danwayland 0 #1 August 28, 2003 Anybody know what determines shadow detail? I've noticed that in the past, when I was using good film, I've gotten really fantastic detail even if the suns not right behind me. Example of a slide (well, a scan thereof) with good shadow detail http://danwayland.com/3-18-03/wally2web.JPG With my 10D, I'm noticing many shots with nearly the same aperture, shutter speed, ISO, and lighting conditions have considerably less detail in the shadows. 10D pic with less shadow detail. http://danwayland.com/030720/lizsitweb6.jpg It's not bad, but it's not quite as good as what I was seeing with high quality film. It's not possible to always have the sun at your back. Sometimes you exit with the sun in your face, and sometimes you're looking up at a tandem at high noon. Anybody know what determines shadow detail? What setting changes to try? Whitebalance? Or do I just need to fork out for a flash. thanks, Dan-- Dan Wayland http://www.danwayland.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 3 #2 August 28, 2003 You're really talking about two different but related items; latitude and gamma. Think of latitude as the absolute difference between dark and light that you're trying to capture. Think of gamma as where along that range of light and dark that you'll be responding to as a neutral "grey". I can think of a couple of reasons why your slides appear to have more "detail" in the shadows -- for instance, the scanning process itself may have (oh, let's say absolutely did) correct/alter the gamma of the slides, so no direct comparison can really be made between them and what you're getting out of the 10D. You can take the pictures into PhotoShop and tweek the gamma yourself and I think you'll find that the 10D captures quite a bit of shadow detail. Of course, fill flash to balance the lighting would probably be the best way to lighten up the shadows. quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bmcd308 0 #3 August 28, 2003 This is an odd problem, because a 10D should theoretically capture much MORE shadow detail than even the best film, because you have more latitude, particularly at higher ISO. What happens when you lighten your 10D shots? Are you setting your exposure using the histogram so that the highlights are just getting blown out? With white sky as the background, you might experiment with letting more and more of the higlights get blown out to preserve detail in the darker areas. Brent ---------------------------------- www.jumpelvis.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
teamhypoxia 0 #4 August 28, 2003 QuoteAre you setting your exposure using the histogram so that the highlights are just getting blown out? With white sky as the background, you might experiment with letting more and more of the higlights get blown out to preserve detail in the darker areas. care to elaborate some more on this technique? specifically as it applies to the 10D still getting to know mine Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
danwayland 0 #5 August 28, 2003 Wow. I, like, learned stuff. That's cool. Sounds like a little gamma adjustment might just do the trick. I agree that there are plenty of details actually captured in the shadows, but I was trying to bring them out with contrast adjustments which made everything else look washed out. Thanks for the new bumps on the brain. Dan-- Dan Wayland http://www.danwayland.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
danwayland 0 #6 August 29, 2003 Just a follow up for the benefit of people doing future searches on this topic. Gamma correction good. Too much gamma correction does steal blue from the sky, though. Flattening out the midrange of the histogram, even better. I had never fiddled with the histogram before. Very effective solution. Were I a useful human being, I would have uploaded the same picture with the histogram adjustment, but alas, I did not upload it to the web.-- Dan Wayland http://www.danwayland.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bmcd308 0 #7 August 29, 2003 http://luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/understanding-series/understanding-histograms.shtml ---------------------------------- www.jumpelvis.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
teamhypoxia 0 #8 August 29, 2003 very cool thanks for the link! so much to learn..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ltdiver 3 #9 August 30, 2003 Thanks for the learning! (from someone who will go digital some day...) ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deuce 1 #10 August 30, 2003 Go digital now Lori. A shot from today with fill flash on autofocus on the 10D: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ltdiver 3 #11 August 30, 2003 QuoteGo digital now Lori. Okay! [alms plead] Collecting funds for the "Lori Goes Digital Fund", right here please...! [/alms plead]... ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deuce 1 #12 August 30, 2003 I don't mean to be a bully, Lori. I love you. But you're gonna do it anyway, and it is worth the sacrifice. My recent purchase of a Skyflyer3 in hopes of capturing magazine photos, however..... Do it Lori, you won't be sorry. JP Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
newshooter12 0 #13 August 30, 2003 deuce was that fill flash the built in type or are you using a separate flash unit? just wondering b/c i'm wondering how the newer cannon flashes would work out mounting wise, etc... matt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deuce 1 #14 August 30, 2003 That's the 550EX. The built in flash only synch's to 200, I think. The 550 on the high speed synch setting will let you use flash at any shutter setting. My fill flash setup is big and ungainly. It would never have occurred to me to do it if I hadn't seen McGowan flying two of them on one helmet! That flash on that camera is very smart. Perris jp has a similar setup. Mine is on a Batrack, and jp's is on a Flat-top. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
newshooter12 0 #15 August 30, 2003 so how do you have the 550EX mounted? I just keep thinking about all the shock that would be transferred to the hot shoe mount each jump. How did you overcome that? got any pics of the setup? matt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deuce 1 #16 September 1, 2003 My helmet's at the DZ, I'll pick it up and take some pictures sometime this week. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hoym 0 #17 September 2, 2003 I've got the 420EX and I can't get it to flash and recharge rapidly enough to keep up with the continuous shooting mode of the 10D. I even took it to the camera shop and plugged a LARGE battery pack to it and it still won't rapid fire with continuous shooting of the camera. Anybody know how I can get a flash to rapid fire with the camera? Can the 520 keep up with the continuous mode of the camera? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deuce 1 #18 September 2, 2003 The 550EX keeps up just fine. I put a fresh set of alkaline batteries in, and it just about keeps up with however fast I want to shoot. I'm going to switch to high-performance rechargeables pretty quick here. Anybody know a good source for high-performance rechargeable AA batteries? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 3 #19 September 2, 2003 More information about Canon Flash units than you might ever hope to be able to fully understand can be found HERE.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ltdiver 3 #20 September 2, 2003 QuoteMore information about Canon Flash units than you might ever hope to be able to fully understand can be found HERE. Clicky fixed now.... ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hoym 0 #21 September 2, 2003 Thanks for the GREAT link to Flash information. This is an excerpt from the site... "Flash units with rapid-fire capabilities: Speedlites 160E, 300EZ, 420EZ, 430EZ, 540EZ, 550EX, 480EG. Flash units with no rapid-fire capabilities: Speedlites 200E, 220EX, 380EX, 420EX, ML-3, MR-14EX, MT-24EX, 300TL. " If this is true then it explains why the 420EX won't rapid fire and that I made an expensive mistake when buying that flash. Anyone want to buy a 6 month old practically un-used 420EX that works great but does not have rapid-fire capability? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deuce 1 #22 September 2, 2003 Thanks again. Very nice resource! JP Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
