Pulse

I believe you mean that it 'proves' my point about both aircraft NOT being ideal in a given situation. You have reiterated my point.....we're basically in agreement. I'm not saying the fast canopy is appropriate for everything. For the record. F-15's DO have tailhooks, like any other USAF fighter. Wouldn't last through a carrier landing though. "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

Agreed whole-heartedly "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

It's all about appropriateness (if that's a word). I'm currently getting my PRO rating with my Velocity. That's not to say I'm going to be using that canopy for many demos. A Piper Cub can be landed on the numbers. An F-15 can be landed on the numbers. Is that to say they are of equal use in a given situation? "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

I understand what you're saying. You are also offering hope to me in that the examples you referenced have changed back to the more descriptive terms. So maybe in another 5-10 years the simple terms will be back? (Though perhaps it's more because a ram-air line-over doesn't remind anyone of boobs.) It's part of an ongoing joke with me about how terms (not only skydiving) change almost as if to make things sound more intense than they are. "I had a BRAKE-FIRE....WHAAAAA!" "My goodness, and you have very minimal scarring." My favorite was when I showed up to the drop zone and someone told me so-and-so "bounced". But then followed up with, "He's expected to be in the hospital for about a week." Whaaaa? Remember when bounce = dead? "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

AND A TONGUE-LASHING TO THE GOOD LOOKING ONES! "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

"The terminology 'Brake Fire' doesn't immediately suggest an unstowed brake toggle to a novice. Unstowed toggle says what it is." I know - this is my point. Communication is about clarity, and for some reason we now have a term that doesn't describe shit. For humor's sake: Line over - A line over the top of the canopy Pilot Chute In Tow - Pilot chute in tow Lost handle - Can't find your handle, it's lost Two canopies out - Two canopies are....out Line twists - lines are...uhm, twisted Brake fire - Brake is.........on fire? Unstowed brake - unstowed brake I'll stop there. So how did your slider 'foul' the toggles? Generally if you take care of the slider without any problems, none will develope during the canopy ride. Don't take this to heart though. I like to think anything can happen at any time. What you do with your slider is personal preference. On very fast canopies an open slider makes a lot of noise and drag, that's why we collapse them. If you keep the slider at the top of the risers it will stay there. If it slides over the links slightly that's no problem. In fact it's probably better since it will put less wear on the lines. "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

A real puzzler..... What's the definition of 'hook turn'? "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

I'm SOOOOO glad there are still people out there who think like you. Like it or not...packing is part of the sport. "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

If your profile is right, I dare say that at your experience level you SHOULD be packing your own gear. Not just giving it to someone else. If you don't think you're fast enough, you'll never get any faster if you're not doing it. No matter how many jumps you have. It's one of the few times that you can actually save money and learn to do something. "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

I'm assuming your talking about the Excalibur? The F-111 cross-braced canopy from years ago? Can't say I've jumped anything I'd consider horrible. Probably the most disappointing canopy I jumped was the AR11-120. Though it was fast, it didn't turn for crap. Even though it was eleven cells, it was square. I was already jumping ellipticals and it was probably more my frame of reference than the canopy. "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

Richard Thompson "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

When you say "like-minded people" what do you mean? How are they not similar to you? "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

I tend to think we're over-analyzing the common sense. No....as was stated, the center of mass would travel in a straight line. But the jumper's body may spin, it may stabilize. But that's a different matter. The fact that jumper's may feel they are falling away in a 'curve' would have more to do with their instability and possibly inner-ear workings. The fact is, at that moment they are not in the best situation to truly realize what kind of trajectory they have. I suppose it would be plausible that the jumper's body position could fling them into a curve. But think about it. The conditions would have to be sooooo perfect that I doubt it would ever happen. The aerodynamic forces from the jumper's body would have to cause enough force to offset the momentum causing him to go in a straight line. I don't know if I'm clear about what I'm saying. But no, the jumper may spin. But his trajectory, when viewed from above, will be in a straight line. "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

Why do people automatically assume 'regulation'? No. I really wasn't even meaning to imply that new jumpers shouldn't jump with one another. I spent my first 20 jumps off student status with two other guys who got their A-licenses the same weekend. But one can't deny that the opportunity for learning goes up and it may be somewhat safer if there are some experienced jumpers on the load. Even though I spent my early days jumping with other newbies. I'd have to say, with hindsight, I'm glad we got away with some of the stuff we used to do, (or not do). "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

I'm in a debative mood.. so if someone with 100 jumps is still a newbie (which they are), why are newly A Licensed jumpers allowed to do 4 ways and other formation jumps? If 2 newbies can be trouble, as you say, than what kind of danger is a new skydiver in when they do a 4 way, fresh out of being a student? Four brand new jumpers on a 4-way.....scary. Three 'experienced' jumpers and one newbie on a 4-way......best case scenario (assuming the 'experienced' people know what they're doing) Basically, the higher the ratio of high experience to low experience on the dive, the better. "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

I still don't understand why you can see his hands in the video the entire time. "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

When he has been jumping a 190 F111, I don't see any good reason to skip buying a 170. It will be significantly faster and very different. We also don't know if he is calculating his wingloading correctly. My advice is to demo the Pilot, Saber2 and Safire 2 in a 170 size and see if that makes you happy. There is a whole lot of learning that you can do on those canopies. Well I did the calculating He said 70kg's I added the rig to that. A ZP 170 will feel about the same as a F111 190 esp if it's older/has a lot of jumps. Of course no one is forcing him to buy a 150 but I suspect that's what he'll like better and a ~1.17 WL for 140 jumps on a 150 is fine. "...a 150 is fine" Based on what? We only know what he told us. And though he says he's 'done everything', I've learned very few people have with that number of jumps. If you truly feel you've done everything and that your canopy is 'boring' go stall that bitch. Ride the 'horseshoe' for a thousand feet! Do some flat spins! It's interesting and educational! by the way....if you're looking to downsize, I'd go with a 170-square. "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

MAN.......how can you misjudge THAT badly? It took all of two seconds of video to ask the question, "Where's he gonna go?" "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

I like to save my barrel-rolls for when I'm tracking! "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

I like to do my barrel-rolls on exit! "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

EXCELLENT point. We are very conveniant at picking our evils aren't we? "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

Same size as you. Actually, it was one of the prototypes, I love it! Love the long dives. Not quite as long as a Velocity of course, but we're talking two generations. "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

I know it's too late, but I would've gone with: TERRIBLE TWO'S SLOPPY SECOND'S "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

It's too bad that being 'qualified' means little of one's skill and more about how many hoops have been jumped through. The older I get the more I realize 'training' is more an exercise in exposure of ideas and test-taking. In the event of an incident, it is used as a vehicle to determine where to place blame. Not that this is all bad. But the product of such training being labled as 'qualified' without second thought is disturbing. Why doesn't a 'qualified' pilot get the rating? No one here can answer that one. Perhaps he doesn't have the money. Perhaps he has the skills but figures why jump through the hoops? Perhaps he's a horrible pilot that wouldn't be able to cut it? I don't know...and very few of us here have any idea. But automatically assuming someone without a rating is dangerous is rather silly. Assuming someone is safe because they HAVE a rating is downright dangerous. 'Qualified' doctors make stupid, and sometimes arrogent, mistakes all of the time. As do 'qualified' pilots. Recently at our drop zone we had a 'qualified' pilot taxi to the wrong runway in 25 knot winds. Proving that ANYONE is capable of a little oversight. If you are right and you do know what you're talking about, at the very best I see this as technically correct/socially gray. I will also add that skydivers seem to be fairly poor at realizing what is and isn't safe when it comes to aircraft at times. "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

I jump a Velocity, but I also jump a larger Jedi I have no problems going back to the Jedi at all. I end up jumping them each about the same amount. "Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."