billvon 2,428 #1 December 1, 2006 Good article on one of the problems with our modern corporate press: On Calling Bullshit Posted at 5:09 pm, November 30th, 2006 Mainstream-media political journalism is in danger of becoming increasingly irrelevant, but not because of the Internet, or even Comedy Central. The threat comes from inside. It comes from journalists being afraid to do what journalists were put on this green earth to do. What is it about Jon Stewart and Stephen Colbert that makes them so refreshing and attractive to a wide variety of viewers (including those so-important younger ones)? I would argue that, more than anything else, it is that they enthusiastically call bullshit. Calling bullshit, of course, used to be central to journalism as well as to comedy. And we happen to be in a period in our history in which the substance in question is running particularly deep. The relentless spinning is enough to make anyone dizzy, and some of our most important political battles are about competing views of reality more than they are about policy choices. Calling bullshit has never been more vital to our democracy. . . . I’m not sure why calling bullshit has gone out of vogue in so many newsrooms — why, in fact, it’s so often consciously avoided. There are lots of possible reasons. There’s the increased corporate stultification of our industry, to the point where rocking the boat is seen as threatening rather than invigorating. There’s the intense pressure to maintain access to insider sources, even as those sources become ridiculously unrevealing and oversensitive. There’s the fear of being labeled partisan if one’s bullshit-calling isn’t meted out in precisely equal increments along the political spectrum. http://www.niemanwatchdog.org/blog/?p=53 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #2 December 1, 2006 What do you mean by 'Calling bullshit?'When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,428 #3 December 1, 2006 >What do you mean by 'Calling bullshit?' That may be an americanism. If a jumper comes back from a boogie and claims that he out-swooped Shannon Pilcher, people may "call bullshit" on him. (i.e. they don't believe him.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,647 #4 December 1, 2006 It is certainly to the shame of the mainstream media that they didn't call BS on the rationale for invading Iraq.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #5 December 1, 2006 Quote It is certainly to the shame of the mainstream media that they didn't call BS on the rationale for invading Iraq. Not to mention all those Democrats in Congress who supported Bush. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,647 #6 December 1, 2006 QuoteQuote It is certainly to the shame of the mainstream media that they didn't call BS on the rationale for invading Iraq. Not to mention all those Democrats in Congress who supported Bush. It's the media's job to call BS on politicians of all stripes. They went to town on the Clinton BJ, though.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
unformed 0 #7 December 1, 2006 It is really out of whack when a large portion of the population gets its news from a comedy channel. It is even more out of whack when a major debate show (Crossfire on CNN) compares their journalistic integrity to that of a comedy show (The Daily Show). Those that don't know what I'm referring to, the video is here.This ad space for sale. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,428 #8 December 1, 2006 >Not to mention all those Democrats in Congress who supported Bush. Funniest post of the thread so far! I take it you didn't read the article. (Your behavior is described pretty well in it.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beowulf 1 #9 December 1, 2006 I consider the current mainstream media to be entertainment not news. They are more interested in reporting sensational news rather then actual news. All they care about is ratings. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #10 December 1, 2006 QuoteI take it you didn't read the article. (Your behavior is described pretty well in it.) I call BULLSHIT! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #11 December 1, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuote It is certainly to the shame of the mainstream media that they didn't call BS on the rationale for invading Iraq. Not to mention all those Democrats in Congress who supported Bush. It's the media's job to call BS on politicians of all stripes. They went to town on the Clinton BJ, though. You mean the backlash to his holding an unscheduled national address, to directly tell blatant lies to the American people and that whole lying to a grand jury business? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #12 December 1, 2006 Quote>What do you mean by 'Calling bullshit?' That may be an americanism. If a jumper comes back from a boogie and claims that he out-swooped Shannon Pilcher, people may "call bullshit" on him. (i.e. they don't believe him.) I think, more specifically in the case of this article, it means breaking the cycle of asking questions and getting what I'll call "political answers." Answers that aren't necessarily lies, but that clearly dance around the truth. Rather than rephrase a question to try and coax just a little more honesty out of a person, only to get another political answer, you tell them in no uncertain terms that you won't accept their last answer because it was, "bullshit." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,428 #13 December 1, 2006 >Rather than rephrase a question to try and coax just a little more > honesty out of a person, only to get another political answer, you > tell them in no uncertain terms that you won't accept their last > answer because it was, "bullshit." Right. I think this is exemplified nowadays in press conferences by reporters who let public officials get away with contradicting themselves or saying blatantly false things. Rather than say "that's not true, sir, the report did not say that" they'll just be obedient and ask a follow-up question. Too many reporters are following the (satirical) advice of Stephen Colbert when it comes to reporting: "But, listen, let's review the rules. Here's how it works: the president makes decisions. He's the decider. The press secretary announces those decisions, and you people of the press type those decisions down. Make, announce, type. Just put 'em through a spell check and go home." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #14 December 1, 2006 QuoteRight. I think this is exemplified nowadays in press conferences by reporters who let public officials get away with contradicting themselves or saying blatantly false things. Rather than say "that's not true, sir, the report did not say that" they'll just be obedient and ask a follow-up question. I still think many of the right wingers on here prefer their news in Jeff Gannonesque style... http://www.jeffgannon.com/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #15 December 1, 2006 I mean does it really take a rocket scientist to figure out 30K+ dead including US troops, not to mention the maimed and injured (for no reason) is a lot worst then a guy getting his dick sucked and lying about it? I mean do you take your self seriously? Not to mention the one who got his dick sucked had the biggest defecate and made it to the biggest surplus EVER and your great GWB did the opposite? Let me think people dying for no reason family destroyed for ever...........................guy getting his dick sucked and lying about it hmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Which one is worst???????? Do you really need help with that one?I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #16 December 1, 2006 QuoteI mean does it really take a rocket scientist to figure out 30K+ dead including US troops, not to mention the maimed and injured (for no reason) is a lot worst then a guy getting his dick sucked and lying about it? I mean do you take your self seriously? Not to mention the one who got his dick sucked had the biggest defecate and made it to the biggest surplus EVER and your great GWB did the opposite? Let me think people dying for no reason family destroyed for ever...........................guy getting his dick sucked and lying about it hmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Which one is worst???????? Do you really need help with that one? Seems like there are quite a few (bullshit) assumptions in this post. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,428 #17 December 1, 2006 >Not to mention the one who got his dick sucked had the biggest defecate . . . OK that's even funnier. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #18 December 1, 2006 Quote...rocket scantiest... ...biggest defecate... I normally wouldn't nit pick people's spelling but malapropisms are always funny... and btw, who are you calling "scantiest"? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #19 December 1, 2006 Hey I corrected that before you caught it!!!!!!!!!!. But I mean it always gets me. How people can’t see that a false war with many dead is a much bigger deal then a blowjob.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #20 December 1, 2006 QuoteQuote It is certainly to the shame of the mainstream media that they didn't call BS on the rationale for invading Iraq. Not to mention all those Democrats in Congress who supported Bush. In 1964 every member of Congress but 2 voted in favor of the Gulf of Tonkin resolution, which authorized LBJ's taking the US into a 10-year descent into Hell (Vietnam). Why? Because Johnson lied to Congress and the American people about the reason for doing it, that's why. But because the White House and Pentagon had control of the information, by the time we learned it was Bullshit!, well, it was too late. Sound familiar? History repeats itself. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #21 December 1, 2006 QuoteBut I mean it always gets me. How people can’t see that a false war with many dead is a much bigger deal then a blowjob. People think the war in Iraq is less significant than Clinton's blowjob? Who? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #22 December 1, 2006 QuoteQuoteI mean does it really take a rocket scientist to figure out 30K+ dead including US troops, not to mention the maimed and injured (for no reason) is a lot worst then a guy getting his dick sucked and lying about it? I mean do you take your self seriously? Not to mention the one who got his dick sucked had the biggest defecate and made it to the biggest surplus EVER and your great GWB did the opposite? Let me think people dying for no reason family destroyed for ever...........................guy getting his dick sucked and lying about it hmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Which one is worst???????? Do you really need help with that one? Seems like there are quite a few (bullshit) assumptions in this post. Assumptions? What is wrong? the Number of people dead? Are you questioning if the Iraqi war was started under false pretenses even after the administration admitted no WMD they actually stopped looking for them? I mean you got have some thing more then just calling BS. What’s BS? Are you denying that when Clinton left office we had a record surplus? What’s BS? Care to enlighten us with your factsI'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #23 December 1, 2006 QuoteIt's the media's job to call BS on politicians of all stripes. They went to town on the Clinton BJ, though. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You mean the backlash to his holding an unscheduled national address, to directly tell blatant lies to the American people and that whole lying to a grand jury business? It seems your trying to say that Clinton receiving a BJ and lying about it is worst then what GWB has done. Not only you but many of the fact challenged right tend to bring up Clinton whenever the lies of this administration are brought up. It always makes me wonder how you can compare the two. We almost impeach Clinton but GWB has made sure that we can not hold him responsible for the Iraq war. I mean am I the only one who thinks thats fucked up? If we tried to impeach Clinton for a BJ should'nt we be hanging GWB for crimes of high treason?I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,257 #24 December 1, 2006 QuoteRather than rephrase a question to try and coax just a little more honesty out of a person, only to get another political answer, you tell them in no uncertain terms that you won't accept their last answer because it was, "bullshit." Sometimes you don't even have to rephrase a question to call 'bullshit' on a politician. Sometimes just repeating it is enough, a la the infamous Jeremy Paxman, Michael Howard "Did you threaten to overrule him?" interview (For the Yanks, Jeremy Paxman is a famous 'no-holds barred' UK political journalist)Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #25 December 1, 2006 It's about your sounding off with pointed questions that had nothing directly to do with my posts. To answer your questions: No - and I never said it did. Yes - sometimes too much so. what's your point? What was the question? Worst? Shouldn't it be "worse"? The first part is worse, IMO. No. Do you feel better? I sure do. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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