Good News for Motorcyclists

[wmw999 2,126]

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which car has the right of way at an intersection with 4 stop signs?

Mine, of course

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[jlmiracle 7]

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This is very good news IMO. For too long, automobile drivers have cut us off and turned in front of us resulting in serious injury and/or death and simply walked away with an "I didn't see him" excuse

What about all those on motorcycles that are weaving in and out of traffic or are extremely exceeding the speed limit. Alot of those I didn't see him was because they are coming up at warp speed and shouldn't be and the car should have had plenty of time to turn in front of them.

j

Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

[GTAVercetti 0]

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Notice how many people are clueless about which car has the right of way at an intersection with 4 stop signs?

Or, God forbid, the lights go on the fritz and they have to deal with blinking red lights. It is now a stop sign you idiots.

More on thread, I agree that those who cause accidents should get training. But, as jlmiracle says, can we get some training for the bikers who ride down the BETWEEN the lanes (on the line) or who ride on the burn? There were FIVE of them doing that last week on 95 as I drove south. Or the ones who think that since they have a small bike they can weave into the 10 foot space between the car in the next lane over and the mac truck in their lane?

Drivers are not the only ones who can be idiots.

Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing.

[Gravitymaster 0]

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This is very good news IMO. For too long, automobile drivers have cut us off and turned in front of us resulting in serious injury and/or death and simply walked away with an "I didn't see him" excuse

What about all those on motorcycles that are weaving in and out of traffic or are extremely exceeding the speed limit. Alot of those I didn't see him was because they are coming up at warp speed and shouldn't be and the car should have had plenty of time to turn in front of them.

j

I don't have the statistics in front of me but iirc over 80% of all accidents involving a motorcycle and an automobile are the fault of the automobile driver. The most common fatality is an automobile making a left turn into the oncoming path of a motorcycle.

It's not surprising you would ask that question because most automobile drivers are unaware of the number of times they put a biker at risk due to lane changes and turns into the bikers path. It is also very rare that a car driver or passenger is injured or killed by a motorcycle. But to answer your question, I think cutting an automobile off is dumb, but it rarely results in an injury for the car driver. OTOH a car driver colliding with a biker almost always results in injury or death for the biker.

Most states are recognising this and have included more material about motorcycle awareness in their drivers license tests and courses.

[sundevil777 93]

20 years ago, it was legal in California for bikes to go between cars (on the line) as long as they were not going above a certain speed, and were not passing the car over a certain speed. That was many years ago, maybe the laws have changed. I was surprised to find out it was legal.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[Gravitymaster 0]

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Notice how many people are clueless about which car has the right of way at an intersection with 4 stop signs?

Or, God forbid, the lights go on the fritz and they have to deal with blinking red lights. It is now a stop sign you idiots.

More on thread, I agree that those who cause accidents should get training. But, as jlmiracle says, can we get some training for the bikers who ride down the BETWEEN the lanes (on the line) or who ride on the burn? There were FIVE of them doing that last week on 95 as I drove south. Or the ones who think that since they have a small bike they can weave into the 10 foot space between the car in the next lane over and the mac truck in their lane?

Drivers are not the only ones who can be idiots.

It is already illegal to split lanes in every state except California. Unfortunately, it's difficult to get the police to enforce laws sometimes. Just look at the number of people who get away with running red lights. I ride a lot and I don't see this happening as often as you apparently do. I know it happens and I think anyone doing it is an idiot and they are risking their lives.

BTW, lane splitting is legal in California because many motorcycles don't have a radiator and they overheat while sitting in traffic.

[Lindsey 0]

Today as a redneck in a (very loud) old red Ford pick-up started pulling out in front of me on my (very loud) bike, I think it was my yelling "FUCK!" that got his attention more than my loud pipes....lol. He did stop a little short of me as I swerved to just shy of the center line....arghhhh.

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[shropshire 0]

Splitting lanes (pretty much) the only reason for riding a bike to work... otherwise, it would take the same time to get there as in the car (BTW.. I also ride to work cuz it's fun!!). I've found that most car drivers will make extra room for you (if they see you coming!!) - not everyone is an arse

As for loud pipes. I'm not convinced that they save lives... in traffic, you still need to be pretty close before people hear you and if I surprise a driver whilst I'm splitting lane, they could swerve into me... just a thought.

A mate of mine came over from Philly a few years ago and was surprised how we rode.. but I cann't understand anyone on a bike sitting in a queue of traffic.

.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[sundevil777 93]

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BTW, lane splitting is legal in California because many motorcycles don't have a radiator and they overheat while sitting in traffic.

Are you sure of the reason?

Whether liquid or air cooled, if not designed well, either could overheat. An air cooled bike is not inherently more vulnerable.

How would you know if an air cooled bike overheats? I can't think of an air cooled bike that had a temp gauge. I suppose that when the engine seizes that is a clue, or perhaps it would run badly.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[billvon 2,404]

>. I doubt your fan/horn idea would be legal . . .

Oh, I'm sure I could find a loophole that would make it legal. (After all, there's no law on how quiet your alternator fan has to be.)

But I wouldn't do it in any case because we all have to share the road. It would piss me off if someone behind me were doing that, so I don't do it.

>The difference is my loud pipes are legal . . .

Just as legal, and just as annoying, as my alternator fan (and my variable intensity running lights.)

>Notice how many people are clueless about which car has the right of
>way at an intersection with 4 stop signs?

Ah, but if four people get there at the same time, and all are going straight - who goes first? This problem has caused more than one near-collision at an intersection near me.

[Gravitymaster 0]

As I said, go for it. Maybe you could get a little horn like clowns use and squeak it at people who get in your way.

I think you will find you are more noticed with your little contraption, which will only prove my point. Keep in mind also that in a car if someone doesn't see you and hits your vehicle, you are probably going to get a fender or bumper dented. Hit my bike, and I'm seriously injured or dead.

[Gravitymaster 0]

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Splitting lanes (pretty much) the only reason for riding a bike to work... otherwise, it would take the same time to get there as in the car (BTW.. I also ride to work cuz it's fun!!). I've found that most car drivers will make extra room for you (if they see you coming!!) - not everyone is an arse

As for loud pipes. I'm not convinced that they save lives... in traffic, you still need to be pretty close before people hear you and if I surprise a driver whilst I'm splitting lane, they could swerve into me... just a thought.

A mate of mine came over from Philly a few years ago and was surprised how we rode.. but I cann't understand anyone on a bike sitting in a queue of traffic.

.

I find most people are very courteous to bikers. More so than when I'm driving my car. I was coming back from the beach recently and hit a long back-up. I had been sitting in stop and go traffic for over and hour and a very nice lady pulled up next to me and offered me a cold bottle of water.

The worst driver is the soccer mom driving a van and talking on a cell phone. I give them lots of room. You definitely have to watch out for yourself and drive with a different mind-set than in a car.

I've been riding since 1974 and ride about 10,000 miles per year.

[shropshire 0]

Nice to see we agree on the truely important stuff - stay safe mate.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[Gravitymaster 0]

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Nice to see we agree on the truely important stuff - stay safe mate.

Ahhh...we sometimes lose sight of that fact don't we?

[dorbie 0]

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Notice how many people are clueless about which car has the right of way at an intersection with 4 stop signs?

The loudest one?

[freethefly 6]

http://www.webbikeworld.com/Motorcycle-Safety/crash.htm

The majority of motorcycle accidents are the fault of the rider.
Most of these accidents are of wannbe "bikers" age 40 and above whom had only started riding late in life. I, myself, started out on a minibike at age 5 and raced motocross (Hodaka Super rat 100, a Yamaha 125 MX and a CZ 250) and scrambles into my teenage years.Started on the street at age 16 (actually at age 14 as I would steal my brothers bike and cruise around St.Louis before he or my parents got home) The majority of people who start riding for the first time late in life will never develope the skills to ride safely on the streets. My recommendation is that a person should start on dirt before even considering riding on the street.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[warpedskydiver 0]

I also was asked once by a guy in his 30's who just started riding on dirt if I ever tried to power slide my bike, for fucks sake it is a '92 GSXR1100

I agree don't start learning to ride at close to 40 and then tell others how it is done.

[freethefly 6]

Hey, I once power slid a 1982 GSX 1100 while street racing out on Otay Lake Rd in San Diego. Actually I hit a squirrel leaning into one of the bank turns and flipped the bike. Totaled the bike, killed the squirrel and put me in Balboa Naval hospital for more than a month.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[warpedskydiver 0]

Yikes, bet you don't wanna do that again huh?

[freethefly 6]

The funny thing is that it wasn't even my bike. I had a 1980 Sportster/Roadster that was in the shop at the time getting the electrics sorted out. My buddy had two GSX's and we had been riding all weekend when we went down to Otay to race around. After the crash, I could not figure what happened as I was perfect control going into the turn. Next thing I knew was that I was flying through the air and about to have a nasty landing. Part of a squirrel was in the spokes and a fork was in the engine. His insurance replaced the bike. It was not that we were being unsafe (to a degree, we were being unsafe by racing on the street) it was one of those unseen things that escalated into what could had been a more serious event. I never raced on Otay Lake Rd again after that event.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[Gravitymaster 0]

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http://www.webbikeworld.com/Motorcycle-Safety/crash.htm

The majority of motorcycle accidents are the fault of the rider.
Most of these accidents are of wannbe "bikers" age 40 and above whom had only started riding late in life. I, myself, started out on a minibike at age 5 and raced motocross (Hodaka Super rat 100, a Yamaha 125 MX and a CZ 250) and scrambles into my teenage years.Started on the street at age 16 (actually at age 14 as I would steal my brothers bike and cruise around St.Louis before he or my parents got home) The majority of people who start riding for the first time late in life will never develope the skills to ride safely on the streets. My recommendation is that a person should start on dirt before even considering riding on the street.

While I don't disagree with the stats you posted, your conclusions have nothing to do with this discussion. They are stats for single vehicle crashes ie. motorcycle only. So naturally they would indicate the crash is the fault of the driver nearly 100% of the time.

My point is that around 80% of all accidents involving a motorcycle and an automobile, are the fault of the automobile driver. The most common reason being an automobile driver making a left turn into the oncoming path of a motorcycle, as I previously stated.

Learning to ride dirt bikes does not necessarily translate into increased road skills anymore than learning belly flying makes one a better free flyer or vice versa. Or that learning to swoop will reduce the probability of a landing accident. They are different sets of skills.

[freethefly 6]

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-- 39 percent of fatal motorcycle collisions with other vehicles occurred when the other vehicle was turning left while the motorcycle was going straight, passing, or overtaking the other vehicle.

I do agree about that lefthand turns do account for a good number of accidents. But, it is also believed that a good number of these accidents could had been avoided had the rider had the skill to do so. The majority of late in life riders do not have the experience of street riding to do so. Most 40+ new riders also choose the wrong bike to start on, ie; a big Harley. Most of these people are more concern with having the image that they are bikers when they are not. Most bikers started riding when they were kids and started on dirt, such as myself. I agree that dirt and street are two different animals but I know from experience that the skills learned by riding trails are carried over to street riding. You need a high level of awareness to navigate through the woods and a high level of awareness to navigate on a motocross track or in scrambles. The same on the street. When I ride I treat each and every cage (and squirrel) as if it is out to get me. In the 41 years that I have been riding I have avoided a good number of potential collisions on dirt and street. I have been hit from behind once by a drunk driver at a stop light and t-boned by another motorcycle. Those two could not had been avoided. Getting around some idiot who didn't see me was avoided by being aware and watching each and every car that is at a corner and seeing an out in case they make the turn in front of me. But, I will also agree that sometimes shit just cannot be avoided no matter what you do or how experienced you are.




In 2004, more than 4,000 motorcyclists were killed and more than 76,000 were injured in the US. While motorcycles made up only 2 percent of registered vehicles, they accounted for 9 percent of total traffic fatalities. Per vehicle mile traveled, motorcyclists were about 32 times more likely than passenger car occupants to die in an accident.

-- Helmet usage made a significant difference in the survivability of motorcycle accidents. The NHTSA report estimated that helmets were 37 percent effective in preventing fatalities, and that helmets saved the lives of 1,316 motorcyclists in 2004, but that the lives of 671 motorcyclists who died could have been saved if they had been wearing helmets. Nationwide, 44 percent of motorcyclists involved in fatal accidents were not wearing helmets. Even higher percentages of fatal motorcycle accidents in many states involved motorcyclists who were not wearing helmets: 81.8% in South Carolina, 79.6% in Illinois, 78.2% in Oklahoma, 76.3% in Colorado, 76.3% in Wisconsin, 74.3% in Indiana, 74.2% in Utah, 73.1% in Ohio, 72.2% in Iowa, 71.8% in New Mexico, 71.4% in Kansas, 71.2% in Minnesota, and 70.0% in Rhode Island.

-- Driving while intoxicated was a major factor in fatal motorcycle accidents. 28 percent of all motorcyclists involved in fatal accidents, 41 percent of all motorcyclists involved in fatal collisions with fixed objects, and 60 percent of all motorcyclists involved in single-vehicle accidents on weekend nights, had blood alcohol concentrations (BAC) of .08 grams per deciliter (g/dL) or higher (the legal definition of driving while intoxicated in most states).

-- 36 percent of all motorcyclists involved in fatal accidents were speeding, and 27 percent of all motorcyclists involved in fatal accidents had prior speeding convictions.

-- 26 percent of fatal motorcycle accidents involved collisions with fixed objects and, as noted above, 41 percent of all fatal motorcycle collisions with fixed objects involved DWI. Applying these percentages to the data on fatalities overall, roughly 426 motorcyclists, or more than 10 percent of all of the motorcyclists killed nationwide in 2004, were killed by losing control of their motorcycles and crashing into fixed objects while drunk (4,000 fatalities x 26% of fatal accidents involving fixed objects x 41% of fatal fixed-object accidents involving DWI).

-- 39 percent of fatal motorcycle collisions with other vehicles occurred when the other vehicle was turning left while the motorcycle was going straight, passing, or overtaking the other vehicle.

-- 24 percent of all motorcyclists involved in fatal accidents were driving without a valid license.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[Zee 0]

And the not so good news.....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060912/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/motorcycle_safety

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