Riggers & Pilots alike - What is the best Pilot Rig?

[Unstable 8]

I've been packing quite a few pilot rigs lately, and since most standard GQ Security Brand models have hit their 15 year life as prescribed by the manufacturer, I've been helping a lot off friends update their pilot rig to one of the newer brands.

I don't think this has been discussed much on DZ.com, but how do you feel about the various pilot rigs on the market? What would you recommend to your customers? Why?


I tend to learn towards Para-Phernalia's line of Softies. The simplicity is hard to argue with, and they offer a bigger bang for your buck. They are light, comfortable, and downright easy to pack.

Strong makes a good rig, their models feel more durable, but especially in the case of the Strong Squadron Seat, It would be made a touch simpler.

What would you recommend, and why?

=========Shaun ==========

[councilman24 36]

I pack a number of pilot rigs. I'm a dealer for Paraphernalia and for Strong. I think about the only one I haven't packed is the Aviator.

I wish Stongs pilot rigs used a full stoage diaper. I'd rather have all the lines leave right away. If you put a Strong canopy in another container you can then stow all the line on the diaper. What I wish they still sold was the aerosport canopy. I service two of these. They are packed in a full line stowage free sleeve. Makes putting it in the pop top container a breeze.

I like softies and the preserve canopies. Among others I've sold and pack two softie seats with Preserve V canopies with a bag, break ties around the canopy, break threads on the PC attachment/bridle, line stows on the bag like an air force back.

I've pack a Butler sombrero slider round. A lot of bulk for maybe a good idea.

I don't like the velcro adjustable harness on the Nationals.

A lot of the pilots need something bigger than a 26' lopo or a Preserve 1. Strong has a 30' lopo that doesn't have all it's testing done. For awhile it was actually in the catalog but has never been on the market. I was waiting for the Preserve V for a couple of years for one pilot. Butler has stuff rated higher but isn't my first choice. Of course you can put a ram air in a softie back also.

So for the most part I recommend Softies but a lot of my customers think the Strong seats fit their warbirds better. For big guys or fast airplanes I wish I had more options.

I just wish they'd take care of them.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[riggerrob 558]

For big guys and fast airplanes, you are limited to Butler (sombrero) or Strong LoPos or maybe a Softie containing a military-pattern C-9.

[councilman24 36]

Yeah, but the lopo isn't rated any higher than the Preserve, really. Butler's stuff I'm just not completely sold on but it is the option for really big guys. And a C-9 will hold together at any speed but can the old guy get out with an extra 6 pounds on his but and how hard with the fat guys land?

I really want the 30' lopo but have picked the Preserve V for now. Why wasn't that on your list?

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[ripcord4 0]

The fat guys will land softer under a C-9 than they will with the aircraft still wrapped around them.

[RiggerLee 61]

Lets be honest here, they're pilots. Their only priorities are that it:
1. Fit in the plane.
2. Not be too lumpy to sit on.
3. Be cheeper then dirt.
4. That someone withen 100 miles will sign it off once a year so that they can pass a ramp check during the season.

Good luck convenceing them of the importance of any thing else.

Lee

Lee
[email protected]
www.velocitysportswear.com

[JerryBaumchen 1,052]

Hi RiggerLee,

Yup, that has been my experience.

JerryBaumchen

[Hooknswoop 19]

Aviator w/ a PD-R.

Derek

[pchapman 262]

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Good luck convenceing them of the importance of any thing else.
Lee

True.
But aerobatic pilots in the late 90s at least got a little more interested in canopy strength and speed ranges. That was after the 1996 Sukhoi 29 accident where the pilot bailed out at very high speed and blew all the lines off his canopy. Maximum speeds were no longer just a theoretical thing. I wonder if the newer pilots nowadays recall that anymore.

[RiggerLee 61]

I remember that. I was talking to Bland about that. He was very interested in that at the time. It was aparently pretty spectacular. But to answer your question, No. No one remembers that. I've never had a pilot express any interest or concern when I raised the question of the size or strength of his FAA mandated seat cusion. None of them ever beleave that they will ever have to use it.

I really wasn't all that surprised when that phantom blew up. No one seems to respect wingloading or air speed now a days. I'm surprised we haven't seen more problems in skydiving with all the free flying. I mean there's been a few failures but they've mostly been brushed over. With an average life span of 5 years skydiveing has a very short memory. I wonder sometimes what it will take to get people to beguin to act a bit more rationally about their gear.

Lee

Lee
[email protected]
www.velocitysportswear.com

[riggerrob 558]

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Good luck convineing them of the importance of any thing else.
Lee

True.
But aerobatic pilots in the late 90s at least got a little more interested in canopy strength and speed ranges. That was after the 1996 Sukhoi 29 accident where the pilot bailed out at very high speed and blew all the lines off his canopy. Maximum speeds were no longer just a theoretical thing. I wonder if the newer pilots nowadays recall that anymore.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

The story that I heard was: he stood up in the cockpit and pulled the ripcord. His butt never left the airplane!
Ergo, asked a Phantom to slow down an entire airplane!
Is there any wonder why his lines tore off????

[riggerrob 558]

I really want the 30' lopo but have picked the Preserve V for now. Why wasn't that on your list?

[hajnalka 0]

What all of the above guys said
We pack for lots of aerobatics and glider pilots.

I love Butlers, but I am biased because they do a lot of their R&D and drop-testing at our DZ - usually on low (~850 ft) high-speed CASA passes, so I've seen what their stuff can do. They spend a lot of time in our loft and they're great guys.

Our favorite rigs to see come into our loft are Softies, for the reasons you said in your OP. Very straightforward, very easy to pack. Canopy and PC stay put and PC launches are great when they come in for repacks. (I've seen some very scary/nonexistent PC launches on other pilot rigs.)

Our pilot customers love Softies because they're comfortable, especially our aerobatics guys - and it's easy to convince them to maintain them and wear them, and know what to expect if they have to use them.

We still joke that they'd rather use them to beat out flames than leave their aircraft with them, but I trust they know we're kidding .

I'd love to have more experience with RI's rig (Aviator?) with the RAM-air just for pilots. Sandy showed it to us in Eloy several years ago and it's an impressive system, but we just don't see them in NC. I do tell our people looking for new gear about them.

Good thread.

Best,
Dawn

[riggerrob 558]

I'd love to have more experience with RI's rig (Aviator?) with the RAM-air just for pilots. Sandy showed it to us in Eloy several years ago and it's an impressive system, but we just don't see them in NC. I do tell our people looking for new gear about them.

Good thread.

Best,
Dawn

[riggerrob 558]

Yes,
I agree with the original poster in saying that Long Softies are the simplest replacement for worn-out Security Safety Chutes.
The only disadvantage?? is that modern canopies ado not have enough bulk to fill a long/chair style container, so most Long Softies are now sewn shut about 22 inches from the top and the last foot or so is filled with foam rubber.
The foam rubber has two advantages over canopy fabric, first of all, it is more stable, ergo more comfortable, ergo the pilot is more likely to be wearing it when he wrecks his airplane.
The second issue is that foam rubber is far less expensive to replace when it wears out.
Picture a pilot's butt sliding across canopy fabric every time he stomps a rudder pedal.

[RiggerLee 61]

I love packing softies. But I did see a problem with them once. A rig came in at Quincy.A Softy. It must have gotten wet. All the lines on the diper absorbed all the water and held it. The fabric of the diper must have been some kind of pollycotton. It totaly rotted. I mean it just wasn't there any more. There was nothing but mildew. It could use an all nilon diper.

Lee

Lee
[email protected]
www.velocitysportswear.com

[NickDG 23]

Getting a "pilot" save in your logbook is pretty rare. I know Gary Douris has one at Lake Elsinore and so has Hank Ascuttio up in Cal City. I remember they were both giddy as kids on Christmas morning.

I came "close" once. A guy left a message that he'd just bought a sailplane and it came with a parachute he wanted me to look at. Before he brought it up to where I was in Oceanside he bailed only to find the rig was field packed.

I think the Aviator is the thing. And we thought about packaging some kind of deal together that included a "check out" tandem jump. But pilots, being pilots it didn’t fly. I'm continually amazed these guys are sitting on tickets that say "airman" but they actually freak at the idea of getting any "air" on themselves.

NickD BASE 194

[airtwardo 6]

but they actually freak at the idea of getting any "air" on themselves.

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I love that line Nick, you've been using it for 25 years and I can't tell ya how many time I've stolen it!

*Wasn't it sparked by Ralph loosing the windshield?



A long time ago, an aerobatic pilot named Joe Freshca (sp?)
bailed from his crippled aircraft. The canopy opened fine but he wasn't strapped into it.

You had told me about your tandem idea for pilots, so I took my wife who was flying airshows then, on her first tandem jump.
I even rigged a DRC on the tandem rig in the same place hers was located.
She was totally amazed at the difference a little air on the face makes!

I also had a training class in which we drilled getting out of the cockpit with the rig still ON...every time!

It put some wear on the container, and even caught the ripcord once launching the PC, but we jumpers know that what we practice on the ground...

I think Joe may have un-done both the 5 point and the leg straps...as he'd done on the ground 100's of times.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[councilman24 36]

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After that drop-test program, I concluded that there are two types of canopies for PEPs: bloody big squares and round antiques.
And yes, he admits to being a grumpy, opinionated old Master Rigger!

Yeah, but nobody puts a ram air in a seat, do they? Most of the warbird pilots I pack for sit on it.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[councilman24 36]

Quote

I love packing softies. But I did see a problem with them once. A rig came in at Quincy.A Softy. It must have gotten wet. All the lines on the diper absorbed all the water and held it. The fabric of the diper must have been some kind of pollycotton. It totaly rotted. I mean it just wasn't there any more. There was nothing but mildew. It could use an all nilon diper.

Lee

Yeah, but that's the canopy, not the Softie. Paraphernalia doesn't supply the diaper. And I think the Preserve's do have nylon diapers now, if that's what it was.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[NickDG 23]

>>*Wasn't it sparked by Ralph loosing the windshield?
Nah, we were both jumpers so I don't think it came from there. But I'll tell you when that windscreen failed and the headliner came down over our heads, had we'd been wearing rigs, it would have been the end of that particular C-172 . . .

NickD BASE 194

[riggerrob 558]

Yeah, but nobody puts a ram air in a seat, do they? Most of the warbird pilots I pack for sit on it.

[riggerrob 558]

Yeah, but nobody puts a ram air in a seat, do they? Most of the warbird pilots I pack for sit on it.