Body position

[StreetScooby 5]

I just spent a weekend in NH's wind tunnel. Some Air Speed guys were coaching a couple of the teams. Their body position was impressive, to put it mildly. How do they get so head high?

We are all engines of karma

[Reginald 0]

I also enjoy watching Airspeed caliber skydivers in the tunnel. The perfect form and absolute stillness amaze me. The head high body position is simply a good mantis. Isn’t that how everyone flys?

"We've been looking for the enemy for some time now. We've finally found him. We're surrounded. That simplifies things." CP

[StreetScooby 5]

So, the question still stands. How do they get so head high?

We are all engines of karma

[Samurai136 0]

Are you asking for a detailed explaination of the "Mantis" grip-taking body position?

"Buttons aren't toys." - Trillian
Ken

[StreetScooby 5]

I know what a Mantis is. Physically achieving it is something else entirely. How do you physically achieve it?

We are all engines of karma

[pr0ject42 0]

Stretch.

A few thousand jumps and assloads of tunnel time help as well. But you have to stretch most importantly. Twice a day would be most effective.

[smooth 0]

As mention, it takes practice. Mark Kirby told me that while your watching TV, lay on the floor, get into that position and hold it for a while.

[bob.dino 0]

Yoga.

[bliston 0]

Not sure if you were watching me, my teammate Jim, or Dennis Rook, but the secrets to having a strong head high belly stance is to have positive pressure on the air with your arms and keeping your hips down. Your head can only be a bit above your shoulders, and unless you compensate with a lot of legs out, your shoulders can't be much higher than your knees (or else you'd be back sliding). So, really, a "head high" body position could also be called a "hips low" body position. Streching is one of the keys to this, most importantly your hip flexers.

By positive arm pressure, I mean actually holding air with your shoulders, arms, and hands (not pushing down the air under your chest, but "holding" the air that is slightly in front of you). This takes effort and some physical strength. The result is that it helps your arch continue all the way up your body and gives you control over more air for your upper body to work. With these foundations in place, you can be more powerful with your upper body which, in turn, allows you to used more leg power, too. This leads to faster turns and more powerful slides. You might have noticed that during over /under drills, we were cooking across the tunnel - this is only posible with a strong arms and hips down body position (you can turn fast in all sorts of different cramped up body positions, but lateral movement is just as important in FS - turn for show, slide for dough) Feel free to email us next time you're at Skyventure NH if you want some help hammering out your stance - we're just 45 minutes away from the tunnel and can get up there weekends or weekends (if we're not training..).

I think people get caught up with the term "mantis" and pull their arms all the way in and just fly with their knees. Really strong flyers use there whole body and body pitch in their moves.

Best way to get better is to dedicate some tunnel time just to body position and fundamental skills. It's temping to want to do all 2, 3, and 4 way in there to "get your money's worth," but most folks will get more out of dedicated solo time. I'll bet that if you took two equal (non-pro) teams and had one do 8 hours of 4-way in the tunnel and the other split up and had each person do one solid hour of individual skills work with a coach(movement work, stop drills, grip drills, etc.), that the team that worked on fundamentals would kick the snot out of the team that did all 4-way.

Done rambling for now....

Ben

Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website


sticks!

[StreetScooby 5]

Ben,
I was watching all of yall. Thanks for the feedback. Much appreciated

We are all engines of karma

[rehmwa 2]

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So, really, a "head high" body position could also be called a "hips low" body position.

That's a really nice description, all of it, not just the above. You have keep it all correctly pressurized, I noticed a very dramitic improvement in my dynamic mobility when really focusing on "hips low" (you want to feel it in the lower back - it's an athletic activity when done right, you should 'feel it')

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[GQ_jumper 4]

dynamic mobility when really focusing on "hips low"

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no luv for us fat boys who can't go hips low without falling low

History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.
--Dwight D. Eisenhower

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[StreetScooby 5]

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no luv for us fat boys who can't go hips low without falling low

No whining allowed.

We are all engines of karma

[matthewcline 0]

If your fat I'm the Michelin Man and thusly fucked.

Holding the Air with the arms and a little bit of positive leg is a very powerful stance, I just can't get it to work all the time, yet.

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[bob.dino 0]

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Stretching is one of the keys to this, most importantly your hip flexers.

To elaborate slightly on my previous post: men are more likely to have tight hip flexors than women. Yoga is an excellent way of loosening them up, as well as promoting flexibility in the lower back.

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...but most folks will get more out of dedicated solo time. I'll bet that if you took two equal (non-pro) teams and had one do 8 hours of 4-way in the tunnel and the other split up and had each person do one solid hour of individual skills work with a coach(movement work, stop drills, grip drills, etc.), that the team that worked on fundamentals would kick the snot out of the team that did all 4-way.

I'd definitely agree with you on that one. In my rather limited experience, unless the fundamental techniques are solid, there's not much point trying fancier stuff.

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Done rambling for now...

Thanks, it was informative.

[GQ_jumper 4]

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...but most folks will get more out of dedicated solo time. I'll bet that if you took two equal (non-pro) teams and had one do 8 hours of 4-way in the tunnel and the other split up and had each person do one solid hour of individual skills work with a coach(movement work, stop drills, grip drills, etc.), that the team that worked on fundamentals would kick the snot out of the team that did all 4-way.

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I'd definitely agree with you on that one. In my rather limited experience, unless the fundamental techniques are solid, there's not much point trying fancier stuff.

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Something else on that, even when you are doing 4, on every jump think of something with your individual flying you need to work on and keep it in the back of your mind while you jump. You obviously can't focus on it as much as solely working on your individual technique, but it keeps your individual learning curve a little higher. It works well for me at least, but everyone tends to learn differently.

And Matt, I'm only callin myself fat because I completely went off my diet these last two weeks being on TDY in Florida and I gained 8 pounds in the first week. I told my team if I break 200 again I'm sending them the lypo suction bill because they were the ones that encouraged me to eat all that ice cream

History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.
--Dwight D. Eisenhower

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[matthewcline 0]

Well I just asked Ankie if she would put a drogue on my solo rig.

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[GQ_jumper 4]

or just tie your main shut and throw out your PC, it all works

History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.
--Dwight D. Eisenhower

[matthewcline 0]

With a slip knot right?

Actually I got a Tetris that has sleeves built in and I am right in the middle of the pack again.

So now I have a tetris with spandex forearms for faster dives and one with sleeves to slow me down.

Stretching is a big part of performance in the air, I am not always good about it but I usually stretch every day before I start jumping and after (before the 12 once pain killers are taken). Once home I will use a heat program (shower, heating pad or what ever) to flex and relaxe a third time in the day.

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[GQ_jumper 4]

stretching definitely plays a major part in your ability to make dynamic moves, I stretch every day(or at least that's what I tell myself).

History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.
--Dwight D. Eisenhower