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mccordia

The Need 4 Speed: Cruise Control

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If you fly with someone else then you'll probably fly behind someones trail at some point. Is that stupid? Depends on the circumstances ...


It was not about just flying in someones trail....
Please try to read the whole text and watch the video. Time: 1min 15sec.



If the plan was for Robert to watch for Ludo before deploying then Ludo wasn't flying in Robert's trail before deployment ... please just try understand the plan.

Edit: If the plan is to break off at 4k and deploy at 3k then flying behind someones trail above 4k isn't stupid but flying behind someones trail below 4k is. It's why you plan the dive and dive the plan!



Check the video, timeline 1.15. Is that deployment time?
That is not really the case you have described above.

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If you fly with someone else then you'll probably fly behind someones trail at some point. Is that stupid? Depends on the circumstances ...


It was not about just flying in someones trail....
Please try to read the whole text and watch the video. Time: 1min 15sec.



If the plan was for Robert to watch for Ludo before deploying then Ludo wasn't flying in Robert's trail before deployment ... please just try understand the plan.

Edit: If the plan is to break off at 4k and deploy at 3k then flying behind someones trail above 4k isn't stupid but flying behind someones trail below 4k is. It's why you plan the dive and dive the plan!



Check the video, timeline 1.15. Is that deployment time?
That is not really the case you have described above.



IT'S NOT DEPLOYMENT TIME IF THE PLAN IS FOR ROBERT NOT TO DEPLOY UNTIL HE SEES LUDO!
"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

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What do you say if I quote you about this when I teach someone for wing suit flying?



Yeah, but lets face it, you probably don't want someone you're teaching to jump straight into proximity flying either - but once they've built up enough experience, skill and knowledge of their own you've pretty much got to leave it up to them. Whether a specific action is stupid or sensible can depend not only on the action itself, but the context in which it occurs.
Do you want to have an ideagasm?

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IT'S NOT DEPLOYMENT TIME IF THE PLAN IS FOR ROBERT NOT TO DEPLOY UNTIL HE SEES LUDO!



I think yelling is a clear sign that your are running out reasons...

Are you willing to jump into a well, because someone says so?
Are you willing to crash into terrain, because you can not see your friend?

Call me a chicken, but I wot do either of those.

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What do you say if I quote you about this when I teach someone for wing suit flying?



Yeah, but lets face it, you probably don't want someone you're teaching to jump straight into proximity flying either - but once they've built up enough experience, skill and knowledge of their own you've pretty much got to leave it up to them. Whether a specific action is stupid or sensible can depend not only on the action itself, but the context in which it occurs.



The quote would be:
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It is OK to fly your buddies trail just before deployment if you are agreed about that in beforehand.



This has nothing to do with proximity flying.

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What do you say if I quote you about this when I teach someone for wing suit flying?:S

There's a big difference between a first flight student and folks who have more time and jumps on wingsuits than pretty much anyone in the wingsuit forum has had in their career.



Is surviving a dumb stunt makes it less dumb?
Is surviving a dumb mistake makes it less dumb?

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IT'S NOT DEPLOYMENT TIME IF THE PLAN IS FOR ROBERT NOT TO DEPLOY UNTIL HE SEES LUDO!



I think yelling is a clear sign that your are running out reasons...

Are you willing to jump into a well, because someone says so?
Are you willing to crash into terrain, because you can not see your friend?

Call me a chicken, but I wot do either of those.



Guys,

let´s agree on couple of topics.
1) None of use here knows what the plan of Ludo and Robert was on that particular jump. Could be that it was not planned, could be that it was. I´m guessing that the boys had solid plan and they felt that this particular flying was well withing their comfort zone and within acceptable risk as the whole flight it self. Could be that this would not be the case for majority of us.
2) None of us also knows why Gabor has gigantic bucket full of sand in his vagina and has to bash every single post in this forum. Maybe he someway gets off on that, nobody really knows.

Under those 2 facts I would suggest to leave this topic as it is totally pointless to argue further. I would suggest to look the original vid couple of more times and admire the beauty of the flying it self. If what happens around 1:15 mark of the vid somehow makes you feel uncomfortable, please stop watching around 1:10.
http://www.ufufreefly.com

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What do you say if I quote you about this when I teach someone for wing suit flying?



Yeah, but lets face it, you probably don't want someone you're teaching to jump straight into proximity flying either - but once they've built up enough experience, skill and knowledge of their own you've pretty much got to leave it up to them. Whether a specific action is stupid or sensible can depend not only on the action itself, but the context in which it occurs.



The quote would be:
Quote

It is OK to fly your buddies trail just before deployment if you are agreed about that in beforehand.



This has nothing to do with proximity flying.



I'll be charitable and say that it may be because english is your second language that you've completely missed the point...
Do you want to have an ideagasm?

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IT'S NOT DEPLOYMENT TIME IF THE PLAN IS FOR ROBERT NOT TO DEPLOY UNTIL HE SEES LUDO!



I think yelling is a clear sign that your are running out reasons...



Running out of reasons? More like you don't understand reasoning so I was trying to make it clear. According to you, the next time you're flying with someone else and you cross behind their trail (at any point) you can consider yourself to be stupid (because they could deploy at any point) ... :S
"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

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IT'S NOT DEPLOYMENT TIME IF THE PLAN IS FOR ROBERT NOT TO DEPLOY UNTIL HE SEES LUDO!



I think yelling is a clear sign that your are running out reasons...



Running out of reasons? More like you don't understand reasoning so I was trying to make it clear. According to you, the next time you're flying with someone else and you cross behind their trail (at any point) you can consider yourself to be stupid (because they could deploy at any point) ... :S


Read my whole post!
Is the new style of argument is taking words out of context?:S

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I hope people see that these videos are not instructional flight manuals. They are videos of people doing (in this case) planned flights, within their (huge) experience levels.
Much like other videos of extreme close flybys, arials in base, XRW, wingsuits buzzing treetops or cutting grass, exits with little altitude, people jumping huge suits, etc etc
Its experience that matters. Had this video been you or me...damn right we'd got some serious talking to do!

Related to deployments and flying in the deployment cone. Its an absolute no-no if you jump with people who may unexpectedly pull. students, flockers..

With trained athletes flying a dedicated plan, its more likely that the pull wont be a rushed/unexpected thing like some students/flockers would/might.

Again..these are not instructional flocking videos...:ph34r:
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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I hope people see that these videos are not instructional flight manuals.

:o:o I was training a couple of First Flight students to do the same but 6way (as I don't have time to take them one by one) [:/][:/]

Guess I need to change my plan.
scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

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Hi

First, thanks for all the compliments

I just ran into that post, and althought i shouldn't be surprised to see this on a forum, i am quite disapointed that the bigger controversy is about me being an idiot for following robbie "into the deployment cone" at the end of the jump and the supposed planification of the jump based on a 90s video.

I guess that is why we defenitely have to put more talking on our video if we don't want to appear like reckless jackasses, so here are some details:

This was i think the 4th repeat of that particular line, refining it and trying to get good video angles (robbie found it much more interesting than the crack one that doesn't have much proxy on it plus Jeb allready showed it in every possible angle ;)).

The plan was to follow the same line than on the 3 last jumps, this time with smoke and trying to catch the entire flight. Notice that what we plan exactly is Robbie's trajectory on a line that leaves me the margin for the reaction time + possible fuckup and to be able to change our relative positions for camera angles if needed.
As you can imagine (and see on the last bank left turn) it is quite hard to follow Robbert on a dynamic and aggressive jump followed by a max-glide pre-opening sequence so if we carefully plan the dynamic part, we do not often plan the very last part or the opening shot since i can never be sure that i will still be on his heels at the end of the jump.
But i take the opportunity when it occurs, so when we jump together Robbie just systematically makes a sign by waving his legwing 2s before pulling when we jump together, just like it's teached for the A licence.

If a safety issue had to be pointed at, I was really more expecting that it would be to the 32''-40" S-turn above terrain.
A few years ago i would have considered this insane from anyone to do this, and my golden rule on my first few hundreds jumps proxyflying was to avoid any situation where i would have to turn above terrain or with an obstacle outside the turn.
The fact that now, after hundreds of proxy-flights solo and filming, several dozens following Robbie and 3 generations of suits later I feel comfortable doing both at the same time while filming doesn't make it less dangerous.
the difference is that it is very rewarding to be able to pull this out AND still stay safe in my comfort zone.
I wouldn't be proud of a cool but NearDeathExperience shot...

Thanks for reading, fly safe

Ludo

PS: for those who are interested i always film with a digital still camera with 16mm lens or a camcorder with a 0.5X lens that have the same angle/field of view.

PPS: apologies for the bad English

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Thanks for the post. It's interesting hearing about the planning and practice that goes into those jumps.

PS: You're English was fine. Plus, I give a pass to anyone that knows English as a second language because it's the only language I know ...
"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

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