Falcon and Spectre for first canopy?

[FallloutboyDAoC 0]

A main is the last piece of the puzzle i need to complete my rig and i saw an add for this canopy for very cheap.

I've jumped the sabre2 170 rental (canopy)rig for 53 jumps. I know the falcon is a f1-11 canopy, and am wondering how much different it would be from a sabre2

I weigh about 150 out the door

A spectre 150 is also a possibility if the guy ever gets back to me. I dont really know what the differences would be between a 7-cell and a 9-cell canopy

[pilotdave 0]

A falcon and a sabre2 are extremely different. If you liked the sabre2, chances are you won't like the falcon. Expect much firmer openings and a much less powerful flare. The falcon will probably take a bit more timing to get the landings right. Either one at a light wingloading is probably ok for a first canopy, but they have little in common as far as flight characteristics go.

As far as the spectre vs sabre2, I find them to be somewhat similar until it comes time to land. I much prefer the sabre2's flare. The spectre (and many other 7-cells) requires better timing to get the flare right... more like the falcon but way better.

PD has a great demo program... try a spectre and see how it compares to the sabre2 you've jumped.

Dave

[FallloutboyDAoC 0]

I see.

Are the openings extremely hard, or just somewhat quick? And for landings, would i be coming in faster on a falcon or a sabre1? (I ask sabre1 because they seem to be more commonly sold used than sabre2's). And for flaring, once i got it down would the landings be soft or should i expect to do PLF's on most of my landings?

[piratemike 0]

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A main is the last piece of the puzzle i need to complete my rig and i saw an add for this canopy for very cheap.

I've jumped the sabre2 170 rental (canopy)rig for 53 jumps. I know the falcon is a f1-11 canopy, and am wondering how much different it would be from a sabre2

I weigh about 150 out the door

A spectre 150 is also a possibility if the guy ever gets back to me. I dont really know what the differences would be between a 7-cell and a 9-cell canopy

Although I do not know very much about the falcon, in general, ZP canopies fly different than f-111 canopies.

For a short discussion on the differences between a 7-cell and a 9-cell, try this:
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=156322;search_string=differences%207-cell%209-cell;#156322

I quite like the spectre canopies. They are quite fine canopies for your main.

[Chubba 0]

I found the Sabre2 significantly better in every single aspect compared to the Falcon I had jumped as rental gear. I didn't respond very well to F1-11 canopies, I stood up maybe 2 or 3 jumps in my first 20, many caused injury. I've got 25 jumps on my Sabre2 170 now and all 25 have been soft standups in a variety of wind conditions.

The Spectre I enjoyed, beautiful openings but it definitely was harder to land (for me) compared to the Sabre2, that being said I did stand up the landings, just not gracefully

You couldn't pay me to go back to F1-11 canopies. I see students/jumpers on rental gear every week touching down softly on the same canopies I hammered in on, bugger me what the problem is

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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A main is the last piece of the puzzle i need to complete my rig and i saw an add for this canopy for very cheap.

I've jumped the sabre2 170 rental (canopy)rig for 53 jumps. I know the falcon is a f1-11 canopy, and am wondering how much different it would be from a sabre2

With a $300-$400 budget I'd find a Sabre 150 or Monarch 155 with jumps left on the lineset. Maybe a Triathlon 160 - they open softer, but are seven cells. You probably want to be flying a canopy that planes out and lands the same as what you'll be jumping farther into youor skydiving career (just slower).

For $600- $800 I'd look at Spectre 150s and maybe Safire/Omega 149s with jumps left on the lineset. The newer tapered designs open nicer than rectangular canopies and are more fun to fly.

Something ZP with 800 jumps that's on its second line set would be perfect; you can get a couple hundred jumps out of it, sell it, and the next guy can get a couple hundred jumps out before it needs to be relined.

The big thing here is that you can get nice landings at higher wing loadings for longer out of ZP canopies. A tapered 150 might be a nice canopy for a really small person, a decent second or third canopy for a medium sized guy, and then a sixth canopy for a real heavy weight.

[kawisixer01 0]

My first canopy is a spectre 170. I'm the same weight as you. I love it so far. Nice soft openings, and my landings have all been nice soft standups except a couple that were my own damn fault.

[erdnarob 1]

Flying a Spectre after having made 53 jumps on a Sabre 2 is like driving a Volkswagen after several years of driving a BMW. As people told you it will be even be worst by flying a 7 cells F111 canopy. But I agree you have to go with your budget as long as your canopy lands you safely.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

[mnealtx 0]

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Flying a Spectre after having made 53 jumps on a Sabre 2 is like driving a Volkswagen after several years of driving a BMW.

Different flight/landing characterics between the Spectre/Sabre II? Absolutely. VW compared to BMW? C'mon, dude - be at least a LITTLE less fanboyish, ok? I know several people jumping Spectres (including a couple of my old AFF instructors) and nobody seemed to be displeased with it's performance. T

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As people told you it will be even be worst by flying a 7 cells F111 canopy. But I agree you have to go with your budget as long as your canopy lands you safely.

Falcon is a 9 cell canopy. My BIL jumped one for years.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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Flying a Spectre after having made 53 jumps on a Sabre 2 is like driving a Volkswagen after several years of driving a BMW.

Different flight/landing characterics between the Spectre/Sabre II? Absolutely. VW compared to BMW? C'mon, dude - be at least a LITTLE less fanboyish, ok?

It'd be a great analogy if there was something about the PD canopies which equated to "minor electrical problems" although there hasn't been anything wrong with any PD canopy that I've jumped.

I jumped a Spectre 135 for a while after I herniated my L4-L5 disc in a horrible sneezing accident. Prior to that I put 200+ jumps on a Samurai 105, 600 jumps on a Stiletto 120, and 200 jumps on Batwing 134 and hundreds of jumps on Monarch 135 + 155s.

While it opened a lot nicer than my Monarch 135 and stopped more completely (it's not square) it wasn't as swoopy especially without induced speed. Like a Volkswagen. It got me from point A to B with no hassles but just wasn't as interesting to land. Toggle turn sensitivity was better than a square. I could probably loose more altitude in a dive with a Spectre but getting and maintaining a good plane out takes more. VW vs. BMW. The VW may be just as fast but a 3 series will feel better.

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I know several people jumping Spectres (including a couple of my old AFF instructors) and nobody seemed to be displeased with it's performance.

There's nothing wrong with a Spectre. They open nice. They land OK. They don't wallow like big accuracy canopies. Older ones are good values on the used canopy market. Without induced speed they just don't land like sportier designs.

It's not going to be worse than an F111 seven cell or a ZP PD Lightning though. DIfferent than other modern canopies; some aspects better ( less likely to spin up if you have a bad Birdman opening) and some worse (I'd take Batwing or Stiletto landings over Spectres any day; with the date stamp on my Stiletto being 1994. Neither canopy is appropriate for a new jumper though).

[freakflyer9999 1]

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I see.

Are the openings extremely hard, or just somewhat quick? And for landings, would i be coming in faster on a falcon or a sabre1? (I ask sabre1 because they seem to be more commonly sold used than sabre2's). And for flaring, once i got it down would the landings be soft or should i expect to do PLF's on most of my landings?

The Falcon is a reserve canopy (that can be jumped as a main) and can open extremely briskly. I purchased one because it was cheap. I quickly got rid of it after some of the hardest openings I'd ever had.

The gent who bought it planned on doing demos with it and didn't want to ever take it to terminal.

Yes, people have jumped Falcons for years. Yes, you will probably survive most of the jumps. Will you like it. I doubt it.

[topper 0]

I've just gone from a Falcon to a SabreII, there is obviously going to be a big difference, the SabreII is much better to fly and I have much more fun on it.

That said, I like the Falcon, it was cheap, got me in the air, never had a problem with landings, stood them all up in all different wind speeds (inc nil wind).

The openings can be hard sometimes, but that is down to packing, i found it better to flat pack and roll the nose 2-3 times (roll the outside 4 cells inwards), after this opens fine, and best of all??????.............................................It's the easiest canopy I've ever packed!!!!!!!!

Another good thing about Falcon over SabreII...........no end cell closure!!!!!!

I've kept my Falcon (in my old rig) as a backup rig for when my Cypress has to go off for servicing!!