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hmatousek

Does anyone care anymore?????

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I have been reading the numerous threads about the current adminitration in office and I see how important it is to many people. It is to myself as well. The one thing I am having trouble with is the fact that the entire government conversation has been about war and terrorist attacts. As I see the importance of it at this time I ask myself does anyone have any concern about any other issues?

Is anyone worried about the current state of our education system in this country? I work with children daily and see many great teachers leaving the field because they are sick of dealing with more and more "red tape" that is keeping them from doing thier job.

Our education system is, and has been for the past four years, going through changes that are not helping our children.

I know I am speaking from a biased position but I would really like the opinion of others. I have been teaching for five years and love my students. I am seriously debating getting out of the profession because
A) it's becoming more of a political dealing than a helping profession
and
B) it's not possible to support a family (or myself) on the income.

The teachers of this nation cannot send thier children to college on the money most of them our making (especially if your single).

I appreciate any feedback you are willing to give.

Heather
Life doesn't have to be perfect in order to be beautiful!

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I think teachers are the most underpaid profession in the country. After all, without good, quality teachers to educate our children, how can we contine to think that we be a powerful country in the next couple of generations?

I always wanted to be a teacher, and wished I would have gotten an education degree instead of a business degree in college. I've even gone as far as getting the information to get a master's degree. The cost of a graduate degree and the low teacher's pay has discouraged me, but I stil feel drawn to working with children as a profession.
She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

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My mother is a professor of early childhood education at a private college here in ohio. Trust me, i hear about it all the time...but there is not much any one person can do about it (besides perhas the president).


Dont you get the summer off? maybe you should moonlight with tandems?????;)

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After all, without good, quality teachers to educate our children, how can we contine to think that we be a powerful country in the next couple of generations?



Here's is a NOVEL idea..... PARENTS

yes I'm a parent and daily I am disgusted with the LACK of interest parents have in their children. They mostly believe the government is here to raise them, feed them, educate them, employ them... NO WONDER things are such a mess..

I VOTE that we all TEACH our children everything we know, keep teachers wages the same and make their jobs HALF AS HARD as they have become

maybe we should start a new thread on this, I know I could go on for ever about sugar, caffeine, HOURS of homework, bribery, double standards, etc,etc, etc

btw mine is 9

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Our education system is the product of a committee, so it pleases no one.

My girls are in Catholic school, where I am on a first name basis with the pricipal and their teacher.

California public schools get their funding through Average Daily Attendance, so the focus is on warm seats, not stimulated minds. Additionally, at the high school level, lots of the girls are dressed up like Brittney Spears clones, and I can assure you when I was in high school, if I had that distraction, I would still be reading at the 7th grade level.

The teachers at my girl's school make even less than their unionized public school counterparts, but they stay forever, cause the parents are all involved, and cause they get to teach.

Gotta go to church, laters. My kids sing in the choir with their teacher's daughter.

:P

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After all, without good, quality teachers to educate our children, how can we contine to think that we be a powerful country in the next couple of generations?



Here's is a NOVEL idea..... PARENTS

yes I'm a parent and daily I am disgusted with the LACK of interest parents have in their children. They mostly believe the government is here to raise them, feed them, educate them, employ them... NO WONDER things are such a mess..

I VOTE that we all TEACH our children everything we know, keep teachers wages the same and make their jobs HALF AS HARD as they have become

maybe we should start a new thread on this, I know I could go on for ever about sugar, caffeine, HOURS of homework, bribery, double standards, etc,etc, etc

btw mine is 9



This is a nice idea and all, but the truth of the matter is that in any case after elementary school, teachers are specialized. Just as you didn't major in everything, you aren't really qualified to teach your kid everything. Unless you know everything, in which case, more power to you. But until parents know everything or everyone can afford to go to private schools, the government's gonna have to do just a little educating for us.

Never go to a DZ strip show.

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No qualified to teach my daughter everything I know? I think you are wrong. I did not attempt to place a level of accomplishement on this... as I stated...

"I VOTE that we all TEACH our children everything we know, keep teachers wages the same and make their jobs HALF AS HARD as they have become"

At this level of participation, everyone has an easier time..
have we forgotten that SCHOOL public or private, is not all that old a concept. In fact a couple hundred years ago, we didn't bother. We taught our kids what they needed to excell in our world.

I see an entire generation who may know the Pathagorean Theorem but they don't know anything about the real world.

I thank the teachers for trying hard, but if I were them, I would be blaming the parents of these difficult to teach kids that are making their jobs so hard, not the person signing my check.

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I think that the war is a more glamorous media flashpoint, but that the economy, education and healthcare on the minds of the common joe-- more than reporters care to acknowledge.

The school district in my town is in serious trouble, and is desperately trying to pass a $8 mil levy. I understand that part of the reason for this need is the unfunded federal mandates. Part of it is our state funding system (OH's system has been declared unconstitutional for years, but has yet to be fixed.) As a person with a very small income, married to someone who works as a bus driver, we're in a quandry. My husband may lose our insurance benefits if this levy doesn't pass, but at the same time, we can barely afford our home as it is.

Having worked human services for years, I'm totally against cutting teachers, or freezing their salaries. I'm against cutting educational programs, and I understand the benefits of music, art and even sports. But, we see tons of waste in the school district.

I am for more parental involvement. While I think it's great that the schools can provide transportation of all of the sporting events, and my husband gets overtime to drive these kids everywhere, where are the parents? Why should I, having no children, pay extra taxes, for these kids to go to swim meets and football games? Why aren't the parents transporting their kids, and their kids' friends? When I was in school, that's how it was done. (I know that parents work-- I had a single mom. If bussing it cut, I know that somehow these people will make it happen.) What happened to parents volunteering in their kid's classrooms? Why do we suddenly need so many salaried aides?

I guess all I'm trying to say is that people are concerned about education. People do have respect for teachers and all that they do. I believe you should be paid better than a "living wage". But, I also think that parents should be more accountable for making the schools a success. If there are behavior problems, the answer shouldn't be an aide in every class. What happened to good old fashioned discipline? If funding is short, parents should step up and fill the gaps, instead of just asking the community to throw more money at the problem.

***stepping off the soapbox now***

I'm sorry for your situation. Unfortunately, you'll have to decide what's best for you and your family.

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OK, sorry if I misinterpreted what you said. Of course you should teach your daughter everything you know. But to think that this alone will suffice for an education is wrong. I don't think we should pay our teachers more in order to assuage their troubles, but rather to attract more qualified and caring teachers to the occupation. Like, maybe some people would want to teach rather than be a lawyer if the pay was better. Who knows

Never go to a DZ strip show.

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This is a nice idea and all, but the truth of the matter is that in any case after elementary school, teachers are specialized. Just as you didn't major in everything, you aren't really qualified to teach your kid everything. Unless you know everything, in which case, more power to you. But until parents know everything or everyone can afford to go to private schools, the government's gonna have to do just a little educating for us.




True, teachers are trained in certain "areas," however, my mother was a junior high school teacher before she had children and she was trained to teach anything from history to economics. As far as I am concerned, after hearing about some of my mother's experiences, the education system has had some major cracks in it for a VERY long time. You want to hear some frightening stories about students harassing their teachers, and students that my mom tried to teach, but could only show up maybe once or twice a week because they had to take care of sick family members. I could go on forever myself.

I consider myself lucky. My mother encouraged me to read, to write down ideas, and to learn anything and everything. Part of the the problem today IS the lack of parental participation, the other half is education being LEFT to the government instead of taking a proactive stance and changing the current system.

I was also lucky to grow up near a top ten university whose professors kids went to my high school. We are almost always rated as one of the top 3 schools in the state. We had the resources growing up, however, not a lot of schools do...which is a damn shame...the real question is...what do we as voting citizens doing to make the changes...:|


P.S. Heather, just ask me some of the stories that my mom told me...scary stuff from back in the '70s in Louisiana...:SB|...Sweetie, I understand exactly where you are coming from...wish I could help ya...[:/]
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~...

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I am for more parental involvement. While I think it's great that the schools can provide transportation of all of the sporting events, and my husband gets overtime to drive these kids everywhere, where are the parents? Why should I, having no children, pay extra taxes, for these kids to go to swim meets and football games? Why aren't the parents transporting their kids, and their kids' friends? When I was in school, that's how it was done. (I know that parents work-- I had a single mom. If bussing it cut, I know that somehow these people will make it happen.) What happened to parents volunteering in their kid's classrooms? Why do we suddenly need so many salaried aides?



I totally agree with more parental involvement. Unfortunately, the parents when they could be taking their kids to the swim meets are out working to pay for their house as you are. If they don't keep working, the kids may not have lunch money the next week for school. There is such a large problem with Ohio's school system that it's rediculous. Being in Athens, Ohio an even poorer town that Xenia, I see 6th graders that can't read Curious George or the name Stacey. Most of the time the kids come into school shivering from the bus stop because they don't have winter coats.

Every winter quarter, I put on a coat drive for all the kids in the elementary schools. I'm thinking about starting a post on here so if people were willing, they could ship a coat to me to give to the kids.

I wish everyone in the world had the money they needed.

Oh, well, what to do about this big mess?!?!?!?!
Tunnel Pink Mafia Delegate
www.TunnelPinkMafia.com

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I am glad to see that you are on the side of empowering our future!



I'm not quite sure how to take that. Are you being serious or sarcastic?

I am for children having a quality education. I'm for teachers being paid very well for their services. I'm not for cutting programs that make for well-rounded, responsible young adults, but I'm not for mismanagement of the community's funds, or for the schools (and community $) being solely responsible for that outcome. Like I said, as individual taxpayers, we're in a quandry. I was only hoping to make it evident that, indeed, education is on the minds of voters, and that I feel for professionals who have to choose between doing what they love and are trained for, and being able to support their own family.

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I am glad to see that you are on the side of empowering our future!



I'm not quite sure how to take that. Are you being serious or sarcastic?

I am for children having a quality education. I'm for teachers being paid very well for their services. I'm not for cutting programs that make for well-rounded, responsible young adults, but I'm not for mismanagement of the community's funds, or for the schools (and community $) being solely responsible for that outcome. Like I said, as individual taxpayers, we're in a quandry. I was only hoping to make it evident that, indeed, education is on the minds of voters, and that I feel for professionals who have to choose between doing what they love and are trained for, and being able to support their own family.



I mean it seriously.
The arguement is truly centered around Responsibility if you ask me, and you seem to be asking parents to take some responsibility.

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I left a teaching position in a catholic school, mostly because of money.

Most of the catholic school teachers are either married or nuns. They are not dependant on the single income. However, as these teachers retire, catholic schools are finding it very difficult to replace them. A new teacher will coome, stay a year til they have their credential, and then move on to a higher paying job in a public school, not because they don't want to stay, but because they can't afford to stay.

As a catholic school teacher, I was making $23,000 a year. That's a take home pay of something like $1400 a month. Rent on my apartment is $910 a month (and it isn't luxury by far...its small, but in a safe area. Living by myself, safe neighborhoods are a must). Add in gasoline to commute to and from work, because I couldn't even afford to live in the same county (Orange county rent is rediculous!!!) and supplies for my classroom (if you need a pen or paper at an office, you go to the supply closet and get some. Teachers have to PAY out of pocket for almost everything they use in their classrooms!) I couldn't even afford to eat. I had to borrow money from my parents just so I'd have food.

My boyfriend at the time was also teaching, and he had to tend bar most evenings to make his rent. He made more money as a part time BARTENDER than as a full time teacher! That's just fucking sad.

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Sad, your right...
but 23000 per year is quite alot of money for a single person. I supported our family of 3 on 1/2 that money for a couple of years, and to this day, with 3 businesses, we don't make much more than that in take home income. Seems to me, you were living outside of your means. You either love your job or don't, it's a worthless life if you only motivated by the money.
We're talking in a forum of people who spend thousands each year on skydiving...
its all about choices...

don't hate me, I'm just passionate about these things...
stepping off my soapbox now...

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Unfortunately, the parents when they could be taking their kids to the swim meets are out working to pay for their house as you are.



Some parents are in this situation, and I understand that, especially since I had a single working mom. Not all parents are working at game time-- they seem to find the time to make it to these events. Why can't they pile a few more in their Expeditions and minivans?



Quote

Every winter quarter, I put on a coat drive for all the kids in the elementary schools. I'm thinking about starting a post on here so if people were willing, they could ship a coat to me to give to the kids.



And that's awesome. I usually ending up buying new shoes for the needy kids at Christmas as well. But, the families' personal budgets for clothing are a separate entitiy from mismanagement of school district funds. I understand the whole tax base issue and low income community ramifications--as stated above, re: OH's funding system. What bothers me as a taxpayer is that if I pony up more of my hard-earned dollars, I'd expect that the school district would squeeze the hell out of every penny-- not substitute my money for parental responsibility and involvement.



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I wish everyone in the world had the money they needed.



Amen, sister



Quote

Oh, well, what to do about this big mess?!?!?!?!



I really don't know... but obviously, we're all thinking about it, so perhaps that can be of some comfort to our original poster.

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Thank you to everyone who took the time to respond.

A few things I wanted to respond too.

No I am not member of the NEA. I used to be and then changed districts. I feel however that the amount of money teachers put into thier union is a waste because when it comes right down to it the unions do very little. However the districts in the state I teach are pretty much forced to be in the union meaning that if I am not in the union I still have to pay them. I don't really know why, I'd rather educate my students than deal with this. For this reason I am a member of the IFT which is a branch of the American Federation of Teachers (AFT).

As far as keeping teachers wages the same. Currently the teachers at a master level (they have a masters degree in education) are making a salary about $5,000 above the poverty level. My state is not the worst, many others are much lower. For six years of college and student loans I find this insulting.

Do I get summers off? In the five years I have been teaching I had one summer off for relocation. Yes the extra time off is nice, mainly for organizing your classroom and student grades so you can make the year as stimulating to the mind as possible. I don't know a teacher who can take a full summer off. I usually work for a summer camp or teach summer school.

I guess my reasons for posting this are to make people aware and to see what a sample of the population feels is going on. I agree with the fact that there is a lot of waste and something does need to be done about it. I don't think however this is the fault of the teachers.

I'm am very happy so many of you are for parents becoming more involved. I agree and feel this has been a big part of many of the problems our nation faces dealing with our youth.

Heather
Life doesn't have to be perfect in order to be beautiful!

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I also believe that more and more the "teaching" profession is more like running for a political office. You have to be more PC then TC (teaching children) in your profession due to the over abundance of politics in the classroom. I have a daughter who is Special Needs (she has Apert Syndrome) and more and more time is wasted in meeting after meeting with administrations types discussing what she may or may not be entitled to, and at one point having to go to mediation just to get them to consider giving her an aide. Now if you could some how find out how much time was spent in all the meetings and put a dollor figure with it...well there is your salary increase. That alone would put you into the area that you are worth. We (my X and I) have spent many hours away from work (not paid) going to meetings with teachers and team members (them being paid for being there), so I too know of how your loss affects all of us. There are many well paid administrators in all school districts that just love to spend money that doesn't come out of their pocket books. Just because it is there. But when contract time comes up there isn't any more money to share with the teachers and aids. Yes, I agree, most teachers are severly underpaid for the job that we as Parents are asking of them....but I for one am glad that there are a few around that teach because they want to teach. If you are seeking more financial rewards for your expertise then quite possibly you should consider a change, into a more financial rewarding field then teaching. I wish I could give all the teachers that work with my daughter what they are worth....priceless. Mark
So, you bring your beer?

Its 5 o'clock somewhere
POPS #9344

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Cost of living in california is rediculous. Food is more expensive. Gas is more expensive. Rents are incredibly high. I was not living beyond my means. I had no real furniture to speak of. Shelves were boards and bricks. My coffee table was a giant wooden spool. I never went out to eat unless someone else was paying the bill. Ditto for fun stuff. Food was mostly ramen or mac and cheese. Having a roommate wasn't practical. My friends were mostly still at grad schools out of state, or not ready to move out yet, and if I'd moved in with my boyfriend, we'd have both been fired (eventually, we did anyway, but then had to spend the rest of the year sneaking around, which put a lot of stress on the relationship).


2003:
Average rent in Los Angeles County: $1346
Average Rent in Tuscon, AZ: $614 (for comparison)


In December, monthly rents ranged from $774 in San Bernardino to $998 in Anaheim to $2,436 in Santa Monica, according to a RealFacts study. During 2002, the monthly rent at large complexes in Los Angeles rose by 5.4% to $1,274

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Yes Nightingale, I understand what you mean by cost of living. I am from Chicago and the rent here is rediculous. You should not have to move out of the state you live in. You simply should be paid more. I am sorry you cannot teach because of this.
Life doesn't have to be perfect in order to be beautiful!

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i am disgusted with the lack of parents interest in their children as well. It is part of the problem And I believe the problem is a combination of problems that create one big problem. It would take several million people to have the same revelation about attitude and family all at once to even make a dent in what needs to change. I am concerned about it Heather, but all I can do is my part with my kids and my community for now. The issues with our childrens' education is why my hubby and I live where we do now. For the most part, We live in a small town where everyone know one another, and we are on a first name basis with all the teachers, and the principal, and for that matter, the superintendant of schools.I am also fortunate to be home with my kids most of the time, and not many parents are able to do that anymore, and that is part of the key. Both parents working, makes it tough on the kids. Some folks don't have a choice about that. I care, just don't have the answers to fix it.-Caress[:/]
I've learned.... That being kind is more important than being
right.

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Hey, I took so long.
As a former LA County resident, I can attest to your lack of lifestyle, much like you, I had a cardboard box for a coffee table, and cinderblock/2X4 entertainment center. I have lived in several states since then, and you know what I've found? Milk in Florida, Texas, Illinios, Tennessee, California and everywhere else except maybe NY & HI, is stil $3.50 per gallon! My rent has ranged from 425/mo in California (N. Hollywood) to $500 for the 5 bedroom house I live in now (with a roommate). I ate all my groceries from the Arleta 99 cent store, and ya know what.... it was not so bad at all. There are times I may have wanted more, but so what?
It was the choice I made, and to this day, I would still choose being happy over money. I hope that I can teach my daughter the same values in life, so that she may be happy with a roof over her head, food in her belly (gourmet or not) and a family who loves her. These are the things we need to get back to.. It COSTS nothing to educate and empower our kids. I too wish that you could've made more money teaching, but in a way, I'm glad that those who are still teaching, are not there for the money. I supply my kids class with as much as I can. Volunteer whenever is possible, but that doesn't have anything to do with the amazing amount of time & power I have over her the rest of the time she is not in school. We've been in classes where everyone had to share 5 books, there was no blackboard, and no teachers aid... oddly enough, she received the best CARE in that class of all others no matter how high tech.

It doesn't take money to make a difference in a child's life

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