DocPop

This is actually a bonus for swoopers. I think +300 is a good option for me - I don't pull dirty low but my Optima does flatline during my 270s so this sounds like a great option. Thanks. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

That's awesome. I might have to change off my Vigil for this reason. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

I don't use the kill line window during the pack job (only at pin checks). I cock the PC and then hold the PC upside down. The tapes should be holding the weight of the PC, not the kill line. If that's true then the PC is truly cocked. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

But you don't see hundreds of people with an uncocked PCIT every day so how much effect is it having....? "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

I think you should widen your horizons a little and try other manufacturers. You may well "love Icarus" but if they themselves don't want to publicize the Omni because it is out of date technology, maybe you should look into at least demoing something else...a Storm maybe? What characteristics do you want from your canopy? Maybe a 9-cell could fit the bill? That would really open up your choices. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

Thanks for the update - good to hear you have one reference point for how it should feel! There will be more good ones, but it's not realistic to think that you have nailed such a tricky and dynamic thing after one good experience; it's just not that easy! You know what you have to do and, again, I wish you all the best! "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

Well you start at 650-700 ft then you dial it down............. Awesome advice. Wrong and potentially deadly; but awesome. As Pablo H says "Awesome sometimes hurts..." "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

lupe = Mexican girl, Loupe = Seeing small crap Good catch. I added it to my collection: http://www.skydivestlouisarea.com/misused.htm There is a mistake there - "triathalon" is not a word. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

I think you will get that lightbulb. In the meantime, prepare to PLF every landing. It's easier to progress if you don't break yourself! "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

Yes - don't worry about it. Much better to have a big enough reserve every time you want it than to have one that is compatible with your main in the very rare event that you have two out. Prepare for the likely event, not the unlikely. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

That's exactly right. And it's all you can do. Knowledge is power - if you take a canopy course you'll learn about flight cycles and the effect of the various inputs on your canopy. That will make it easier to understand WHY you need to do what you do. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

We have that now. It's called "Pre-course" and "Course." You're not happy with it. Separating the two by a week, month, whatever...makes it financially impractical for anyone who is a "traveling examiner" and for those that would be candidates for the course. The few brick/mortar examiners out there are terrific. But, a lot of people don't want to travel to those brick/mortars. DJ has a great school at Spaceland. Tom runs a terrific program at Eloy. Bram has a great place in Zhills. We have a great program at Elsinore. Four out of 273 DZs doesn't work for the majority of the membership. USPA especially makes it clear that if any movement has a negative impact on a small Cessna DZ, then they're absolutely not going for it. Wanting to improve things is terrific, and there probably are much better answers out there, particularly with technology. However..... You're also one of those that argued against a wingsuit instructional program, and IIRC, part of your argument was that it was just "one jump." Well...AFF is only 5-7 jumps at a lot of DZ's. Applied logic says that if skydivers are the product of their instruction, then regardless of how much the program could possibly be changed, people will continue to do stupid things, because there will always be stupid instructors. Perfect example of stupid advanced instruction; the vast majority of wingsuit "instructors" don't teach instability recovery. Nor do their "examiners." I've had AFF students come to our DZ who have never actually touched a hackey as part of their emergency procedures training, even though this is an integral part of the training. You cannot weed out 'poor' from the process. All you can do is make the best standard that is attainable within the pool of candidates, their fiscal ability, and their geographic availability. That's a tremendously negative view. In my view the standards need to be set and if only a few people can attain them then the rest need to get better or they don't get a rating. Nobody has a right to have an AFFI rating. However, students have a right to have competent, knowledgeable instructors. It doesn't seem like they are always getting them right now. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

We have all been there! Don't give up. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

Obviously anything you do should be approved my your local instructors. I wish more people would do high pulls and get to know their canopies. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

5500 is good - higher would give you more time to play and get comfortable. How about 10000? Or right out of the door? If you're going to go high, make sure you speak to an instructor about the winds, safety etc "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

Did you get a chance to do a high-pull yet? "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

Inexperienced jumpers should primarily be trying to gather information rather than give it out. Ask questions and take other people's opinions with a grain of salt on here. I was a little too "enthusiastic" let's say, when I was in my first year or two in the sport and I got the smack-down from plenty on here. Posting things as concrete fact is one way to almost guarantee you'll be wrong! "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

OK..B-license level. Question: Not everybody is an aeronautical engineer and theoretical aerodynamics may not be sufficiently grasped to the level we may expect. Besides that, I question the real need for theoretical knowledge when practical knowledge and skill is far more important. How do we reply to that argument? Just to be clear, I meant the instructor should have some aerodynamics knowledge, not that it should be taught to the student. I feel like a good teacher has a greater depth of information than what they are trying to teach. I don't think it's too much to ask that an AFFI knows how a canopy creates lift, or understands flow separation as it applies to a stall etc... I hear a lot of misinformation being passed around the DZ such as "get big to get back from a long spot upwind" and I would love for the sport as a whole to get more knowledge about this sort of thing. I'm certainly not trying to say that everyone should earn the name "LeBlanc" or "Germain"! "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

You're out of your depth here. I am pretty sure PD know that an appropriately loaded Sabre2 is fine for a student canopy which is why their wing-loading chart has a Sabre2 170 loaded at up to 136lbs in the student category: http://www.performancedesigns.com/sabre2.asp Just because you know someone who got hurt jumping a Sabre2 doesn't mean it is a bad canopy choice (provided it is loaded right). I dislocated my should under a Navigator 220 on AFF L2 - by your reasoning that is not a suitable student canopy. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

That's a very absolute statement and like many absolute statements, particularly in skydiving, it is not totally correct. There ARE places using Sabre2's as student canopies. And yes, down to and including the 170. For a 100lb girl it could be fine. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

These all sound like great product improvements! "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

Devil's advocate..... So, what's your thought on how much or to what level of proficiency do we shoot for? Expert? Pro? or some such. I think the canopy control knowledge only needs to be up to, say, the level of teaching for the B-licence requirements. Realistically, by the time students are up to that level they should be looking for dedicated CC courses rather than relying on their old AFFI. Having said that, being able to teach to B license level requires far more knowledge that just to be able to pass the B license test (I am thinking of the theory of aerodynamics, stalls, how the canopy turns with different inputs etc, etc). "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

This cannot be over-stated IMO. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

Less likely, maybe. but it does happen....happened to me on AFF4 Really? You had "violent spinning" linetwists on AFF4? It may have seemed like that to you at the time but I highly doubt it. "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA

That's a great explanation. I hadn't thought about it in those terms. I do know that I over-controlled on the toggles yesterday when I transitioned off the rears. I gave it what would have been right for the Katana and popped up. This thing just keeps on flying and I need to re-calibrate my brain! "The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls." ~ CanuckInUSA