quade 3 #151 July 23, 2009 The Daily Show had a pretty good take on this on Wednesday. http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-july-22-2009/the-born-identityquade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rivetgeek 0 #152 July 23, 2009 QuoteThe Daily Show had a pretty good take on this on Wednesday. http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-july-22-2009/the-born-identity heres a link that works, dailyshow.com is borked: http://www.hulu.com/watch/84858/the-daily-show-with-jon-stewart-wed-jul-22-2009~Bones Knit, blood clots, glory is forever, and chicks dig scars.~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
d_squared431 0 #153 July 23, 2009 QuoteQuoteThe Daily Show had a pretty good take on this on Wednesday. http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-july-22-2009/the-born-identity heres a link that works, dailyshow.com is borked: http://www.hulu.com/watch/84858/the-daily-show-with-jon-stewart-wed-jul-22-2009TPM Sister#130ONTIG#1 I love vodka.I love vodka cause it rhymes with Tuaca~LisaH You having a clean thought is like billyvance having a clean post.iluvtofly Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 3 #154 July 23, 2009 Quoteheres a link that works, dailyshow.com is borked: Works for me. Can't speak to whatever issue you may be having.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rivetgeek 0 #155 July 23, 2009 QuoteQuoteheres a link that works, dailyshow.com is borked: Works for me. Can't speak to whatever issue you may be having. yah looks like they fixed it. For like 20 minutes, all the links threw a maintenance error message~Bones Knit, blood clots, glory is forever, and chicks dig scars.~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #156 July 23, 2009 QuoteUm right. I was born in Belgium to an American woman and Belgian Father. I am a natural born citizen and can hold any office. John McCain was born in the Panama Canal Zone Care to keep shoving your tin-foil covered foot into your mouth? *edit* and before you spout of more ignorance, a military installation is NOT necessarily considered US soil. For example, the one McCain was born on. QuoteNatural-born citizen Who is a natural-born citizen? Who, in other words, is a citizen at birth, such that that person can be a President someday? The 14th Amendment defines citizenship this way: "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside." But even this does not get specific enough. As usual, the Constitution provides the framework for the law, but it is the law that fills in the gaps. Currently, Title 8 of the U.S. Code fills in those gaps. Section 1401 defines the following as people who are "citizens of the United States at birth:" * Anyone born inside the United States * * Any Indian or Eskimo born in the United States, provided being a citizen of the U.S. does not impair the person's status as a citizen of the tribe [i] * Any one born outside the United States, both of whose parents are citizens of the U.S., as long as one parent has lived in the U.S. * Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year and the other parent is a U.S. national * Any one born in a U.S. possession, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year * Any one found in the U.S. under the age of five, whose parentage cannot be determined, as long as proof of non-citizenship is not provided by age 21 * Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and diplomatic service included in this time) * A final, historical condition: a person born before 5/24/1934 of an alien father and a U.S. citizen mother who has lived in the U.S. * There is an exception in the law — the person must be "subject to the jurisdiction" of the United States. This would exempt the child of a diplomat, for example, from this provision. Anyone falling into these categories is considered natural-born, and is eligible to run for President or Vice President. These provisions allow the children of military families to be considered natural-born, for example. Separate sections handle territories that the United States has acquired over time, such as Puerto Rico (8 USC 1402), Alaska (8 USC 1404), Hawaii (8 USC 1405), the U.S. Virgin Islands (8 USC 1406), and Guam (8 USC 1407). Each of these sections confer citizenship on persons living in these territories as of a certain date, and usually confer natural-born status on persons born in those territories after that date. For example, for Puerto Rico, all persons born in Puerto Rico between April 11, 1899, and January 12, 1941, are automatically conferred citizenship as of the date the law was signed by the President (June 27, 1952). Additionally, all persons born in Puerto Rico on or after January 13, 1941, are natural-born citizens of the United States. Note that because of when the law was passed, for some, the natural-born status was retroactive. The law contains one other section of historical note, concerning the Panama Canal Zone and the nation of Panama. In 8 USC 1403, the law states that anyone born in the Canal Zone or in Panama itself, on or after February 26, 1904, to a mother and/or father who is a United States citizen, was "declared" to be a United States citizen. Note that the terms "natural-born" or "citizen at birth" are missing from this section. In 2008, when Arizona Senator John McCain ran for president on the Republican ticket, some theorized that because McCain was born in the Canal Zone, he was not actually qualified to be president. However, it should be noted that section 1403 was written to apply to a small group of people to whom section 1401 did not apply. McCain is a natural-born citizen under 8 USC 1401(c): "a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person." Not eveyone agrees that this section includes McCain — but absent a court ruling either way, we must presume citizenship. U.S. Nationals A "national" is a person who is considered under the legal protection of a country, while not necessarily a citizen. National status is generally conferred on persons who lived in places acquired by the U.S. before the date of acquisition. A person can be a national-at-birth under a similar set of rules for a natural-born citizen. U.S. nationals must go through the same processes as an immigrant to become a full citizen. U.S. nationals who become citizens are not considered natural-born. Becoming a citizen A non-citizen may apply to become a citizen of the United States. At no time will such a person ever be considered natural-born (unless the U.S. Code is changed in some way). The process to become a citizen involves several steps, including applying to become and becoming a permanent resident (previously known as a resident alien), applying to become and becoming naturalized, and finally taking the Oath of Allegiance to the United States. Children of naturalized U.S. citizens generally become citizens automatically, though they will also not be considered natural-born. There is a time constraint before a permanent resident can apply for naturalization, generally either 3 or 5 years. The other requirements are that there be a minimum length of time in a specific state or district, successful completion of a citizenship exam, ability to read, write, and speak English, and good moral character. The Oath of Allegiance to the United States The following is the text of the Oath of Allegiance: I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty, of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the Armed Forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rivetgeek 0 #157 July 23, 2009 Why dont you read that again. "* Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and diplomatic service included in this time) " You are wrong. Not to mention willfully ignorant. It amazes me how someone so dumb can even think of getting into a sport like skydiving. I feel sorry for the people that will inevitably have to witness your bounce. I'm done here as you obviously have no interest in facts, just pushing the same old neocon FUD.~Bones Knit, blood clots, glory is forever, and chicks dig scars.~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #158 July 23, 2009 Son of a diplomat? hmmmm which one? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #159 July 23, 2009 That was a PA and you need to be banned Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #160 July 23, 2009 QuoteWhy dont you read that again. "* Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and diplomatic service included in this time) " You are wrong. Not to mention willfully ignorant. It amazes me how someone so dumb can even think of getting into a sport like skydiving. I feel sorry for the people that will inevitably have to witness your bounce. I'm done here as you obviously have no interest in facts, just pushing the same old neocon FUD. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rivetgeek 0 #161 July 23, 2009 Have fun deluding yourself and trying to make yourself feel important by willfully misinterpreting the facts.~Bones Knit, blood clots, glory is forever, and chicks dig scars.~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #162 July 23, 2009 Nice tantrum Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #163 July 23, 2009 Please tell us which diplomat you are the son of. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,648 #164 July 23, 2009 QuotePlease tell us which diplomat you are the son of.r Where did he claim any such thing?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #165 July 23, 2009 When did you become his Agent? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BikerBabe 0 #166 July 23, 2009 warped, i think you might be reading that wrong (NOT a PA) I think the parenthetical means that military or diplomatic service during that time qualifies, NOT that it is required.Never meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rivetgeek 0 #167 July 23, 2009 QuotePlease tell us which diplomat you are the son of. Apparently you cant read. It means that being a diplomat or military would be included in the five years of residency. NOT that military or diplomatic service is required. Once again, like all conspiracy theorists, you willfully misinterpret the facts to suit your own whackjob theories.~Bones Knit, blood clots, glory is forever, and chicks dig scars.~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #168 July 23, 2009 Quote Quote Please tell us which diplomat you are the son of. Apparently you cant read. It means that being a diplomat or military would be included in the five years of residency. NOT that military or diplomatic service is required. Once again, like all conspiracy theorists, you willfully misinterpret the facts to suit your own whackjob theories. Strange you did not come up with that all on your own. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #169 July 23, 2009 QuoteA military installation is NOT necessarily considered US soil. Correct - only embassies and consulates are considered "US soil", overseas.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rivetgeek 0 #170 July 23, 2009 Timestamps, check them. We posted at the same time, it seems that more than one person on this board knows basic english and is willing to fact check you. You are obviously either totally ignorant, or a troll baiting others. Take your pick. Your arguments have been completely destroyed and now you are left with nothing but ad hominem attacks. Give it up. your position makes no sense whatsoever. I understand you conspiracy theorists want to feel like you have some sort of valuable scoop but for fucks sake this is just retarded.~Bones Knit, blood clots, glory is forever, and chicks dig scars.~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,648 #171 July 23, 2009 QuoteWhen did you become his Agent? The instant it was necessary to correct your latest mistake.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
georgerussia 0 #172 July 23, 2009 Quote Strange you did not come up with that all on your own. Well, it was quite obvious, and I'm really impressed that you needed an explanation.* Don't pray for me if you wanna help - just send me a check. * Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #173 July 23, 2009 QuoteCurrently, Title 8 of the U.S. Code fills in those gaps. Section 1401 defines the following as people who are "citizens of the United States at birth:" … Looking at the actual US Code: Title 8> Chapter 12> Subchapter III> Part I> §1401: § 1401. Nationals and citizens of United States at birth The following shall be nationals and citizens of the United States at birth: (a) a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof; (b) a person born in the United States to a member of an Indian, Eskimo, Aleutian, or other aboriginal tribe: Provided, That the granting of citizenship under this subsection shall not in any manner impair or otherwise affect the right of such person to tribal or other property; (c) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person; (d) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year prior to the birth of such person, and the other of whom is a national, but not a citizen of the United States; (e) a person born in an outlying possession of the United States of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year at any time prior to the birth of such person; (f) a person of unknown parentage found in the United States while under the age of five years, until shown, prior to his attaining the age of twenty-one years, not to have been born in the United States; (g) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years: Provided, That any periods of honorable service in the Armed Forces of the United States, or periods of employment with the United States Government or with an international organization as that term is defined in section 288 of title 22 by such citizen parent, or any periods during which such citizen parent is physically present abroad as the dependent unmarried son or daughter and a member of the household of a person (A) honorably serving with the Armed Forces of the United States, or (B) employed by the United States Government or an international organization as defined in section 288 of title 22, may be included in order to satisfy the physical-presence requirement of this paragraph. This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become effective in its present form on that date; and (h) a person born before noon (Eastern Standard Time) May 24, 1934, outside the limits and jurisdiction of the United States of an alien father and a mother who is a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, had resided in the United States. President Obama has provided proof that he falls under category a, having been born in the US state of Hawaii. Even if he had been born overseas, he would still meet the requirements, as defined in category g, since his mother was a US citizen prior to Obama's birth and met the residency requirements. Note that military, government, or international service is not a requirement, but rather an additional way to meet the residency requirement. Of course, the conspiracy theorists could always claim that he wasn't born to the mother that his birth certificate claims to have given birth to him, in which case, he would meet the requirements of citizenship as defined in paragraph f. In other words, no matter how you look at it, president Obama meets the requirement of being a natural born citizen. I'm sure there will remain plenty of nut cases who continue to wear their tin foil hats, nonetheless.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #174 July 23, 2009 Quote Tom, you and I as well as Marg and Karen all can agree there is a suspicious lack of details in the document Obama has provided. It appears that you misread some posts. Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #175 July 23, 2009 That there was a lack of detail in the document Obama provided? Hey I can argue all day, from either side of the issue. There are quite a few of you that instantly stooped to attacks or outright anger when you don't like what was said or even argued. Fair minded my ass... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
