Looks like a good day to kill someone.

[normiss 622]

So we're going to euthanize another human today.

Ledger

sounds clear enough...until you see how crazy all those involved were/are:
Lethal Injection

In that mess of sexual abuse and sheer craziness....WHO the hell can you believe ENOUGH to kill a man over? A "trustworthy" jail house snitch and a kid that wanted to see her "boyfriend" in jail.
Poor investigation, poor jury directions, just a strangely weak case all the way 'round. The face that there are jury's that will blindly believe the State side of cases is truly disappointing.

This is yet another case that was neither fair nor impartial.

Beautiful system we have all worked out here.

[JohnRich 4]

They've had 25 years to prove him innocent, and haven't been able to do so. They've appealed all the way to the Florida Supreme Court, and the U.S. Supreme Court. No court along the way thought he was innocent, or that there were errors in the trial sufficient to warrant a new one.

He raped and strangled to death a 15-year-old girl, and he's had his run for justice. Now it's time for him to finally pay for his crimes.

Good riddance.

[normiss 622]

Nice speed reading John!

You're good with sending someone to their death based solely on 2 questionable accounts from non-trustworthy people???
ZERO factual evidence?
Changing stories EVERY time they talk?
Wow. oh wait...Texas.
Where did you get your claim of "rape" anyway?
He was never charged with rape nor was it even mentioned.

Personally, I was surprised at how much the jury didn't hear.
The fact that the majority of the appeals were simply "passed through the system" without so much as a review. Multiple appeals did indeed find fault with various parts of this entire case, but declined to give any relief.

If this is typical of actually catching the facts in a case, I should be surprised we don't kill more people through the courts legal murder doctrine.

[Andy9o8 0]

Quote

Good riddance.

If he did it. If so, the riddance is good. If he didn't, shame on us.

[chuckakers 370]

Quote

So we're going to euthanize another human today.

Ledger

sounds clear enough...until you see how crazy all those involved were/are:
Lethal Injection

In that mess of sexual abuse and sheer craziness....WHO the hell can you believe ENOUGH to kill a man over? A "trustworthy" jail house snitch and a kid that wanted to see her "boyfriend" in jail.
Poor investigation, poor jury directions, just a strangely weak case all the way 'round. The face that there are jury's that will blindly believe the State side of cases is truly disappointing.

This is yet another case that was neither fair nor impartial.

Beautiful system we have all worked out here.

Obama's stimuloot bill has a medical provision that will kill elderly people whose only crime is living too long too. So what's yer point?

Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

[crwtom 0]

Quote

They've had 25 years to prove him innocent, and haven't been able to do so.

who has the burden of proof in criminal justice?

*******************************************************************
Fear causes hesitation, and hesitation will cause your worst fears to come true

[JohnRich 4]

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Quote

They've had 25 years to prove him innocent, and haven't been able to do so.

who has the burden of proof in criminal justice?

That State already did that. Then it's up to the defendant to show some reason why that proof was wrong. And in the 25 years since, the defense has been unable to vacate the verdict, or show good cause for a new trial. So say the highest courts in the land. I'd say if there was valid cause to overturn the verdict, then that's certainly plenty of time to do it.

He's had his chance. Now his time is up. It's time for this murderer to die. Good riddance.

[normiss 622]

Thanks for helping to prove my point.
It scares me to think how many, like you, blindly believe our government.
I personally understand blind justice in this country.
It ain't what we as a nation blindly believe it to be.
This case is a fine example of that.
When we carelessly throw humans away for 25 years in anticipation of killing them with virtually no proof.
Our appellate process works like the NFL reviews.
"Sure we'll consider your complain, but unless we see OVERWHELMING proof that the error did in fact occur...the error in judgment stands.

I'm disappointed that my state legal system prefers to act like a number of those in the west that historically have done the same things.

Apparently the courts think this guy "needs a killin'".

[Ian84 0]

John did you read the facts of the case? I have to say I would be very uncomfortable with finding the guy guilty, never mind sentencing him to death. The threshold for what constitutes "evidence" should be higher than that. IMHO testimony from jailhouse snitches should be inadmissable.

John Grisham's "The Innocent Man" is a good read and deals with the true story of a man sentenced to death after being convicted on similar evidence as in this case. He spent over a decade on death row before being released.

[wmw999 2,134]

Here is an article in Texas Monthly about 37 separate exonerated men who served time in Texas prisons. Not all of them are nice guys, but we're supposed to convict people based on what they are accused of, not based on what we think of them, or what they did at some other time.

I have a friend who used to be a death penalty appeal lawyer. Her take was that the vast majority of the prisoners she dealt with were very scary people who had no business outside of a prison. However, all of them were also clearly not of sound mind, or had histories of horrific child abuse. While that does not excuse bad acts, sometimes it does explain it.

Just as the "bad" pit bulls were trained that way, so can children be trained that way.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Capt.Slog 0]

Quote

Quote

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They've had 25 years to prove him innocent, and haven't been able to do so.

who has the burden of proof in criminal justice?

That State already did that. Then it's up to the defendant to show some reason why that proof was wrong. And in the 25 years since, the defense has been unable to vacate the verdict, or show good cause for a new trial. So say the highest courts in the land. I'd say if there was valid cause to overturn the verdict, then that's certainly plenty of time to do it.

He's had his chance. Now his time is up. It's time for this murderer to die. Good riddance.

So you hate the government intervening when it comes to helping people, denigrate the government when it comes to being able to run a health care system, but are all in favor when it comes to killing people and consider the government run criminal justice system to be so perfect that you'd bet your life on it.

You are wierd as well as inconsistent.

[kbordson 8]

Oh come on. You know that lawyers don't kill people. Doctors do.



Seriously though..... there are some people for whom the death penalty is merciful and others for which it is murder. This case.... hard to say, but I wouldn't feel comfortable with that on my conscious.

[Amazon 7]

Quote

Obama's stimuloot bill has a medical provision that will kill elderly people whose only crime is living too long too. So what's yer point?

Nice attempt at being totally clueless.

I lived in Oregon... and voted for a death with Dignity initiative.. IT took years to actually get it implimented with the rePUBICan Religious White House leading the fight against it.
I voted for a similar law here in Washington just this last year.

I for one do not want to have to live in agony, and impoverish my family because some fucked up morons in the church down the street.. do not really believe in an afterlife.. and are scared to DEATH and of DEATH. Nor do I want a bunch of blood sucking doctors keeping me alive to enrich themselves at my family's expence....

When its my time to go I want the right.. to exit as I see fit. Its my life.. and you dont have the right to stop me.... no matter what your scewed vision of life is..

I guess your milage does vary.. so go ahead and be afraid ... be VERY afraid.. of that end of life that ll of us will have to face.

I on the other hand will know when its time

[chuckakers 370]

Quote

Quote

Obama's stimuloot bill has a medical provision that will kill elderly people whose only crime is living too long too. So what's yer point?

Nice attempt at being totally clueless.

I lived in Oregon... and voted for a death with Dignity initiative.. IT took years to actually get it implimented with the rePUBICan Religious White House leading the fight against it.
I voted for a similar law here in Washington just this last year.

I for one do not want to have to live in agony, and impoverish my family because some fucked up morons in the church down the street.. do not really believe in an afterlife.. and are scared to DEATH and of DEATH. Nor do I want a bunch of blood sucking doctors keeping me alive to enrich themselves at my family's expence....

When its my time to go I want the right.. to exit as I see fit. Its my life.. and you dont have the right to stop me.... no matter what your scewed vision of life is..

I guess your milage does vary.. so go ahead and be afraid ... be VERY afraid.. of that end of life that ll of us will have to face.

I on the other hand will know when its time

If you think I'm clueless, you aren't going deep enough with your otherwise excellent point. Obama's bill doesn't allow old people to die with dignity, it mandates dieing, dignity or not. I am in total agreement with your views on dieing with dignity. I'm the person that had to sign papers allowing my own father to pass in a hospice - where that's actually the point of checking in.

Don't go down that road. My point isn't whether or not we should want to stay alive, it's that our government shouldn't be able to mandate it through the legislative process.

Live, die, that's everyone's individual choice. Which is why I think the government should NOT have a say.

Individual rights. Either way, please.

Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

[Amazon 7]

You are STILL missing the point.. I have seen nothing that even comes close to requiring old people to just go off and die... come on. Under some socialized medicine in some countries..hell it even is already happening right here in this country..... they can choose not to spend millions of dollars for not only old people but most of the poor.. and increasingly.. even those of us that THOUGHT we had insurance that would cover injuries but the insurance company that you have been paying premiums to... refuses to pay the doctors for what ever they deem to be "pre-existing conditions" even including diagnostic procedures.

Leave the rhetoric behind... there is NO Administration that could get away with requiring old people to just die... no matter HOW much you want to believe it.

[JohnRich 4]

Quote

I personally understand blind justice in this country. It ain't what we as a nation blindly believe it to be. This case is a fine example of that. When we carelessly throw humans away for 25 years in anticipation of killing them with virtually no proof...

So what you're saying is that there's a 25-year long conspiracy going amongst prosecutors and numerous courts, all the way up to the U.S. Supreme Court, to find this man guilty, even though he's really not. Uh-huh.

If the evidence of his innocence is as crystal clear as you say, they should have been able to prove it in 25 years worth of appeals.

Time to die. Good riddance.

The news media seems only interested in showing photos of the heinous murderer.
So I've attached here a photo of 15-year-old Lisa DeCarr, his victim.

All you bleeding heart liberals only seem to have sympathy for the murderer.
How about showing some for little Lisa?

[akarunway 1]

Quote

Quote

Obama's stimuloot bill has a medical provision that will kill elderly people whose only crime is living too long too. So what's yer point?

Nice attempt at being totally clueless.

I lived in Oregon... and voted for a death with Dignity initiative.. IT took years to actually get it implimented with the rePUBICan Religious White House leading the fight against it.
I voted for a similar law here in Washington just this last year.

I for one do not want to have to live in agony, and impoverish my family because some fucked up morons in the church down the street.. do not really believe in an afterlife.. and are scared to DEATH and of DEATH. Nor do I want a bunch of blood sucking doctors keeping me alive to enrich themselves at my family's expence....

When its my time to go I want the right.. to exit as I see fit. Its my life.. and you dont have the right to stop me.... no matter what your scewed vision of life is..

I guess your milage does vary.. so go ahead and be afraid ... be VERY afraid.. of that end of life that ll of us will have to face.

I on the other hand will know when its time

+1

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[akarunway 1]

Quote

Quote

I personally understand blind justice in this country. It ain't what we as a nation blindly believe it to be. This case is a fine example of that. When we carelessly throw humans away for 25 years in anticipation of killing them with virtually no proof...

So what you're saying is that there's a 25-year long conspiracy going amongst prosecutors and numerous courts, all the way up to the U.S. Supreme Court, to find this man guilty, even though he's really not. Uh-huh.

If the evidence of his innocence is as crystal clear as you say, they should have been able to prove it in 25 years worth of appeals.

Time to die. Good riddance.

The news media seems only interested in showing photos of the heinous murderer.
So I've attached here a photo of 15-year-old Lisa DeCarr, his victim.

All you bleeding heart liberals only seem to have sympathy for the murderer.
How about showing some for little Lisa?

You're somthing else bro. Just one story. >http://www.theatlantic.com/issues/99nov/9911wrongman.htm You are a death mongerer. Bet you'd have loved to been there and pushed the final plunger. And I'd bet my bottom dollar you don't even read the link.

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[Ian84 0]

So if someone came to you three times and each time told you a very different version of the same story, you'd trust that person enought to kill a man?

[normiss 622]

Well we killed him.
Apparently two murders make a right thing in some's eye.

Today's paper [urlhttp://www.theledger.com/article/20090211/NEWS/902110407/1410?Title=Rapist_Executed_For_1983_Slaying]execute[/url].

Few things of note, the jailhouse snitch says he lied because the prosecutor told him to. They nol pros'ed (sp?) his escape charge for that favor.
The state found this was an error in the case, but wouldn't have affected the outcome. How the fuck is that possible?????
Two "witnesses" and a mom that couldn't keep their stories straight, ZERO physical evidence, ZERO eyewitnesses - and we gave a man death????
The fact that this DOESN'T bother people deeply bothers and disappoints me.


I realize this isn't a nice guy. He IS a violent felon.
I doubt he is a proven murderer though.

John...I would never consider myself a bleeding heart liberal btw. I'm pretty much middle of the road.
Believe in a lot of republican as well as democratic and independent political views.
Gimme my guns, my money, less government, legalize drugs, abortion is choice, no death penalty.
I'm pretty good there, thanks.

[SkyDekker 1,133]

Quote

John did you read the facts of the case?

He doesn't care about facts....somebody is getting killed and when that happens, facts are just a little nuisance that could get in the way of his happiness.

[Amazon 7]

Quote

Gimme my guns, my money, less government, legalize drugs, abortion is choice, no death penalty.
I'm pretty good there, thanks.

+1

Me likey

[JohnRich 4]

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You're somthing else bro. Just one story. http://www.theatlantic.com/issues/99nov/9911wrongman.htm] You are a death mongerer. Bet you'd have loved to been there and pushed the final plunger. And I'd bet my bottom dollar you don't even read the link.

Well you've read one story. I guess you know more than all those juries, lawyers, courts and judges that have reviewed ALL of the evidence over a period of 25 years. Good for you. We can just eliminate the whole justice system, and let akarunway be king and make all the right decisions.

Have you read enough to know that he had already been convicted of raping two other women?

On to another side-topic. Quotes from this thread:

normiss: "Wow. oh wait...Texas."

normiss: "It scares me to think how many, like you, blindly believe our government."

captslog: "So you hate the government intervening when it comes to helping people, denigrate the government when it comes to being able to run a health care system, but are all in favor when it comes to killing people and consider the government run criminal justice system to be so perfect that you'd bet your life on it. You are wierd..."

akarunway: "You are a death mongerer. Bet you'd have loved to been there and pushed the final plunger." (Note: the correct word is "monger".)

skydekker: "He doesn't care about facts....somebody is getting killed and when that happens, facts are just a little nuisance that could get in the way of his happiness."

I just love the way you and others here hurl vile insults when someone disagrees with you on the death penalty. I find that kind of ironic. You'll give a rapist-murderer the benefit of the doubt, but there'll be no understanding or respect for JohnRich's opinion! You guys crack me up.

No, dear moderators, I do not want you to delete all those personal insults. I want their true personalities to be seen by all.

How many of you are going to his funeral to shed some tears for him?

[normiss 622]

Being a convicted rapist does not make one a murderer John. In fact I'd be surprised if that was even allowed to be mentioned in the murder case. Typically damaging evidence from previous cases not involved with the current case is not permitted. It has a tendency to tarnish someone's view of the defendant. Could that be your perspective too?
I don't give this guy ANY benefit of the doubt. I simply have MAJOR issues with taking a human life on zero evidence and enough reasonable doubt that this shouldn't have gone this far.
I hope you never have to understand how our legal system works. We take it fro granted that it is "right and proper and fair" - until we see the process with our own eyes.

And BTW - Referring to Texas and killing people couldn't be farther from a PA.
Hell man, I'm from Florida...we ain't got no rednecks here!
Being afraid of how many in the populace blindly believe in the government is also a PA?
Seems you're a little sensitive man!
Lighten up...we're just discussing, not attacking.
At least that's not my intent.

[piper17 1]

1. Convicted by a jury of his peers who heard all the evidence presented by the prosecution.
2. Case reviewed by the Florida Supreme Court.
3. Twenty-five years to examine additional DNA evidence that the defense claims exists. If it exists, why hasn't it been done yet? Technology has existed for more than a few years? Does it actually exist?
4. You are basing your opinions on what you have read in a newspaper article. We all know how accurate they are!
5. Whether or not the jury heard about his prior "misdeeds"...it certainly influences my opionion regarding this individual.

Sounds to me (based on the newspaper article so my opinion would therefore be suspect) that he has been given due process and this is simply a stalling tactic by the defense....but just my opinion.

"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition"...Rudyard Kipling