riggerrob 561
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yarpos 4
best round reserve I ever used was the British GQ Protector. It was only 17ft in diameter and a little un-nerving to look at once open...looked too small. Had a low rate of descent and was made out of a very low porosity fabric. The canopy got a bad wrap in my country when a guy severely damaged one and went in as a result. The cause was suspected to be a not as per the manual roll pack of the reserve.
regards, Steve
the older I get...the better I was
the older I get...the better I was
pchapman 262
Quotebest round reserve I ever used was the British GQ Protector. It was only 17ft in diameter and a little un-nerving to look at once open...looked too small.
For anyone scared of the "17 ft" round, I'll note that it APPEARS that GQ uses INFLATED diameter not constructed diameter for rounds. Even their modern rounds for civilian pilot bailout rigs are typically quoted at 4.8m diameter, which is 15 3/4 ft, clearly a different measuring scheme.
(And amazingly the accident report for that possible roll pack fatality showed up on the web at http://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/investigation_reports/1974/AAIR/pdf/197400007.pdf. Poorly sequenced round openings can be bad -- that one was deployed by a tumbling jumper at terminal with nothing out, from a belly mount, with no pilot chute, and no diaper (I presume as it was '74). Yuck. It inverted during deployment and burned big enough holes that it wouldn't stay inflated.)
The canopy got a bad wrap ...
That'll do it! 
~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~
yarpos 4
regards, Steve
the older I get...the better I was
the older I get...the better I was
tbrown 26
I remember that square reserves were not as quickly accepted as you might think nowadays. Many of us had recently spent $300 - 400 on new, low porosity, steerable, diaper deployed round reserves and saw no reason to have to turn around again and drop another $600 or so on something new and experimental. Strong Enterprises capitalized on this with an ad they ran, giving ten reasons why a round was a safer bet than a square when a reserve was needed.
Also remember seeing a guy make a canopy transfer below a grand to a round reserve, after his 7 cell main started to split in halfon him. the round acted as an anchor and the square main just sort of fell over in front and he easily chopped it, swinging backward and away from it under his reserve.
That was all a long time ago. Like anything else new there were bugs to be ironed out. Today's square reserves are a much better design than the early pioneer models. But it really did take the acid mash scare to finally move everyone over to squares, like 'em or not.
Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity !
Also remember seeing a guy make a canopy transfer below a grand to a round reserve, after his 7 cell main started to split in halfon him. the round acted as an anchor and the square main just sort of fell over in front and he easily chopped it, swinging backward and away from it under his reserve.
That was all a long time ago. Like anything else new there were bugs to be ironed out. Today's square reserves are a much better design than the early pioneer models. But it really did take the acid mash scare to finally move everyone over to squares, like 'em or not.
Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity !
grimmie 177
About 15 years ago I followed a guy on a round reserve ride down. He pounded in on the West side of the runway at Eloy. He just missed a barbed wire fence but broke his ankle in a dramatic crash landing...I mean PLF...
My 1st reserve ride was on a 23' Tri-Con, opened on my back at terminal, from a center pull belly wart...when I woke up a few seconds after deploying, I still had the reserve ripcord in my hand but was missing a shoe.
The worst part of the experience was the tremendous amount of oscillation going on as the air spilled out of the skirt, I was about 245 lbs. at the time, and it felt like every time the canopy would swing I picked up a few FPS in the descent.
I was coming down right onto a concrete runway and I just KNEW I was gonna be busted up from the impact, feet & knees together, elbows in...I was going to give it my best shot at minimising the certain pain and damage.
My bucket of luck was a lot fuller back then, I landed at the top end of an oscillation so softly I 'could' have easily done a stand-up...thing is, I was so set on doing the PLF I just stood there for a couple heartbeats after touchdown, looked around in awe...then just kinda fell over.
Did another on the Tri-Con some months later on a demo, just missed swinging into a water tower in a city park...scared me enough to buck up and order a brand new, top of the line Strong 26' Lo-Po...sold the Tri-Con in 78-79, still have the LoPo!
~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~
QuoteAbout 15 years ago I followed a guy on a round reserve ride down. He pounded in on the West side of the runway at Eloy. He just missed a barbed wire fence but broke his ankle in a dramatic crash landing...I mean PLF...
So? The round reserve save his life as it was designed for. Pleasant landing is not really guaranteed there.
fogobo 0
Here we go. I have about 1500 jumps on a Para-Commander. I have also jumped triangular things and squares. I have had 8 round reserve rides. Manage to land on the DZ each time via good spotting (a lost art). I used a 23' low profile steerable reserve and the landings were fine. Even had a a few stand-ups. I put 100 jumps on an Irving "Protector" reserve deployed from a bag. I used it as a main canopy for turning style. It weighed two thirds less than a PC. It had about 4 mph drive and stand-ups were the norm, but it was the spotting that made all the difference. You have more options where to put a square down off the DZ. The safety factor for reserves has increased I believe, not because its square or round, but because it is deployed from a container mounted on your back and not on your chest. Rear mounted round reserves in a bag would be very safe. Less parts - no slider or worry about or line twists. How many malfunctions are chopped with a fully inflated main with only line twists or a tangled slider. Would you rather land in a car park under a fully opened round reserve with line twists than to land on grass with a square reserve with line twists or tangled slider?
pms07 3
QuoteMy 1st reserve ride was on a 23' Tri-Con, opened on my back at terminal, from a center pull belly wart...when I woke up a few seconds after deploying, I still had the reserve ripcord in my hand but was missing a shoe.
The worst part of the experience was the tremendous amount of oscillation going on as the air spilled out of the skirt, I was about 245 lbs. at the time, and it felt like every time the canopy would swing I picked up a few FPS in the descent.
I was coming down right onto a concrete runway and I just KNEW I was gonna be busted up from the impact, feet & knees together, elbows in...I was going to give it my best shot at minimising the certain pain and damage.
My bucket of luck was a lot fuller back then, I landed at the top end of an oscillation so softly I 'could' have easily done a stand-up...thing is, I was so set on doing the PLF I just stood there for a couple heartbeats after touchdown, looked around in awe...then just kinda fell over.
Did another on the Tri-Con some months later on a demo, just missed swinging into a water tower in a city park...scared me enough to buck up and order a brand new, top of the line Strong 26' Lo-Po...sold the Tri-Con in 78-79, still have the LoPo!
245lbs under a 23 tri-con had to be exciting (read scary...). My only tri-con ride was when I weighed about 170ish and I thought the landing was kind of sporty.
Anyway, I have about 400 round jumps and a dozen actual round reserve rides, plus maybe another 50 jumps either using a round reserve as a main or test jumps. Favorite round reserve by far was the 24' Phantom. Packed very small and I stood it up the only time I used it...at a 6500' MSL DZ.
Should this to be moved to Bonfire?
Round reserves are not coming back.
Round reserves are not coming back.
QuoteQuoteMy 1st reserve ride was on a 23' Tri-Con, opened on my back at terminal, from a center pull belly wart...when I woke up a few seconds after deploying, I still had the reserve ripcord in my hand but was missing a shoe.
The worst part of the experience was the tremendous amount of oscillation going on as the air spilled out of the skirt, I was about 245 lbs. at the time, and it felt like every time the canopy would swing I picked up a few FPS in the descent.
I was coming down right onto a concrete runway and I just KNEW I was gonna be busted up from the impact, feet & knees together, elbows in...I was going to give it my best shot at minimising the certain pain and damage.
My bucket of luck was a lot fuller back then, I landed at the top end of an oscillation so softly I 'could' have easily done a stand-up...thing is, I was so set on doing the PLF I just stood there for a couple heartbeats after touchdown, looked around in awe...then just kinda fell over.
Did another on the Tri-Con some months later on a demo, just missed swinging into a water tower in a city park...scared me enough to buck up and order a brand new, top of the line Strong 26' Lo-Po...sold the Tri-Con in 78-79, still have the LoPo!
245lbs under a 23 tri-con had to be exciting (read scary...). My only tri-con ride was when I weighed about 170ish and I thought the landing was kind of sporty.
Anyway, I have about 400 round jumps and a dozen actual round reserve rides, plus maybe another 50 jumps either using a round reserve as a main or test jumps. Favorite round reserve by far was the 24' Phantom. Packed very small and I stood it up the only time I used it...at a 6500' MSL DZ.
Hi Pat~
Yeah that Tri-Con was rather 'sporty', at least mine was a later model that had the lateral bands...supposed to be next to bullet proof.
I have some Phantom jumps too...I was test jumping the reserves a friend was making under license, the 24's were okay, the 26's were great...my last jump doing that was on a 22', figured out there were better ways to make a buck!
~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~
councilman24 36
That's right.
They never went away. Especially for pilots.
I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE
QuoteThat's right.
They never went away. Especially for pilots.
We both know that pilots don't use reserves... they wear bailout rigs.
Andy9o8 0
QuoteQuoteThat's right.
They never went away. Especially for pilots.
We both know that pilots don't use reserves... they wear bailout rigs.
I think you're losing the nuance. Pilot bailout canopies are generally reserve-style and reserve-quality canopies, packed more or less the way reserves are packed. Thus, they're generally considered to have about the same reliability in openings as
QuoteQuoteQuoteThat's right.
They never went away. Especially for pilots.
We both know that pilots don't use reserves... they wear bailout rigs.
I think you're losing the nuance. Pilot bailout canopies are generally reserve-style and reserve-quality canopies, packed more or less the way reserves are packed. Thus, they're generally considered to have about the same reliability in openings as... reserves.
Sure, there are dosens of other applications for round canopies...
QuoteQuoteQuoteThat's right.
They never went away. Especially for pilots.
We both know that pilots don't use reserves... they wear bailout rigs.
I think you're losing the nuance. Pilot bailout canopies are generally reserve-style and reserve-quality canopies, packed more or less the way reserves are packed. Thus, they're generally considered to have about the same reliability in openings as... reserves.
Since bailout (emergency packs) rigs predate reserves aren't reserves generally bailout-style and bailout-quality?
Andy9o8 0
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteThat's right.
They never went away. Especially for pilots.
We both know that pilots don't use reserves... they wear bailout rigs.
I think you're losing the nuance. Pilot bailout canopies are generally reserve-style and reserve-quality canopies, packed more or less the way reserves are packed. Thus, they're generally considered to have about the same reliability in openings as... reserves.
Since bailout (emergency packs) rigs predate reserves aren't reserves generally bailout-style and bailout-quality?
I
don't
care
riggerrob 561
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteThat's right.
They never went away. Especially for pilots.
We both know that pilots don't use reserves... they wear bailout rigs.
I think you're losing the nuance. Pilot bailout canopies are generally reserve-style and reserve-quality canopies, packed more or less the way reserves are packed. Thus, they're generally considered to have about the same reliability in openings as... reserves.
Since bailout (emergency packs) rigs predate reserves aren't reserves generally bailout-style and bailout-quality?
....................................................................
Correct!
TSOs were originally written about Pilot Emergency Parachutes.
This was long before square parachutes were invented.
Then those pesky skydivers ocmplicated the airspace by jumping for FUN???
Over the years, TSOs were gradually adapted to include sport parachutes, etc.
Most pilots wear round parachutes because they are A: cheap
B: the wife would kill them if the airplane crash didn't
C: they learned everything they needed to know about round (radial) engines and round parachutes before you were born, so please don't waste your time telling them anything new.
........................................................................
The primary reason I discouraged you from packing gear more than twenty years old was the whole "acid mesh" problem in the mid-1980s.
That affected round reserves built by: GQ Security, National, Pioneer, etc.
Sure you could wash suspect round reserves, but most skydivers decided to scrap their round reserves and replace them with square reserves, usually Swifts or Ravens.
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