Rdutch 0 #26 March 10, 2003 QuoteQuoteAlso remember that FAA MAster Riggers are allowed to substitute similar TSOed components. A senior Rigger can assemble gear and has the responsibility to determine compabatility. Reserve Slinks are TSO'd and therefore can be used on any rig, as long as they will work. For the same reason I COULD put a Mirage reserve PC in my Micron, and it be legal. Hook Are you sure? Unless your profile is wrong and your a Master rigger now. Even then I think you couldn't let someone else jump your rig with the Mirage pilot chute. But changing your reserve system is a Major modification. Ray Small and fast what every girl dreams of! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
councilman24 36 #27 March 10, 2003 Quote Quote That is only an issue with mini-risers. I don't know of any modern reserve systems that use mini-risers (or any system for that matter). I knew I was forgetting something. It didn't make sense as I wrote it. Hey, its early (before noon!) on a Monday. Quote ...It is a gray area though, i.e. "Note: this approval is based on compatibility with the FAA Approved Para-Flite Safety Flyer Reserve only" Ever pack a PD reserve into a Vector II? Does this mean the TSO is void? Since it was TSO'd as an assembly? If so, then there are a lot of illegal Vector II's out there. I've always got a kick out of this label. I read it in this case to only be stating a fact (and covering Bill). Not an interpretation of the TSO. But an Inspector could read it different. The FAA employee who gave my pratical in 1985 dismissed the ParaFlite square reserve rating requirement in their manuals as not enforcable by the FAA as a "manufacturer's instruction." One OLD guys opinion. But I didn't ask twice. Quote From what I have seen, containers still have P/N's for each component. I'm not coming up with the term I wan't, but I don't think most of the components don't have individual TSO's, like military equipment has individual mil spec numbers. Quote I would change allowed to "already determined to be compatible". We are in a gray area and different interpretations aren't wrong. I agree. Quote ....and I wouldn't substitute a reserve PC on a customer's rig, but again, for my rig, I wouldn't have a problem putting a Mirage PC in my Micron. Missed the your rig vs customers rig distinction in original post. You treat your rig differently too, like me? In these kind of discussions I usually don't bring up what I'd do to my rig. Quote As a final, open, question, what is the opinion of riggers out there? Will you only put Slinks on PD reserves? On only specific containers? Which containers will you and won't you use Slinks with? If you will use Slinks with other reserves besides PD's, are there any you won't use them with? Hook This is one that's grey enough that I'd wait for someone to tell me it's ok, either the rig or reserve manufacturer. I'd want someone else to point the finger at. ??? Didn't one of the reserve manufacturer's ship canopies WITHOUT any links for awhile? Can't remember but it seems like I got a new set of gear several (many?) years ago to assemble without reserve links.I'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #28 March 10, 2003 QuoteAre you sure? Unless your profile is wrong and your a Master rigger now. Even then I think you couldn't let someone else jump your rig with the Mirage pilot chute. But changing your reserve system is a Major modification. Yep, I'm sure. I'm not a Master Rigger yet, soon though. Both PC's are TSO'd and a Senoir Rigger can assemble a reserve and it is up to the assembling rigger to determine compatability. Changing the length of the bridle would be a alteration, minor or major is irrelevant because you have to be a Master Rigger to alter an approved system (reserve and/or harness). Hook Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #29 March 10, 2003 Quote I've always got a kick out of this label. I read it in this case to only be stating a fact (and covering Bill). Not an interpretation of the TSO. But an Inspector could read it different. The FAA employee who gave my pratical in 1985 dismissed the ParaFlite square reserve rating requirement in their manuals as not enforcable by the FAA as a "manufacturer's instruction." One OLD guys opinion. But I didn't ask twice. LOL- right big grey area. Quote Missed the your rig vs customers rig distinction in original post. You treat your rig differently too, like me? In these kind of discussions I usually don't bring up what I'd do to my rig. OK, I get to claim befoire noon too I forgot to put that in. It would be legal, in my interpretation of the FAR's. A local FSDO can do just about anything they want, even to say that assembling a Cypres into a Cypres-ready container is an alteration, requiring a Master Rigger ticket to do. I would definately dis-agree with that. Quote This is one that's grey enough that I'd wait for someone to tell me it's ok, either the rig or reserve manufacturer. I'd want someone else to point the finger at. ??? Didn't one of the reserve manufacturer's ship canopies WITHOUT any links for awhile? Can't remember but it seems like I got a new set of gear several (many?) years ago to assemble without reserve links. And I wouldn't fault you for that. I don't know if anyone was shipping reserves without links, I haven't run across that, maybe before my time. I think the real issue is that Senior Riggers are given a huge responsibilty. It is important that a rigger recognize their own limitations and not do something they shouldn't, even if it is legal for them to do so. I know of at least one DPRE that does not require the candidate to pack a round for the practical. But once they are a rigger, they are authorized to pack a round reserve, but may have no experience, instruction or training on how do pack them. A good rigger wouldn't pack them, even though they are authorized, until they get up to speed on them. I hope that was a good example of what I am trying to say. Ethics in rigging are at leat as difficult as the rigging itself. Hook Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #30 March 11, 2003 I would assemble most square reserves with P.D. Slinks. If anyone challenged me, I would get all arrogant and remind them that I am a pompous FAA Master Rigger. Besides, I have fewer lawyers to worry about in Canada. Thank God! Yes, P.D. has been shipping canopies off links for a while now. They attach the bottom of the lines to silly little plastic zip ties, then toss in a set of Slinks or Maillon Rapide links. This is probably a plot to sell more Slinks because I suspect that it is cheaper to pay Honduran ladies to make Slinks than it is to buy stainless steel from the French (Monty Python accent). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
councilman24 36 #31 March 11, 2003 What I think I remember is getting a new set of equipment without ANY links supplied, not just not on the links. I had to supply them. The customer may have misplaced them. I don't assemble very many new rigs and I only remember this happening once. TerryI'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brettpobastad 0 #32 April 6, 2003 Why on earth would anyone use soft links on a reserve? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #33 April 6, 2003 QuoteWhy on earth would anyone use soft links on a reserve? 1) Easier to install. (They don't require bumpers, Lock-tite, torque stripe, or tools.) 2) Easier to inspect. (I am getting tired of 90% + of the rigs I re-pack for the first time not having Lock-tite on the Rapide links or a torque-stripe). 3) Slinks are stronger than Rapide links. 4) Lower bulk, more comfortable when the reserve is packed. 5) They don't damage the slider grommets, which can then damage the lines. 6) They are not subject to being damaged from over tightening. 7) They don't work loose. 8) They don't rust. Most resistance I have seen to Soft Links or PD's Slinks is from older jumpers. They say they are waiting for them to be "proven" by field use first. These same people are still waiting for ZP fabric to be field proven too. Why wouldn't you use Slinks on a reserve? Hook Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #34 April 6, 2003 Stronger, smaller, lighter. Plus, I would like to not wonder if some bonehead rigger is tightening my links just a little bit on every repack, which can cause the barrel to crack and then you're hoping the lines hang on to the opened link like so many stories I have read. Of course riggers are supposed to know better, but... I suppose that a rigger is also supposed to check the slinks on every repack, and that could lead to some error, but at least they aren't tempted to tighten a nut. I know there are tradeoffs both ways. Brett, you might remember me from Kapowsin, jumped there from '88 till I left to Ohio in '95. Jumped a lot with Rob Jackson. Sure wish I knew what happened to him. Cliff RubensteinPeople are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
