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kallend 1,625
HSA is a joke, and a very expensive joke, at our expense.
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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
No, not the Americans. Cliff is saying the Jews don't like the Blacks, and THATS why they are not helping them. Nice work Cliff.
Lets face it though, the reason there is such a problem in the aftermath is that the welfare class never plan ahead or think for themselves. That is why they are welfare class. They sit around and let the government support them. Hurricane coming? Oh well, the gov't will take care of it. I don't need to do anything for myself. NOLA wiped out? The gov't will come take care of me. Maybe, but the gov't is not going to take care of you as well as you might like.
Lets face it though, the reason there is such a problem in the aftermath is that the welfare class never plan ahead or think for themselves. That is why they are welfare class. They sit around and let the government support them. Hurricane coming? Oh well, the gov't will take care of it. I don't need to do anything for myself. NOLA wiped out? The gov't will come take care of me. Maybe, but the gov't is not going to take care of you as well as you might like.
QuoteQuoteJust a note;"Trust Me", Chertoff is a Jew.
OMG, shit, now it all makes sense! He must have organized the whole thing! Hurricane Katrina is just a ploy by Mossad to kill Americans!Those damned Jews!
No just plain old fashioned incompetance and a complete lack of foresight.
I heard the interview and Chertoff spent a good several minutes trying to tell NPR that the report of 1000's of people at the convention center was just a rumor and that everything was under control.
What a ass. I am ashamed of my country today, and I'm really pissed. Within 50 miles of this disaster, there are more resources than there are in many entire counties. Why the fuck does it take 5 days to get people help?
There are a lot of people to blame here and I hope that after this is over we will have some accountability.
illegible usually
QuoteLets face it though, the reason there is such a problem in the aftermath is that the welfare class never plan ahead or think for themselves. That is why they are welfare class. They sit around and let the government support them. Hurricane coming? Oh well, the gov't will take care of it. I don't need to do anything for myself. NOLA wiped out? The gov't will come take care of me. Maybe, but the gov't is not going to take care of you as well as you might like.
Could it also be because they don't have to money to take care of themselves? It takes money to buy the supplies needed to prepare for a hurricane coming your way. It also takes money to get out of the way of the hurricane. How many of them had cars or money to put fuel in the cars, or money to pay for a hotel room?
I do agree with you that some people just sat back and waited for the government to take care of them.
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey
it is unfortunate, but you hit the nail on the head.
"Your scrotum is quite nice" - Skymama
www.kjandmegan.com
"Your scrotum is quite nice" - Skymama
www.kjandmegan.com
kallend 1,625
Oh sure it's the poor to blame.
No fault of HSA and the State and City authorities who had been warned this would happen, and knew the storm was coming.
No fault of the government which cut the budget for flood controls.
No fault of the government which had sent 35% of the LA National Guard and much of its equipment to Iraq.
Nope, it's all the fault of the poor.
Did you ever read the part of the Constitution that refers to the obligation of the government in providing for the common welfare?
No fault of HSA and the State and City authorities who had been warned this would happen, and knew the storm was coming.
No fault of the government which cut the budget for flood controls.
No fault of the government which had sent 35% of the LA National Guard and much of its equipment to Iraq.
Nope, it's all the fault of the poor.
Did you ever read the part of the Constitution that refers to the obligation of the government in providing for the common welfare?
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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
Gawain 0
Well, let's look at the charter for the Department for Homeland Security:
FEMA does report through DHS, but it is FEMA who holds the real track record for responding to natural disasters, and events on our soil.
Regardless, I'm glad it helped get aid to where it was needed.
Meanwhile, regarding the reporters, I think it's fine what they're doing, but their free pass on reporting information is gone in my book. There are just as many reporters that are reporting from some room, relying on rumors to generate their own innuendo.
Quote
Mission: We will lead the unified national effort to secure America. We will prevent and deter terrorist attacks and protect against and respond to threats and hazards to the nation. We will ensure safe and secure borders, welcome lawful immigrants and visitors, and promote the free-flow of commerce.
FEMA does report through DHS, but it is FEMA who holds the real track record for responding to natural disasters, and events on our soil.
Regardless, I'm glad it helped get aid to where it was needed.
Meanwhile, regarding the reporters, I think it's fine what they're doing, but their free pass on reporting information is gone in my book. There are just as many reporters that are reporting from some room, relying on rumors to generate their own innuendo.
So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
billvon 2,400
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In a little more detail:
Mission & Management
The President will establish the Office of Homeland Security that will be headed by the Assistant to the President for Homeland Security -- Governor Tom Ridge.
The mission of the Office will be to develop and coordinate the implementation of a comprehensive national strategy to secure the United States from terrorist threats or attacks. The Office will coordinate the executive branch's efforts to detect, prepare for, prevent, protect against, respond to, and recover from terrorist attacks within the United States.
. . .
Preparedness
The Office of Homeland Security will coordinate national efforts to prepare for and mitigate the consequences of terrorist threats or attacks within the United States. In performing this function, the Office will work with federal, state, and local agencies, and private entities to:
review and assess the adequacy of the portions of all federal emergency response plans that pertain to terrorist threats or attacks within the United States;
coordinate domestic exercises and simulations designed to assess and practice systems that would be called upon to respond to a terrorist threat or attack within the United States and coordinate programs and activities for training federal, state, and local employees who would be called upon to respond to such a threat or attack;
coordinate national efforts to ensure public health preparedness for a terrorist attack, including reviewing vaccination policies and reviewing the adequacy of and, if necessary, increasing vaccine and pharmaceutical stockpiles and hospital capacity;
coordinate federal assistance to state and local authorities and non-governmental organizations to prepare for and respond to terrorist threats or attacks within the United States;
ensure that national preparedness programs and activities for terrorist threats or attacks are developed and are regularly evaluated under appropriate standards and that resources are allocated to improving and sustaining preparedness based on such evaluations; and
ensure the readiness and coordinated deployment of federal response teams to respond to terrorist threats or attacks, working with the Assistant to the President for National Security Affairs, when appropriate.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
So one might expect that the simulations that involved a terrorist blowing a hole in a levee would provide a plan to deal with a flooded New Orleans. Sure, different method (storm instead of a bomb) but same result. Actually, what happened is a lot easier to deal with - most of the people were already gone.
> There are just as many reporters that are reporting from some
> room, relying on rumors to generate their own innuendo.
I agree there. But in my book, getting aid to a bunch of people who otherwise would have been overlooked gets you a lot of credit. This guy just made up for 100 lazy-ass reporters in hotel rooms. Now if they can just keep this up . . .
Mission & Management
The President will establish the Office of Homeland Security that will be headed by the Assistant to the President for Homeland Security -- Governor Tom Ridge.
The mission of the Office will be to develop and coordinate the implementation of a comprehensive national strategy to secure the United States from terrorist threats or attacks. The Office will coordinate the executive branch's efforts to detect, prepare for, prevent, protect against, respond to, and recover from terrorist attacks within the United States.
. . .
Preparedness
The Office of Homeland Security will coordinate national efforts to prepare for and mitigate the consequences of terrorist threats or attacks within the United States. In performing this function, the Office will work with federal, state, and local agencies, and private entities to:
review and assess the adequacy of the portions of all federal emergency response plans that pertain to terrorist threats or attacks within the United States;
coordinate domestic exercises and simulations designed to assess and practice systems that would be called upon to respond to a terrorist threat or attack within the United States and coordinate programs and activities for training federal, state, and local employees who would be called upon to respond to such a threat or attack;
coordinate national efforts to ensure public health preparedness for a terrorist attack, including reviewing vaccination policies and reviewing the adequacy of and, if necessary, increasing vaccine and pharmaceutical stockpiles and hospital capacity;
coordinate federal assistance to state and local authorities and non-governmental organizations to prepare for and respond to terrorist threats or attacks within the United States;
ensure that national preparedness programs and activities for terrorist threats or attacks are developed and are regularly evaluated under appropriate standards and that resources are allocated to improving and sustaining preparedness based on such evaluations; and
ensure the readiness and coordinated deployment of federal response teams to respond to terrorist threats or attacks, working with the Assistant to the President for National Security Affairs, when appropriate.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
So one might expect that the simulations that involved a terrorist blowing a hole in a levee would provide a plan to deal with a flooded New Orleans. Sure, different method (storm instead of a bomb) but same result. Actually, what happened is a lot easier to deal with - most of the people were already gone.
> There are just as many reporters that are reporting from some
> room, relying on rumors to generate their own innuendo.
I agree there. But in my book, getting aid to a bunch of people who otherwise would have been overlooked gets you a lot of credit. This guy just made up for 100 lazy-ass reporters in hotel rooms. Now if they can just keep this up . . .
*** "Did you ever read the part of the Constitution that refers to the obligation of the government in providing for the common welfare?"
I am familiar with that part. I am not familiar with any part that says an entire segment of society is entitled to sit on their asses and live on the dole generation after generation. Yes, the Gov't has it share of blame over preparedness, but even the poorest person living in an area that has long been predicted to be flooded should be smart enough to
put something aside for the proverbally rainy day. A lot of them seem to be able to eat enough to become obese, and I bet a fair number smoke and drink. If they have money for that they could have planned, but why should they when they expect the gov't to tend to their needs.
They are not personally responsible and barely qualify as adults in that sense. See my thread on mandatory birth control for a solution.
I am familiar with that part. I am not familiar with any part that says an entire segment of society is entitled to sit on their asses and live on the dole generation after generation. Yes, the Gov't has it share of blame over preparedness, but even the poorest person living in an area that has long been predicted to be flooded should be smart enough to
put something aside for the proverbally rainy day. A lot of them seem to be able to eat enough to become obese, and I bet a fair number smoke and drink. If they have money for that they could have planned, but why should they when they expect the gov't to tend to their needs.
They are not personally responsible and barely qualify as adults in that sense. See my thread on mandatory birth control for a solution.
Why is it that everyone is looking for someone to blame?? Instead of taking so much time and energy in looking for someone to blame it might do us some good to try and have a more positive attitude! Yes, women, men, children and animals have and will continue to suffer because of this hurricane, but feeding that fire with the negativity of finding someone to blame is going to do no good whatsoever.
Everyone knew that that city was going to be underwater by the time Katrina went through NO....how do you seriously plan for a disaster like that. It took very little time for that hurricane to go from just a tropical storm to a category 5 storm.
Seriously....there are more people helping out in this country than there would be in any other place in this world. That state has just been through a huge disaster, there are flooded streets, down power lines, and trees....it isn't like you can just stroll in and say 'hey I am here to help.' With the current state of things, looting, starvation, dehydration, death....it is going to take a lot of patience, good will, man power, and organization in order to get the chaos under control....not blame and pointing fingers.
QuoteNo just plain old fashioned incompetance and a complete lack of foresight.
Everyone knew that that city was going to be underwater by the time Katrina went through NO....how do you seriously plan for a disaster like that. It took very little time for that hurricane to go from just a tropical storm to a category 5 storm.
QuoteWhat a ass. I am ashamed of my country today, and I'm really pissed. Within 50 miles of this disaster, there are more resources than there are in many entire counties. Why the fuck does it take 5 days to get people help?
Seriously....there are more people helping out in this country than there would be in any other place in this world. That state has just been through a huge disaster, there are flooded streets, down power lines, and trees....it isn't like you can just stroll in and say 'hey I am here to help.' With the current state of things, looting, starvation, dehydration, death....it is going to take a lot of patience, good will, man power, and organization in order to get the chaos under control....not blame and pointing fingers.
***
F LORIDA!
F LORIDA!
QuoteNo, not the Americans. Cliff is saying the Jews don't like the Blacks, and THATS why they are not helping them. Nice work Cliff.
Wow...just when you think people are starting to become smarter, understanding and helpful. You get someone tossing around instults about Jews for no reason? Cliff - if negligence was obvious I would be calling for this man to go on trial for the deaths of the people that perished due to his ignorance. However, in the mean time, the only ignorance I see is in this thread.
_________________________________________
you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me....
I WILL fly again.....
you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me....
I WILL fly again.....
kallend 1,625
Quote*** "Did you ever read the part of the Constitution that refers to the obligation of the government in providing for the common welfare?"
I am familiar with that part. I am not familiar with any part that says an entire segment of society is entitled to sit on their asses and live on the dole generation after generation. Yes, the Gov't has it share of blame over preparedness, but even the poorest person living in an area that has long been predicted to be flooded should be smart enough to
put something aside for the proverbally rainy day. A lot of them seem to be able to eat enough to become obese, and I bet a fair number smoke and drink. If they have money for that they could have planned, but why should they when they expect the gov't to tend to their needs.
They are not personally responsible and barely qualify as adults in that sense. See my thread on mandatory birth control for a solution.
You have a very narrow view of the word "welfare", as seems typical of most on the right.
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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
Just to be clear, I was not agreeing with Cliff, I was chastising him for his racist remark. I would have called him a racist, but I've been banned before for calling them like I see them with regards to Cliff.
You have a very broad view of the word "welfare", as seems typical of most on the left.
I think that we can both agree that libertarians are in the middle and that they believe that less gov't interference with citiznes lives is better. That can be extended to a reduction in the nanny state that the USA has become.
I think that we can both agree that libertarians are in the middle and that they believe that less gov't interference with citiznes lives is better. That can be extended to a reduction in the nanny state that the USA has become.
kallend 1,625
QuoteYou have a very broad view of the word "welfare", as seems typical of most on the left.
I think that we can both agree that libertarians are in the middle and that they believe that less gov't interference with citiznes lives is better. That can be extended to a reduction in the nanny state that the USA has become.
Promoting the "General Welfare" includes looking after citizens after a disaster has wiped out their city. In your hatred of poor people you seem unable to comprehend that it is an obligation of the federal government to assist them at this time.
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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
Saying that I hate poor people is a big leap from thinking that they don't do much to help themselves. Of course I think that disaster relief is something that the gov;t should provide, and yes, I donated to the Red Cross.
So clearly I can comprehend that obligation. However, you seem incapable of seeing each individual as having personal responsibilty for themselves. You are always willing to say it was someone elses's fault, and that people don't need to or are incapable of thinking for themselves. Your line of thinking is far more responsible for the sad existence of the welfare class than mine. WHen you expect nothing of people as you do they will do exactly that, nothing.
When you sit back and let others do for you you get what they give you. I'm not so sure that given the scope and extend of this disaster that it is being handled as poorly as many are saying. During the tusnami relief response the victums weren't shooting at the rescuers. Its is easy to be a Monday morning QB, and is anyone else surprised how LONG it took before Jesse, Al, and Congressman E. Cummings took to turn it into a race issue?
So clearly I can comprehend that obligation. However, you seem incapable of seeing each individual as having personal responsibilty for themselves. You are always willing to say it was someone elses's fault, and that people don't need to or are incapable of thinking for themselves. Your line of thinking is far more responsible for the sad existence of the welfare class than mine. WHen you expect nothing of people as you do they will do exactly that, nothing.
When you sit back and let others do for you you get what they give you. I'm not so sure that given the scope and extend of this disaster that it is being handled as poorly as many are saying. During the tusnami relief response the victums weren't shooting at the rescuers. Its is easy to be a Monday morning QB, and is anyone else surprised how LONG it took before Jesse, Al, and Congressman E. Cummings took to turn it into a race issue?
KATO33 0
Quotebut even the poorest person living in an area that has long been predicted to be flooded should be smart enough to
put something aside for the proverbally rainy day. A lot of them seem to be able to eat enough to become obese, and I bet a fair number smoke and drink. If they have money for that they could have planned, but why should they when they expect the gov't to tend to their needs.
Stop it this is crazy. If you barely have enough money to keep the lights on how do you put money away for a Disaster!
Blue Skies Black Death
OOH OOh me me....I know this answer....
a few dollars many months at a time.
Worked for me
a few dollars many months at a time.
Worked for me
Life is not fair and there are no guarantees...
KATO33 0
Quote: OOH OOh me me....I know this answer....
a few dollars many months at a time.
Worked for me
So you are telling me that you saved money (put money away) when you were threatened with the lost of utilities or eviction.
Blue Skies Black Death
Yes I absolutely did.
Hurricanes are a real threat here and I have responsibility for lives other than my own. I have put away cash into a 'hurricane fund' here at the house even when I lost my job, and even as utilities have been cut off. Power I need, phone I do not. I need the 'insurance' of my hurricane fund more. I have even had to let some of my property insurance lapse for lack of having the money to pay it....and I am ok with that...because I know if I have to, I have the means to evacuate with that which is most important to me not the possibility of having to rebuild.
Edited to add:
But then again I have always been accused of being a 'forward thinker'.
Hurricanes are a real threat here and I have responsibility for lives other than my own. I have put away cash into a 'hurricane fund' here at the house even when I lost my job, and even as utilities have been cut off. Power I need, phone I do not. I need the 'insurance' of my hurricane fund more. I have even had to let some of my property insurance lapse for lack of having the money to pay it....and I am ok with that...because I know if I have to, I have the means to evacuate with that which is most important to me not the possibility of having to rebuild.
Edited to add:
But then again I have always been accused of being a 'forward thinker'.
Life is not fair and there are no guarantees...
Deuce 1
Bill, as an ex-bureuacrat I can tell you this is more a problem of not being requested than not being prepared.
As consumers of government services, taxpayers do not want government bureaucracies charging off everywhere they can provide a service. They only want them responding to specific contingencies that are defined in colored binders.
I think that as things unfold we will find that New Orleans and Louisiana did not want help because they did not want strangers in their house.
Because their house was a mess.
FEMA and other disaster bureaucracies define themselves and thier funding by proving how useful they are in emergencies. They need disasters to prove they need funding. The bureaucrats in these agencies want nothing more than to parachute in to a disaster and be photographed giving bottles of water to dehydrated nuns in orphanages.
It's becoming clear that the state of Louisiana told these folks to stay the hell out. Why?
No binders. And no bureaucrats to open them regardless of the opinions of the local politicians.
The nature of "republican" government is local control. We don't want a soviet style of government where a federal power imposes it's will on local control.
When local control is crappy, people suffer.
I don't think the blame will rightfully fall on the federal government. Or the Red Cross, or other non-governmental assistance offered.
As consumers of government services, taxpayers do not want government bureaucracies charging off everywhere they can provide a service. They only want them responding to specific contingencies that are defined in colored binders.
I think that as things unfold we will find that New Orleans and Louisiana did not want help because they did not want strangers in their house.
Because their house was a mess.
FEMA and other disaster bureaucracies define themselves and thier funding by proving how useful they are in emergencies. They need disasters to prove they need funding. The bureaucrats in these agencies want nothing more than to parachute in to a disaster and be photographed giving bottles of water to dehydrated nuns in orphanages.
It's becoming clear that the state of Louisiana told these folks to stay the hell out. Why?
No binders. And no bureaucrats to open them regardless of the opinions of the local politicians.
The nature of "republican" government is local control. We don't want a soviet style of government where a federal power imposes it's will on local control.
When local control is crappy, people suffer.
I don't think the blame will rightfully fall on the federal government. Or the Red Cross, or other non-governmental assistance offered.
OMG, shit, now it all makes sense! He must have organized the whole thing! Hurricane Katrina is just a ploy by Mossad to kill Americans!
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