EBSB52 0 #26 November 28, 2004 QuoteQuoteUtah is the highest giver in two of the three categories; Wyoming in the third. Obviously in the case of Wyoming, one really big giver can make a difference (low overall population), but still... Utah totally scews its numbers since such a large population of the state are members of the Church of Latter Day Saints and they are expected to give certian % just to remain in the the good favor of the community. When 30%+ of a state gives 30% of their income to the church and writes it their taxes it raises the numbers a lot. Right, and donations to the church are about as polar as it gets. Ok, so the preacher/minister/etc gets a new caddy or a new wing onto the church, but the kids are still hungry. Even donating to corporate charities (Red Cross, American Heart Ass, etc..) stinks, as there is so much lost in the administration that it's futile. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EBSB52 0 #27 November 28, 2004 QuoteThis red/blue state thing is pretty dumb. Take a DZ party; put 51 democrats and 50 republicans in a hangar and add beer. You now have a "blue" DZ party. Does that mean everyone's going to talk about increasing taxes on the rich? Now add 2 republicans to make it a 'red' party. Will everyone start in on how excellent the war in Iraq is? Now add 2 democrats. Will that discussion do a screeching 180, now that it's a "blue" party again? The red/blue thing is as silly as categorizing all DZ's as either 'freefly' or 'RW', and saying things like "all freefly DZ's have horrible student programs because freeflyers can't fly on their bellies." As generalizations go, it's one of the stupidest ones around. Right, kind of like calling Ohio a red state as if to infer that ALL of Ohio residents are Repub.... Here's a site that exemplifies your statement: http://www.thestranger.com/2004-11-11/feature.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,679 #28 November 28, 2004 QuoteQuoteThis red/blue state thing is pretty dumb. Take a DZ party; put 51 democrats and 50 republicans in a hangar and add beer. You now have a "blue" DZ party. Does that mean everyone's going to talk about increasing taxes on the rich? Now add 2 republicans to make it a 'red' party. Will everyone start in on how excellent the war in Iraq is? Now add 2 democrats. Will that discussion do a screeching 180, now that it's a "blue" party again? The red/blue thing is as silly as categorizing all DZ's as either 'freefly' or 'RW', and saying things like "all freefly DZ's have horrible student programs because freeflyers can't fly on their bellies." As generalizations go, it's one of the stupidest ones around. Right, kind of like calling Ohio a red state as if to infer that ALL of Ohio residents are Repub.... Here's a site that exemplifies your statement: http://www.thestranger.com/2004-11-11/feature.html At least Ohio was the exception to the "Slave states are red, free states are blue" observation.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,679 #29 November 28, 2004 QuoteQuoteQuoteUtah is the highest giver in two of the three categories; Wyoming in the third. Obviously in the case of Wyoming, one really big giver can make a difference (low overall population), but still... Utah totally scews its numbers since such a large population of the state are members of the Church of Latter Day Saints and they are expected to give certian % just to remain in the the good favor of the community. When 30%+ of a state gives 30% of their income to the church and writes it their taxes it raises the numbers a lot. Right, and donations to the church are about as polar as it gets. Ok, so the preacher/minister/etc gets a new caddy or a new wing onto the church, but the kids are still hungry. Even donating to corporate charities (Red Cross, American Heart Ass, etc..) stinks, as there is so much lost in the administration that it's futile. It really doesn't matter much where the donations went. The methodology of the calculation pretty much guarantees that states with low median income come out on top, and states with high median income come out on the bottom. Any further intepretation is meaningless. End of story.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #30 November 29, 2004 So, doesn't that come back around full circle and prove the point? Or am I missing something? If two people give 1000 to charity, and that amount is 5% of one person's income, and 1% of the other person's income, then the person that gave 5% would be making a greater sacrifice than the 1%'er. Seems valid to me. Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,679 #31 November 29, 2004 QuoteSo, doesn't that come back around full circle and prove the point? Or am I missing something? If two people give 1000 to charity, and that amount is 5% of one person's income, and 1% of the other person's income, then the person that gave 5% would be making a greater sacrifice than the 1%'er. Seems valid to me. If that is what they did, it would indeed indicate what you said. That's not what they did, though.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #32 November 29, 2004 Just some food for thought. The state at number 35 (Washington) has one donor that alone donated $40 million per year for the last 3 years and has contracted the same amount for the next 2. $200 million to a single cause... Considering this person makes $865,114 a year and has to take the entire $200 million out of stock options its funny how the state can be so low on the scale.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #33 November 29, 2004 QuoteOk, so the preacher/minister/etc gets a new caddy or a new wing onto the church, but the kids are still hungry. Cut it out. That's pretty prejudiced to lump these guys all into one group. I'm not religious, but local churches have been know to do quite a bit of good - also more focused than national private charities claim to be. Have you seen the new stories about the leadership of the united way? I bet Jesse Jackson's groups are considered charity organizations - he doesn't have any shortage of luxuries. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,471 #34 November 29, 2004 >Even donating to corporate charities (Red Cross, American Heart Ass, etc..) >stinks, as there is so much lost in the administration that it's futile. The American Red Cross spends 82% of its income on its programs and 4% on its administration. The American Heart Association is 73% programs 7% adminstration. (The balance is usually fundraising.) http://www.give.org/reports/index.asp Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,679 #35 November 29, 2004 Quote>Even donating to corporate charities (Red Cross, American Heart Ass, etc..) >stinks, as there is so much lost in the administration that it's futile. The American Red Cross spends 82% of its income on its programs and 4% on its administration. The American Heart Association is 73% programs 7% adminstration. (The balance is usually fundraising.) http://www.give.org/reports/index.asp How about the Benny Hinn Ministries? (And other similar "charities"?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,471 #36 November 29, 2004 >How about the Benny Hinn Ministries? Look it up via that link. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,679 #37 November 29, 2004 Quote>How about the Benny Hinn Ministries? Look it up via that link. That's the point; they don't supply the data!... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #38 November 29, 2004 Pretty good point Bill, which calls for a map like this: http://www.princeton.edu/~rvdb/JAVA/election2004/purple_america_2004.gif Still a pretty interesting picture, and there is no sterotyping going on.-- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #39 November 29, 2004 QuoteQuoteAnd that reminds me of the Biblical story of the "widow's mite". A "mite" was an ancient coin equivalent to our penny - the smallest denomination available. The parable of the 'Widow's Mite' just makes my point. It's about the percentage of a person's income. That's exactly what I said - but you seem to be suggesting otherwise... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Muenkel 0 #40 November 30, 2004 QuoteAnd that reminds me of the Biblical story of the "widow's mite". A "mite" was an ancient coin equivalent to our penny - the smallest denomination available. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The parable of the 'Widow's Mite' just makes my point. It's about the percentage of a person's income. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- That's exactly what I said - but you seem to be suggesting otherwise... But your original formula in this thread does not take into account percentage of income. _________________________________________ Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #41 November 30, 2004 Exactly. The formula that they used helps states that have less income with better numbers. If they wanted to do something like you guys are wanting a percentage per income then its a totally different formula.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Muenkel 0 #42 November 30, 2004 Thanks Erk, I'm not usually in agreement with you and Kallend in regard to political matters, but truth is truth. I do have my political leanings, but I do draw the line when I believe the facts to be false. _________________________________________ Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Muenkel 0 #43 November 30, 2004 One thing that has not been brought up in this thread is the fact that a 'charitable donation' does not have to be in the form of money. How about donating your time in a homeless shelter, at a nursing home, visiting the chronically ill, driving the shutins to their doctors appts., etc. I could go on and on. _________________________________________ Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #44 November 30, 2004 VERY good point! My income tax form from 2001 showed a donation of $50, but I donated over 75 hours and lots of money out of my pocket (with no reciepts) to various community service projects as an Adult leader in Boy Scouts. To me donating time is worth more then donating money. All the money in the world won't clean a park, but spending a few hours will. You can try to buy your way into charity... but the only way to earn your way is to actually get out there and do something to make a difference.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #45 November 30, 2004 QuoteBut your original formula in this thread does not take into account percentage of income. I believe that it does. Your mileage may vary. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #46 November 30, 2004 QuoteQuote>Even donating to corporate charities (Red Cross, American Heart Ass, etc..) >stinks, as there is so much lost in the administration that it's futile. The American Red Cross spends 82% of its income on its programs and 4% on its administration. The American Heart Association is 73% programs 7% adminstration. (The balance is usually fundraising.) http://www.give.org/reports/index.asp How about the Benny Hinn Ministries? (And other similar "charities"? Looking around on that link, I found the following charity which you just HAVE to join John. http://www.presidentialprayerteam.org/ From the provided link: QuoteDespite written BBB Wise Giving Alliance requests in the past year, this organization has not provided current information about its finances, programs, and governance. The BBB Wise Giving Alliance reports on national charities and determines if they meet 23 voluntary standards on matters such as charity finances, appeals, and governance. Without the requested information, it cannot verify if the charity meets these standards. The Alliance does not evaluate the worthiness of the charitable program. Presidential Prayer Team is tax-exempt under section 501(c)(3) of the Internal Revenue Code. It is eligible to receive contributions deductible as charitable donations for federal income tax purposes. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
