape….did I miss anything? Oh…torture….yeah I knew there was another one.
The caltholic church learned in the middle ages that a human being could live until all the skin was peeled down!
just a brilliant, well thought out, intelligent design! i don't see any room for improvements! If I was going to create a universe those would be at the top of my list…NOT. Why would anyone worship or preach to a creator of such a horrible non-loving design? i'd be the last one to admit my "god" was responable for creating all this pain and suffering!

This type of thinking is futile at best. It will not be the heart of the future. It is full of blame. Let me ask you something. Do you praise God for the good things in your life with the same measure you blame him for the bad? Why not?

Not only that. Did you bring yourself to life, or did life bring you to life. Are you going to blame God for giving you life as well? Does your search for understanding and truth simply die at the dinosaurs and blame? Respectively.

"We didn't start the fire"

[maadmax 0]

Land and nation building is an issue right now, it may have escaped your notice but there's a bit of a quarrel over the very land you say was allocated by god to the tribes of Judah. The problem is some of the people who are of those tribes don't think they've currently got all the land that was promised to them. The other side of course think the same land is holy to them and there plenty of Christians who are looking for a big battle so they hurry along the end times.
t seems to me you can't deny that god has commanded genocide in the past yet this was ok because it was a "time of law"? That seems a bizarre defence of genocide. God commanded in the past , how arrogant is it of you to know his mind and his will and be sure he wont command it in the future?
Was god displaying his " essence of Love and Truth (which)remain the same and never changes. " when he was with Joshua who massacred the people of Jericho. What would you have done if you were there, would you have killed the little children?

Not of all of gods sadistic commands are about military conquest. What about Abraham, god commanded him to kill his son, if you got the same order would you do the same? You might say it would not be consistent with gods plan or his character. But who are you to question his mysterious ways? I suspect the real reason you wouldn't do it as most people you pick and chose the its of the bible you like, in which case why do we need the bible in the first place?

[kallend 1,623]

Quote

Land and nation building is an issue right now, it may have escaped your notice but there's a bit of a quarrel over the very land you say was allocated by god to the tribes of Judah. The problem is some of the people who are of those tribes don't think they've currently got all the land that was promised to them. The other side of course think the same land is holy to them and there plenty of Christians who are looking for a big battle so they hurry along the end times.
t seems to me you can't deny that god has commanded genocide in the past yet this was ok because it was a "time of law"? That seems a bizarre defence of genocide. God commanded in the past , how arrogant is it of you to know his mind and his will and be sure he wont command it in the future?
Was god displaying his " essence of Love and Truth (which)remain the same and never changes. " when he was with Joshua who massacred the people of Jericho. What would you have done if you were there, would you have killed the little children?

Not of all of gods sadistic commands are about military conquest. What about Abraham, god commanded him to kill his son, if you got the same order would you do the same? You might say it would not be consistent with gods plan or his character. But who are you to question his mysterious ways? I suspect the real reason you wouldn't do it as most people you pick and chose the its of the bible you like, in which case why do we need the bible in the first place?

[rynodigsmusic 0]

Quote

Doesn't it ever occur to you that your entire set of beliefs are predicated on inconsistent rules, inaccurate history, bad logic and neolithic myths?
Maybe the torture and murder of tens of thousands during the Inquisition was your god's purpose, too.

There are plenty of people in this world who do not understand skydiving. Alot of people have died and more will continue to die in this sport. Many have been seriously injured, and lives have been radically changed... Did all those people who paid/pay the "price" for skydiving have no purpose as well?

Why are you so insistant on living in the past? Has this world given us ANY reason to believe it is learning from its past? ANY? So, while you use the past to "educate your dis-belief" and condemn any possible belief in God, why in the hell is the world not using it to establish a more peaceful earth and learn the lessons of a longer and more fulfilling life?

Because most of you insist the world is and should be run by man . How futile to think man is a gift to this earth instead of simply being a part of it. Ill say it again. The earth is not for man, but for life. It is not for man, but for God.

What is more true. That man created nature or that nature created man? And if nature created man, why does man believe he belongs to himself? Is he not at the mercy of nature? So you continue to accuse our faith of lacking in logic due to what you know about the past, not the present. What is more logical? To never learn from the past (as the world clearly has not) or to learn from the past and apply it to the present?

The past tells us that man cannot rule himself.

"We didn't start the fire"

[frequentfaller 0]

Quote

Quote

There are plenty of people in this world who do not understand skydiving. Alot of people have died and more will continue to die in this sport. Many have been seriously injured, and lives have been radically changed... Did all those people who paid/pay the "price" for skydiving have no purpose as well?

purpose for skydiving? fun.

lot more people get killed driving their motorcycles to work.

Born ok 1st time.

• Quote

[kallend 1,623]

Quote

Quote

Doesn't it ever occur to you that your entire set of beliefs are predicated on inconsistent rules, inaccurate history, bad logic and neolithic myths?
Maybe the torture and murder of tens of thousands during the Inquisition was your god's purpose, too.

Why are you so insistant on living in the past? Has this world given us ANY reason to believe it is learning from its past?
.

"Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it". The history of religion in general and Christianity in particular is bloody in the extreme. Not to mention the fact that there is no more evidence to support the existence of your god than there is to support the existence of Zeus, Odin or the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[rynodigsmusic 0]

Quote

"Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it". The history of religion in general and Christianity in particular is bloody in the extreme.

If i knew how to do the strike through thing, I would change your quote to say, "The history of man in general in particular in regards to money, power, and greed, is bloody in the extreme". Nevertheless, how is this a valid response to the questions I asked you?

Do you feel it is right to blame something you dont believe exists to express the same truth I just expressed in the last post? So you blame "God" for the ways of the world, and you justify that blame with the flying spaghetti monster... got it.

Just one last question. How is justifying blame an expression of learning from the past? In fact, how is blame an example of something we should keep in the evolution of mans mind? That is, what good is it? All it does is take the mind off the truth and it is responsible for much more pain and suffering than forgiveness and understanding.

"We didn't start the fire"

[rynodigsmusic 0]

Quote

purpose for skydiving? fun. lot more people get killed driving their motorcycles to work.

sorry man, you missed the point of the comparison.

"We didn't start the fire"

[frequentfaller 0]

Quote

Quote

purpose for skydiving? fun. lot more people get killed driving their motorcycles to work.

sorry man, you missed the point of the comparison.

no, just responding to you're weak comparison.

Born ok 1st time.

[rynodigsmusic 0]

Quote

no, just responding to you're weak comparison.

Really, how so?

"We didn't start the fire"

[philh 0]

Quote

Land and nation building is an issue right now, it may have escaped your notice but there's a bit of a quarrel over the very land you say was allocated by god to the tribes of Judah. The problem is some of the people who are of those tribes don't think they've currently got all the land that was promised to them. The other side of course think the same land is holy to them and there plenty of Christians who are looking for a big battle so they hurry along the end times.
t seems to me you can't deny that god has commanded genocide in the past yet this was ok because it was a "time of law"? That seems a bizarre defence of genocide. God commanded in the past , how arrogant is it of you to know his mind and his will and be sure he wont command it in the future?
Was god displaying his " essence of Love and Truth (which)remain the same and never changes. " when he was with Joshua who massacred the people of Jericho. What would you have done if you were there, would you have killed the little children?

Not of all of gods sadistic commands are about military conquest. What about Abraham, god commanded him to kill his son, if you got the same order would you do the same? You might say it would not be consistent with gods plan or his character. But who are you to question his mysterious ways? I suspect the real reason you wouldn't do it as most people you pick and chose the its of the bible you like, in which case why do we need the bible in the first place?

[frequentfaller 0]

Quote

Quote

no, just responding to you're weak comparison.

Really, how so?

arent you trying to compare skydiving with religion?
"skydivers who have paid with their lives, do they have a purpose?" answer they were having fun, shit happens, they got hurt or killed. there was no purpose in it.

Born ok 1st time.

[rynodigsmusic 0]

Quote

Doesn't it ever occur to you that your entire set of beliefs are predicated on inconsistent rules, inaccurate history, bad logic and neolithic myths? Maybe the torture and murder of tens of thousands during the Inquisition was your god's purpose, too.

There are plenty of people in this world who do not understand skydiving. Alot of people have died and more will continue to die in this sport. Many have been seriously injured, and lives have been radically changed... Did all those people who paid/pay the "price" for skydiving have no purpose as well?

He was trying to express that there was no purpose to the primitive revelation and application of past religious and non religious confrontations. The point is learning from these things have given them purpose. It doesnt seem like anyone has ever died in vain.

"We didn't start the fire"

[kallend 1,623]

Quote

Quote

"Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it". The history of religion in general and Christianity in particular is bloody in the extreme.

If i knew how to do the strike through thing, I would change your quote to say, "The history of man in general in particular in regards to money, power, and greed, is bloody in the extreme". Nevertheless, how is this a valid response to the questions I asked you?

Do you feel it is right to blame something you dont believe exists to express the same truth I just expressed in the last post? .

Don't misquote me to make your point. Religion certainly exists AND its history is bloody in the extreme. The existence of religion is independent of the existence of non-provable supernatural invisible omnipotent omniscient beings.

There is no more evidence for the existence of your god than there is for Zeus, Ganesha, Odin, pink unicorns or the FSM.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[rynodigsmusic 0]

Quote

Maybe the torture and murder of tens of thousands during the Inquisition was your god's purpose, too.

This statement lead me to assume you saw no purpose in the Inquisition. While I agree it is a very extreme measure of the expression of religion (as is Jesus crucified), I do not agree that they were operating in the spirit of God. However, I do accept there seems to be purpose behind all evils' deceptive influence. The point was to the purpose of it all, which by your own words seemed to be mocking that. If I was wrong to assume or am wrong in my assumption, then I do apologize, but sometimes thats all we have are our assumptions, as dangerous as they can be.

God is remarkable in that "the stone the builders rejected has become the cornerstone". In that, whatever the purpose of evil is, it seems to always serve the purpose of good. In that whatever is sown in weakness is raised in power. In that whatever was blind has been given sight. In that whatever was hated and rejected was passionately desired and loved. While its very easy to blame Gods purpose, the understanding and revelation often comes at the end of all the bitterness and blame that attempted to steer you away from the truth. Just take any relationship that ends. Most likely than not, there is usually blame on both sides. If you cant find your blame, you will never get through into understanding the lessons that are the purpose behind all that blame-filled negative and destructive energy.

The comparison between skydiving and purpose made sense to me then, and still does. None of our family has died in vain... It has nothing to do with skydiving and everything to do with purpose. We're not looking for reason to believe, we're looking for power in faith.

"We didn't start the fire"