mr2mk1g 10 #1 December 19, 2003 Question: What would you use to test an airplane cockpit windscreen? Quote His glass composites also are used in airplane windshields to prevent decompression of cockpits when birds slam into them. Shorr tested his windshields with 4-pound electrocuted chickens hurtled at 600 mph. Those tests were done at the National Research Council of Canada in Ottawa. Source Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kevin922 0 #2 December 19, 2003 QuoteQuestion: What would you use to test an airplane cockpit windscreen? Quote His glass composites also are used in airplane windshields to prevent decompression of cockpits when birds slam into them. Shorr tested his windshields with 4-pound electrocuted chickens hurtled at 600 mph. Those tests were done at the National Research Council of Canada in Ottawa. Source I saw on discovery all the crap they throw in the engines to test them, included frozen chickens, sheets of ice, and various other objects. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #3 December 19, 2003 I just cant get that scene from Hot Shots out of my head Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyMan 7 #4 December 19, 2003 Yeah, the NRC windtunnel at YOW - Ottawa International is a pretty cool thing to see if you ever get a chance. Regular visits was one of the perks of going to college in Ottawa. Very cool (and often funny) stuff. _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #5 December 19, 2003 Do electrocuted chickens have some sort of advantage for this testing as compared to the non-elctrocuted kind? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #6 December 19, 2003 stiffer? thus have a better penatrative force? maybe they just struggle less when being loaded. I don't care, I just want a go Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nick 0 #7 December 19, 2003 Just make sure they aren't frozen!!! Nick Gravity- It's not just a good idea, it's the LAW! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdriver 5 #8 December 19, 2003 QuoteJust make sure they aren't frozen!!! Ahhhh...you've heard that story! LOL>..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nick 0 #9 December 19, 2003 Oh yes, not sure how true it is or if it's just an urban legend. Must admit I'm surprised how many people havn't heard of chicken test (electonics engineers have smoke tests).. Nick Gravity- It's not just a good idea, it's the LAW! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #10 December 19, 2003 I saw this 10 or 15 years ago on PBS. They called the contraption a "rooster booster".Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdriver 5 #11 December 19, 2003 For those that don't know....Apparently a company in England was testing a windshield based on this test. But they kept shattering the windows. The engineers were stumped as to their calculations of the windows strength. They repeated the test several times with the windows shattering each time. They called the test facility where they coppied it from and and asked for some quidance. The group in England were told to recount everything they did to set up the test. They got to the part about loading the chickens and said "and we loaded the frozen chickens....". There was laughter heard in the background and then the Canadian group came back with "You're not supposed to have frozen chickens!" By the way, each window they tested was worth about 50K USD or more. Ouch! Expensive mistake.Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeemax 0 #12 December 19, 2003 urban myth... ever time i hear that story, the nationality has changed. However it was a rolls royce engine (british) so the people who were laughing would have been brits Phoenix Fly - High performance wingsuits for skydiving and BASE Performance Designs - Simply brilliant canopies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdriver 5 #13 December 19, 2003 Oh well....myth. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nick 0 #14 December 19, 2003 Thats what I'd heard too, and it was the Americans that had been using frozen chickens!!! Probably a myth. Nick Gravity- It's not just a good idea, it's the LAW! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnischalke 0 #15 December 19, 2003 Got a little quandry about this test: They are firing four-pound birds at glass at speeds of 600 mph to prevent cockpit decompression, correct? Jet airliners travel about 500 mph at 20k to 30k ft, right? At lower altitudes, their speed is kept substantially lower and take-off and landing speeds are about 150, correct? Cabin compression begins at about 5k-10k, from what I have heard. Decompression *incidents* usually occur at 20k+. Exactly how high do they anticipate birds flying? mike Girls only want boyfriends who have great skills--You know, like nunchuk skills, bow-hunting skills, computer-hacking skills. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #16 December 19, 2003 QuoteMigrating birds in the Caribbean are mostly observed around 10,000 feet, although some are found half and some twice that high. Generally long-distance migrants seem to start out at about 5,000 feet and then progressively climb to around 20,000 feet. Just like jet aircraft, the optimum cruise altitude of migrants increases as their "fuel" is used up and their weight declines. Vultures sometimes rise over 10,000 feet in order to scan larger areas for food (and to watch the behavior of distant vultures for clues to the location of a feast). Perhaps the most impressive altitude record is that of a flock of Whooper Swans which was seen on radar arriving over Northern Ireland on migration and was visually identified by an airline pilot at 29,000 feet. Guess if its possible, its gotta be tested as a worst case scenario. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pilotdave 0 #17 December 19, 2003 I got to see the windshield bird strike test articles for the Comanche helicopter after the testing. At first I was a little grossed out seeing yellowish smudges where the bird hit. Then I found out we don't use real birds anymore. We use gelatin with about the same density as a bird. Much less gross that way. I also got to see some pics of the testing. It's amazing to see how much those windows deflect and still survive... and that was for a 4 lb "bird" at under 180 kts. 600 is hard to even imagine. As for why they use 600 kts, they have to always test for worst case scenario. Birds have been seen WAY up high after being caught in thunderstorms or other major updrafts. Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
newsstand 0 #18 December 19, 2003 I used to have a picture of an F-4 canopy after a bird strike. The pilots helmet too. No human injuries but he did say he needed a new flight suit because of the deposit he made in it. If I can find the pics I'll post them over the weekend. "Truth is tough. It will not break, like a bubble, at a touch; nay, you may kick it about all day like a football, and it will be round and full at evening." -- Oliver Wendell Holmes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiverRick 0 #19 December 20, 2003 QuoteDo electrocuted chickens have some sort of advantage for this testing as compared to the non-elctrocuted kind? They're easier to get in the cannon when they're dead. never pull low......unless you are Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChasingBlueSky 0 #20 December 20, 2003 QuoteOh well....myth. Chris, Next time you get to talk to James - ask him about the frozen chickens that GE used._________________________________________ you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me.... I WILL fly again..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gremlin 0 #21 December 20, 2003 With the temperatures you get at 30,000 ft surely the frozen chicken is the closest approximation of what you would find up there anyway? I'm drunk, you're drunk, lets go back to mine.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
captainpooby 0 #22 December 20, 2003 QuoteGot a little quandry about this test: They are firing four-pound birds at glass at speeds of 600 mph to prevent cockpit decompression, correct? Jet airliners travel about 500 mph at 20k to 30k ft, right? At lower altitudes, their speed is kept substantially lower and take-off and landing speeds are about 150, correct? Cabin compression begins at about 5k-10k, from what I have heard. Decompression *incidents* usually occur at 20k+. Exactly how high do they anticipate birds flying? I looked out the door of a cessna at 7000' once to see a sea gull cruising around. Over farm land! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #23 December 20, 2003 QuoteThey are firing four-pound birds at glass at speeds of 600 mph to prevent cockpit decompression, correct? Not really. They've had a lot of problems with birdstrike at or below 1,000 feet. Serious problems when the bird goes into the engine. More survivable problems when a bird hits the windshield. But since the first 1,000 feet are takeoff and landing - the most dangerous parts of the flight - you don't want conditions aggravated by a broken windshield. Would you want to be landing a plane and have a bird come through the windshield? You could probably land it safely, but you don't need the hassle.Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DaGimp 0 #24 December 20, 2003 Question: What is fast food?"Professor of Pimpology"~~~Bolas Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChasingBlueSky 0 #25 December 20, 2003 QuoteWith the temperatures you get at 30,000 ft surely the frozen chicken is the closest approximation of what you would find up there anyway? Watch the "Making of the Boeing 777" documentary that is often showed on History channel as a Modern Marvel or even on Discovery Wings....they have video of the chicken gun shooting frozen chickens into the blades,and the engine keeps running. Those are the best engines in the world, and were designed to allow the 777 to fly on one of them for three hours._________________________________________ you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me.... I WILL fly again..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
