Buying new gear off student status

[jgorm 0]

Hi guys,
I will have my A license in about a week or 2 and plan on buying new gear real soon. I'm sick of rigs that are not freefly friendly because i get bored on my belly by myself, plus i have to wait to get one a lot because they only have 1. I hunted all over for a decent used rig, something made after 2000, but nothing looks that good and everything i'm looking at is over $4000 so i figure i could buy new for only 1-2K more. I am 5'11" 165lb and was thinking about a vector rig w/ cypress, PD reserve, and a Saber2 (?). My question is should i get a 210, or a 190 or?. Currently i jump a 230 and the landings are real easy. Is this a good setup that could last me a few hundred jumps at least, or will i get bored with those chutes and want to go smaller. Any tips would be appreciated.

[davelepka 4]

Keep looking for a used rig, they're out there. A $200 harness resize will really expand your options, and the turn around time is usually a few weeks.

If you can out some jumps on a rental 210 and than a 190, the 190 would be a good bet, provided your canoyp skills are average or better. PD makes a 193 reserve that would be a good fit.

You'll be glad you bought used when you pound the rig in a few times. Everything you'll need is pretty common sizes, and you'll be able to resell the stuff easily when you want to upgrade.

Spend the extra 1k or 2k you save on jumps. At this point that should be the focus of your spending. You've got a ways to go before your gear is holding you back, and you need better stuff to help you advance.

[brianfry713 0]

Good luck finding something cheap that's less than 6 years old, unless it's been jumped a whole lot. You might want to expand your search to slightly older gear that's still in good condition, is freefly friendly, and will sell for less. You'll probably want to downsize after a while so going used should save you some money in the long run as you can resell it at almost the cost you bought it at.

BASE 1224, Senior Parachute Rigger, CPL ASEL IA, AGI, IGI
USPA Coach & UPT Tandem Instructor, PRO, Altimaster Field Support Representative

[jgorm 0]

The money is not really an issue, just wondering if its a good gear/ parachute. If i buy used for 4K and sell for 3K in a year or 2 or buy new for 5.5K and sell for 4K its about the same. So it looks like i would be better off going with a 190 (~1:1) and putting about 20 jumps on a 210 rental while i get the gear made. Then stay at 1:1 for a couple hundred jumps before i upgrade to a faster chute.

[skybytch 259]

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You might want to expand your search to slightly older gear that's still in good condition, is freefly friendly, and will sell for less.

Yup. Pretty much every container on the US market built after about 1996 is at least mostly freefly safe. Key areas to look at include BOC deployment, minimal to no velcro and secure main and reserve flap and riser cover closure.

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You'll probably want to downsize after a while so going used should save you some money in the long run as you can resell it at almost the cost you bought it at.

One thing to remember is that it's not always required that you get a new container and reserve when you decide to downsize your main. Most containers will safely hold a main up to two sizes smaller than what it was built for. So if you start with a container built for a 190 you can likely put a main as small as a 150 in it.

[Reginald 0]

I ordered new gear off student status. I did not like any of the used options and good used gear is not that much cheaper than brand new gear. With brand new gear the harness was guaranteed to fit perfect and I have no worries about the condition of the gear. 800 jumps later I still jump the same container, just with one downsize in canopy. I’m very happy with my decision to buy new gear off student status. If you think you are going to downsize canopies several times in short order (which is a bad idea anyway) new gear is a less attractive option. I do have a new set of gear on order for yet another downsized canopy (still at a very conservative WL for my jump numbers a 1.35) and I plan on keeping my current gear so I have 2 sets (double backs here I come!)

"We've been looking for the enemy for some time now. We've finally found him. We're surrounded. That simplifies things." CP

[schuey87 0]

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. Most containers will safely hold a main up to two sizes smaller than what it was built for. So if you start with a container built for a 190 you can likely put a main as small as a 150 in it.

Is that actually true in so far as if it is designed to ideally take a 190 it will safely take a 150? Or do you mean it will take 1 size above and 1 size below what it was ideally designed for? I'm sure most manufacturers websites only reccomend 2 different size canopies for a container, they usually say 170-190... but I've heard from most other people I've talked to that most containers take one size above and one size below the canopy that they were deisgned to ideally take. I'm not questioning you, I'm just interested because it is different to what I've heard and I'm interested to know if what I heard was wrong.

[jgorm 0]

My uneducated guess is that 150 might be pushing the limit. I always thought they posted numbers for the largest parachute that will fit. Looks like i'll send my order in real soon and go with the 190. By the time the rig is done i should be down to that size.

[GravityGirl 0]

I think you are mostly right. Most rigs that are built for a 190 will be quite loose with a 150. It depends on the design of the container if it will actually be dangerous or not.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Peace and Blue Skies!
Bonnie ==>Gravity Gear!

[TrickyDicky 0]

If you get new kit, and want a 190, ask for it to be made for a 170. Then, although it may be tight when you first get it, you have alot more downsizing potential and it will last longer. Plus it will be built for your dimensions so should be comfy for ages.

Maybe even get a new container/reserve/aad and get a cheap 2nd hand 190 main for a few jumps.

UK Skydiver for all your UK skydiving needs.

[schuey87 0]

Just out of interest, how does it work when you're going into smaller canopy sizes. In so far as if you get a container for a 170, itll take a 150 (20sq ft smaller).

What if you get a container for a 135, it shold take a 120 fine. But then the canopy downsizes get smaller, like a 111 or 109 or 113 or something example.... that is only 22-26 sqft smaller than the canopy the container was made for. Does it become more crucial, for openings, when you get to these smaller canopy sizes to have a container that fits them properly, hence why they are designed to take a smaller sq foot range of canopys?

[phoenixlpr 0]

Area is not a question, pack volume is.

[schuey87 0]

Right ok then, sorry. Does the pack volume in relation to the container become more crucial.... or decrease about the same as from 150-170sq ft as 120-113 would?

[phoenixlpr 0]

Pack volume is a function of several things. Containers do have a min-max limit for main and reserve canopy.

[skybytch 259]

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It depends on the design of the container if it will actually be dangerous or not.

Which is why I said "most" containers, not "all." I wouldn't want to put a canopy two sizes smaller in a Voodoo, but I'd have no problem doing so in my Infinity.

Regarding the poster who said to get a container built for a 170 and stuff a 190 in it - imho that's not a good idea, especially for someone who is not already a good packer. Learning to put 190 square feet of slippery snot into a space designed for 190 square feet of slippery snot is hard enough; putting 190 square feet of slippery snot into a space designed for 170 square feet of slippery snot is asking for frustration. In addition, overstuffed containers look like shit, overstuffing stresses closing flaps and grommets, and an overstuffed container is going to feel like a brick on your back - not comfortable.

[GravityGirl 0]

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If you get new kit, and want a 190, ask for it to be made for a 170. Then, although it may be tight when you first get it, you have alot more downsizing potential and it will last longer. Plus it will be built for your dimensions so should be comfy for ages.

Maybe even get a new container/reserve/aad and get a cheap 2nd hand 190 main for a few jumps.

I HAVE TO DISAGREE HERE.

With some brand containers built for some 170 mains, you MAY be able to sqeeze in a 190.

With certain combinations, you will not be able to fit a 190 in it safely or otherwise.

It's best to work with someone and sort out a plan for your intended canopy progression. This way you will get the best fitting rig for now and the foreseeable future.

But to think that any container built for a 170 will accomodate a 190, will only leave you frustrated and pissed off when you can't pack the damn thing!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Peace and Blue Skies!
Bonnie ==>Gravity Gear!

[jgorm 0]

I'll probably get one made for a 190 so i dont have any issues. Currently the parachute is what gets me to the ground so i can go back up and play in the sky. Even the 230 i fly now is plenty fun to play with up high and i wont be swooping anytime within the next few years. I'm in no rush to downsize real quickly and when the time comes i'll sell this rig and buy another.

[mnealtx 0]

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Even the 230 i fly now is plenty fun to play with up high and i wont be swooping anytime within the next few years. I'm in no rush to downsize real quickly and when the time comes i'll sell this rig and buy another.

Kudos to you!!!!

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706