Cloudi

Skydiving changed my life: A little over 5 years ago I was a bartender and college student in a happy relationship. My career focus was on criminology. Now, I'm finished with school (for now?), work in the industry (& love it!), have become somewhat of a post-whore on DZ.com, and am in a happy relationship with myself. Skydiving opened many doors that I never knew existed before I took that first jump. I've learned tons about myself along the way, too.

You have that right.

I would rather you keep the 190 a bit longer. Try the Monarch and see what you think. If you don't like it*, put some more jumps on the 190. I'll wait.

Did a search for Seld14 but didn't find anything...waiting for that PM... Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

Read what I said again. "Reliable" being the main point. I never said there wasn't a method, just that it doesn't seem to be very reliable. Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

I'm well aware of the PIA method. It's inconsistent and it even says so. So one person with one apparatus is going to measure every make, model, and size out there? Since the results vary according to a canopy's age/amount of use, shouldn't they test with a brand new canopy every time to get the maximum volume measurement? Shouldn't they also do this with older ones for the minimum volume measurement? Are canopy manufacturers going to be willing to provide these in every size, in every design? Are there any damaging effects to a canopy once it's been measured in this apparatus or does it come out good as new? Maybe the further studies they refer to and the new table of results you mention will show more consistent findings? As for PIA measurements on area, how does that method take into consideration tapering, etc. any more than any other method? It makes sense for a "square canopy," but what about semi and fully elliptical canopies? Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

Exactly. Since there is no industry-wide, reliable method for pack volumes (or area for that matter), manufacturers have taken it upon themselves to provide those "all-valuable" numbers. Since many have their own methods, individual methods and marketing have come into play. Depending on the method, one canopy can measure differently, so until there is one set, industry method, the rig manufacturers know what will and won't fit into any given container. Probably not ideal, but it's all we have until some genius comes up with a better idea. Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

It's all relative. In my case, I look at the jump I just did and shake my head. Except for this weekend where I did two h&p's. One from 5,000, another from 13,500. Those ROCKED! Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

Because no one has come up with a "reliable" method. Until then, what's the point, along with the fact that the variables will continue to exist, no matter how reliable the measuring method. We can throw numbers out there all day, but it won't solve anything, because numbers can be scewed any way you want and still not be anywhere close to correct. If you are expecting the busy manufacturers to grind what they're doing to a screeching halt so a few people will have a warm, fuzzy pack volume...don't hold your breath. You might die. They have bigger fish to fry. Again, I think it would be wonderful if the numbers were there. I'm sure it would make many lives a bit easier, but throwing numbers out there from the current methods is idiotic. If you advertise a number, you have to back it up. It currently can't be done. Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

I agree it would be wonderful to have a consistent measuring system in place. Sometimes, I wonder why it is so difficult. It doesn't seem like it should be. Then I remember that parachute materials and the parachutes themselves are ultimately made by humans, so inconsistancies will exist. Laser cut pieces are a step in the right direction for reducing these variances, but parachute manufacturers are only one part of the puzzle. Until the day where parachute materials and the parachutes themselves are made in an assembly line by machines (like cars), I think these variables in production and measuring will always exist. Granted, I don't have an engineering mind, but there's probably a way to reduce these variances before total automation happens. I think the current method of rig manufacturers' sizing the way they currently do is just fine. My rig was made to hold a 190 main and I have yet to find a 190 not fit in it, no matter the make or model. Of course, rig manufacturers would probably prefer to have reliable measurements available so they don't have to go through this whole sizing process, especially in smaller rigs where crossbrace, etc. comes into play. It's in their court to find the solution if it makes their life easier IMO. Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

Speaking for myself (but I'm sure others will agree), looking back at old video's of my skydives makes me cringe. Every day I learn how much I suck and I try to learn how to suck a little less each day. I would bet that even people with 1000's of jumps look at jumps they did 100 jumps ago and shake their heads. It's all part of progressing, I think.

I hope you're able to pursue your happiness without too much of a battle at home. Maybe you can get your wife to go hang out with you at the DZ for an afternoon. Don't plan on jumping that day, just hang out with her, introduce her to people, and let her see what it's all about? Maybe she'll be more open to it once she sees the "brotherhood" aspect of it. Good luck and don't give up. If it's truly important to you, she'll learn to deal with it I bet. Especially if you include her in it as much as possible.

I hear ya, but sponsored gear is "cool." Mine, although I love it, is not "cool" and most people wouldn't look twice at it (unless they are or used to be in the military). I remember hearing about that. Did he ever get it back? Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

We have that same mentality at DeLand. Occasionally, someone takes advantage of it, but even for our somewhat "large" DZ, it is still very rare. Thieves SUCK. I've found that by having a rig that no one wants (color), I don't have to worry. That, and it has my name on it. If the OD doesn't stop them, "Kim" on one of the 3-ring covers shoud do the trick. Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

Ditto. Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

Thank you for proving a point. Many poeple contact PD about pack volumes, and when we tell them we a) don't measure them and b) let them know we provide canopies to the rig manufacturers instead, they often freak out and think we are trying to hide something from them. The simple fact is, there are too many variables to establishing pack volume, so we don't bother. The container manufacturer will know what canopy will or won't fit into a given container. Simple as that. Oh, and to the OP, I believe the expected delivery time for all custom orders is 9-10 weeks. I could be wrong. I'm always the last to know. Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

Fortunately, this kind of thing happens very rarely & most people send the canopy back after a stern email or phone call. I can be mean when I gotta be. I've even had people tell me they forgot they had it (in trunk of car, closet, locker, etc.) when I called about late ones. I suppose that's possible, but I seriously doubt they would tolerate that excuse from their rigger when they are looking for their gear after a repack or maintenance. Imagine some rigger telling you they left your gear in the trunk of their car for 3 weeks! "Ooops! Sorry." Speaking of riggers, I had a rigger repo a canopy for me once. He knew it was a demo, but the guy using it kept telling him I said it was ok for him to still have it (LSofS). I didn't, and was actually trying to get it back. Brian Grady (my hero!) called me up, asked about it, and very nicely shipped it back to us the following week. That was my "David Leeif Brandal" happy ending story.

Looked pretty good to me. You flopped around and were able to quickly recover. Getting stable from being unstable, controlled turns, body position, and altitude awareness are pretty much the point of most of these exercises, as far as I know (caution: I know diddly about what instructors are looking for!). One suggestion on your track would be to go into it a bit slower and you'll have better results. Quickly and smoothly, but one step at a time: de-arch a bit, stick your legs out straight, point your toes, then bring your arms back smoothly and evenly with your palms down. You're trying to do everything all at once, very quickly, which can cause you to go unstable until you have a lot more practice at it. These were suggestions given to me just off AFF and once I looked at it step-by-step, it really helped me improve my tracking. I still have plenty of room for improvement myself, but I can get away quick with ample seperation at break off. Talk to your instructors about my suggestions, of course.

Too much information confuses people and makes them lash out...obviously. So, bottom line: -costs for materials has gone up, so has price for the product -PD is setting policies in place to help prevent bad business, to weed out "dealers" who offer nothing but a discount, and to keep good dealers in business. -No one is "hiding" canopy prices. They are clearly listed on the website. Anything less than that from the dealer is a bonus. No one wants to see prices go up, but you can't survive if you don't keep up with the inflation around you. Did no one see this coming as they pumped gas into their cars for the past year? I'm sure PD could use materials of lesser quality, stop R&D, skip the dealers and sell direct, not staff quality people to do quality work, cut down on staff altogether and rarely return emails & phone calls, take their sweet time with canopy orders & maintenance, cut off sponsorship, reduce or eliminate the demo program, not send reps to events, not support progress in the sport, sacrifice on safety, and not promote education. They could probably sell canopies pretty cheap then. Fortunately for people who care what's on their back when they leave the plane, that's not PD. Hey, then they can change their name to Discount Designs. The company slogan can be "They may work, they may not, but at least they're cheap!" You get what you pay for. If that's what you're looking for, maybe you're in the wrong sport. No one ever said skydiving was cheap, but I heard there's a good sale on bowling balls & golf clubs... Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

Guess who owes beer AggieDave?? You were the first person I contacted...I like Pacifico or Newcastle...

Oops, just saw your post where you asked the same thing. Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

Is 85kg your exit weight (donned in gear) or your body weight before gear? If it's your body weight before gear, sounds like your wingloading on that canopy type at your experience level might be a bit much? Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

Retrieving 10-foot pole that I said I wouldn't touch this thread with: Ummm...errrr...huh???? Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

Only if I can send a competitor's canopy. If I don't get it back...oh well! Odds are that I will get it back, though. People usually only steal good stuff (sorry, couldn't resist). By the way, I don't work for a gear dealer, silly. I'm up way past my bedtime on a school night...stupid insomnia... Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.

The promise that I won't bust ass in front of you putting my rig on again and actually make the jump. Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason.