Have you heard of apartheid?

[gus 1]

My girlfriend has been travelling a lot recently and told me about a Canadian she'd met in Australia who hadn't heard of apartheid, not that he didn't recognise the actual word but that he didn't know anything about it. I was staggered but it got me thinking, is it all that unusual?

If you don't know what I'm talking about don't feel bad about answering 'no' but take 5 minutes, do a google search and see what you find.

Gus

OutpatientsOnline.com

[Skyrad 0]

I'm guessing he was winding them up.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Erroll 49]

I lived through almost all of it. Tomorrow (the 27th) is Freedom Day in SA - the country will be celebrating 10 years of post-apartheid democracy. As time goes by, fewer and fewer of the younger generation will know anything about it. As abhorent as that system of government was, it wasn't exactly world-shaping stuff.

[Peej 0]

And how will we be spending our freedom day?

Being free of course!

Free of our past, free from work and free in the sky.

Advertisio Rodriguez / Sky

[gus 1]

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I'm guessing he was winding them up.

Maybe, but wouldn't you own up after a while? I'd hate to leave people thinking I was completely ignorant of what happened.

Gus

OutpatientsOnline.com

[peacefuljeffrey 0]

Believe it or not, there are people who live their lives perfectly content to never read a newspaper, never watch the news on t.v., never listen to the news on the radio, never read a non-fiction book... They live lives very ignorant of the world around them, and what's going on in it, whether those events affect them or not.

I always get a bemused chuckle when a newspaper story reports that some idiot was defrauded out of $5,000 or so in the following scheme:

Someone approaches them in a parking lot, claiming that he has a winning lottery ticket worth millions of dollars. He can't, however, claim the prize, he says, because he is not a legal resident of the U.S. and will be deported if he comes forward -- or at least, won't be able to claim the prize money. He is willing to sell the victim the ticket for the bargain price of only $5,000 cash. He and his friend even offer to take the person to the bank to withdraw the money, which the victim agrees to do. During the course of all this, somehow the victim is distracted (by an accomplice, or a ploy) and the thieves take off with the money.

I have read of this happening here in S. Florida at least twice, if not more. I have to figure that this is what people get for being A) pretty damned stupid and gullible, and B) unwilling to educate themselves and stay up-to-date by reading the newspaper. Anyone who read the newspaper would recognize this as a scam the moment it was attempted on them. Therefore I conclude that the victims are almost exclusively those who keep their heads in the sand, willfully. It's hard to pity them when their ignorance is their own fault.
-

-Jeffrey
"With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!"

[Gawain 0]

I remember apartheid, though I've never visited South Africa. I also remember when president le Klerk (did I spell that right?) was announcing to the parliament all the reforms that he wanted to start (1991). CNN carried it live. People were hollering and walking out of the chamber. Not a good day for the non-reformists at the time.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[peacefuljeffrey 0]

The White City, it's a joke of a name
It's a black, violent place if I remember the game
I couldn't wait to get out
But I loved to go home
Do you remember the White City fighting, yeah


Pete Townshend even wrote about Apartheid.

Well, Sting had already taken the rainforests, as well as Pinochet...
-

-Jeffrey
"With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!"

[Erroll 49]

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Therefore I conclude that the victims are almost exclusively those who keep their heads in the sand, willfully. It's hard to pity them when their ignorance is their own fault.
-

What you described sounds very much like the Nigerian 419 scam and in the majority of cases it is pure greed that leads to these people being taken in. But that is for another thread.

[Erroll 49]

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I remember apartheid, though I've never visited South Africa. I also remember when president le Klerk (did I spell that right?) was announcing to the parliament all the reforms that he wanted to start (1991). CNN carried it live. People were hollering and walking out of the chamber. Not a good day for the non-reformists at the time.

I'm impressed!
For what it's worth, President de Klerk was awarded the Nobel peace prize for his efforts. (He shared it with Nelson Mandela of course)

[kallend 1,659]

Nelson Mandela was a convicted terrorist who admitted orchestrating a bombing campaign.

He was, of course, a freedom fighter.

Something to think about when dealing with terrorists.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Erroll 49]

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Nelson Mandela was a convicted terrorist who admitted orchestrating a bombing campaign.

He was, of course, a freedom fighter.

Something to think about when dealing with terrorists.

And George W Bush is convicted 'drunk driver' who is still orchestrating bombing campaigns.

He is, of course, the chief policeman of the world.

Something to think about when dealing with American presidents.


John, your comments have absolutely no relevance to the purpose of this thread or anything that has been posted in this thread.

[damion75 0]

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Well, Sting had already taken the rainforests, as well as Pinochet...
-

These recording artists can be so greedy!

Seriously, happy Freedom Day for the 27th to all the SA reading this - I didnt know about that

I hope it was good

***************

Not one shred of evidence supports the theory that life is serious - look at the platypus.

[Tonto 1]

It was good. Some AFF, some coaching, and a free Birdman dive among some really beautiful clouds, one of which I kept off my wingtip in a big circuit for about 60 seconds of my flight!
t

It's the year of the Pig.

[storm1977 0]

Here is a quote from Mr. Mandella:

""It is a tragedy what is happening, what Bush is doing in Iraq. What I am condemning is that one power, with a president who has no foresight, who cannot think properly, is now wanting to plunge the world into a holocaust. Why does the United States behave so arrogantly? Their friend Israel has got weapons of mass destruction, but because it's their ally they won't ask the U.N. to get rid of it. They just want the oil.""


I am sorry, but this guy is an idiot!
First of all, it is ignorant to think this is about oil, secondly and more importantly, This is a regime change guy too... The pot calling the kettle black!!!

-----------------------------------------------------
Sometimes it is more important to protect LIFE than Liberty

[Skyrad 0]

LOL.....But he didn't invade someone elses country to do it.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[juanesky 0]

And also they were busy brutalizing the black population over there... SO the weaponry was for "home" consumption.

"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon

[Erroll 49]

Quote

Here is a quote from Mr. Mandella:

""It is a tragedy what is happening, what Bush is doing in Iraq. What I am condemning is that one power, with a president who has no foresight, who cannot think properly, is now wanting to plunge the world into a holocaust. Why does the United States behave so arrogantly? Their friend Israel has got weapons of mass destruction, but because it's their ally they won't ask the U.N. to get rid of it. They just want the oil.""


I am sorry, but this guy is an idiot!
First of all, it is ignorant to think this is about oil, secondly and more importantly, This is a regime change guy too... The pot calling the kettle black!!!

While I still maintain that this thread has little to do with Mandela, let me respond:

What you quoted is the opinion of one aging old man. That man happens to be an ex-President and a Nobel laureate. Through his statesmanship South Africa was able to complete the transition from Apartheid to true democracy painlessly. He is a man revered by 99% of all South Africans (both black and white). He is still admired and feted throughout the world. I believe it shows a distinct lack of class and culture to label a man of that stature an idiot simply because he expressed an opinion which differs from your's.

[Tonto 1]

Storm... Not even the Apartheid government thought he was an idiot...

Do you have a link to that quote? I have no doubt that he (Mandela) disagrees with current US foreign policy, but would like to see the context it was placed in.

Mandela holds no office in South Africa. He is an old and frail man, but probably represents the South African conscience more than any other person. He is everyone's grandfather, a moral guide to many, and he is not alone in his view of the US. He was co responsible for diffusing a half-century of violence into the country we cherish today, and he has my respect for his non violent and democratic version of “regime change.” If we could solve problems of that magnitude through diplomacy and debate - there should always be a time for talk - as opposed to war.

As an African, I can name dozens of African leaders many times worse than Saddam. The US (and the World) did nothing when 800 000 people were killed in Rawanda in 3 months after they pulled out of the UN mission in Somalia.

The 21st century US expantion is nowhere where there is no oil, and backpedals out of conflict area's (Like North Korea) that have WMD's and no oil.

Do you know the US is building a Naval base on Sao Tome - on the edge of Nigeria's offshore oil? What's the bet there's a few changes there soon.

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[juanesky 0]

I guess that when you guys bash Bush and US, it is ok to refer them as idiots, uncultured, murderous, criminals and what gives you, but when someone talks about your guys, you get pissy.

"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon

[juanesky 0]

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The 21st century US expantion is nowhere where there is no oil, and backpedals out of conflict area's (Like North Korea) that have WMD's and no oil.

Get a map and check out the Philippines, Germany, Japan, Bosnia, Somalia, Afghanistan, Panama, Vietnam, South Korea, Grenada, and other non oil producing nations. Maybe you will understand it is not about oil most of the time.

"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon

[kallend 1,659]

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John, your comments have absolutely no relevance to the purpose of this thread or anything that has been posted in this thread.

My comments are my comments to what I read on this thread. That's the purpose of a forum like this.

They came to mind because I had just listened to a 20 minute piece on the end of apartheid on NPR, and Mandela's role was prominently discussed (along with an short interview). He made the comment many years ago that one man's terrorist is another's freedom fighter (they played that too). I'm not sure if he was the original source of that quote.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

• Quote

[Tonto 1]

It depends on the guys being picked on.

If it were Verwoerd, Malan, Vorster or PW Botha, I'd be picking on them right along with you. Others, like Helen Suzman, I'd argue for till the knives came out and those around me were cold and stiff.

I know the US has little respect for European culture, but for us, Nobel Peace Prize winners like Desmond Tutu, FW De Klerk and Nelson Mandela indicate those who chose to take a higher road than some others in history.

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[Tonto 1]

Quote

Quote

The 21st century US expantion is nowhere where there is no oil, and backpedals out of conflict area's (Like North Korea) that have WMD's and no oil.

Get a map and check out the Philippines, Germany, Japan, Bosnia, Somalia, Afghanistan, Panama, Vietnam, South Korea, Grenada, and other non oil producing nations. Maybe you will understand it is not about oil most of the time.

Get a Calendar out and see when the 21st century started..

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[juanesky 0]

So I guess Afghanistan happened in 20th century

"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon