CPC and money

[superstu 0]

would you compete in the CPC (amature swooping league) if there was no prize money?

i'm just kind of interested. me personally? i would compete.

Slip Stream Air Sports
Do not go softly, do not go quietly, never back down

[Widgeon 0]

Absolutely.

[tcnelson 1]

are you also implying that there would be no entry fee or a nominal fee to help cover the set up? as in clubs would sponsor or mostly sponsor the event to draw more customers?

"Don't talk to me like that assface...I don't work for you yet." - Fletch
NBFT, Deseoso Rodriguez RB#1329

[Widgeon 0]

Entry fees would have to be in place to cover the things we've mentioned over and over. Judges and organizers of the event don't do it becuase they like swooping a whole lot. You gotta do something for them. Look at it like cheap coaching. I pay almost that much for just my fee(without slots) once a week for a half day of canopy coaching.

[YISkyDive 0]

Set up fees suck, even if there is no prizes/ prize money overhead still exsits.

The SCCA Solo2 (autocross racing) is an awsome example of how people love to compete for the love of sport and not for change. They, at least the ones in my area, run a two event comp. A morning comp, and an afternoon comp. The drivers from the mornings races actually 'work' the course in the afternoon races keeping enty fees for racing limited to course rental and what ever other expenses exist.... usually 15 to 25 person for a full days use of an area. Its impressive to see.

Ultimitely you can have a 'contest' anywhere you want, anytime you want, how ever you want.. I guess. Get some people together, ask DZM / DZO if for this block of time we can use cessna / porter / what ever else, set up gates and have fun with friends swooping.

A now fairly succesfull course desgining company for amature snowboard courses started exactly like this.

I have competed in almost everysport that I partake in except for kiteboarding because I only do it two weeks a year, and swooping because I am no where near the level neccasary to be in a comp enviroment, but, in the end, the competitors have a lot of say in how things get done.. if you don't like the rules, if you don't like how things are done, start a new circuit. Sure it might not get proslots, support from everyone, or even be big.. but it could also just be for fun and personal gain.

That said, when I start competeing for the CPC or what have you.. (at least two years away) if there was no prize money, id still be on the plane. I love to compete to bring out the very best that I have within me, not to cash a check. Thats what 9 to 5 M-F is for.

[chachi 0]

absolutely.

[chayes12 0]

When we started the Florida league a couple of years ago, like all of you we talked about yearly registration fees and individual comp fees. It was decided that we would charge a $40 registration fee for the season and a $75 registration fee per comp. It seemed like a fair deal for everyone involved. The $40 from everyone at the beginning of the season was used to buy all of the course materials to set the courses up and get everything needed to set up a competition before the season started. It ended up costing about $400 for everything. Any money that was left over from that went to the championship trophy at the end of the season. 2004 was a trophy for Ian Bobo and 2005 was the belt for Tyler Lawson.

The $75 that was collected from each competitor at each meet went directly into the meet. The first expenses that came out went to pay for travel and expenses for judges and camera crew and for any food and accomadations, gas that were needed in case the crew had to travel. And unless you plan on doing all of your events at one place eventually you will have to travel to do some comps. In some cases if the attendance was low, the registration fees barely covered the hard costs of the event.
In some cases when attendance was high there was money left over at the end of the comp. This is the money that gets put back into the comp in the form of prize money.
Now of course one option would be to wait until you get to a meet and see how many people show up, then calculate all of your costs and set a different registration fee per comp to cover costs to make sure that you don't have to actually charge your judges money to come and judge for you in the way of them paying for their own gas and food and stuff.
This sounds complicated and it is also better for all of your competitors to know how much to expect to spend ahead of time for each comp.
Now if $75 sounds too high for registration and you lower it of course you risk as an organizer having to pay for expenses out of your own pocket if attendance is low or you travel to a place and get some bad weather or whatever. And if you can find judges that will stay with you for a whole season and take time off work and pay their own way, then you are lucky and you should thank them on a daily basis.
Also a paid coach could be used to come to your meet which is a good idea, but you have to make sure you have enough to pay him and all the expenses. Sponsor money for the events is a good idea if you can get it.
So whatever way you decide to use the money from the registration costs, if after you have paid all the expenses and paid the coach and everyone is happy and you have money left over, I recommend you give it back to the winners of your comps to help them out a little with their expenses too. If there is no money left over then there is no prize money.
It's kind of like a little friendly game of poker. It's usually not a lot of money, but it just makes things a little more interesting.

"PRIZE MONEY IN AMATEUR SPORTS"
Try not to make into something it's not.

[vdschoor 0]

I voted yes, it is a big learning experience, and an awesome way to get competition experience and to see how you are doing compared to others.

[frost 1]

i answered your poll before i read your post... I read the Poll as "CPC: should have monetary prizes (YES) or should it not (NO)". I voted NO - but then read the post :) I made a mistake - i wanted to vote for NO money in CPC. Meaning if i ever compete, I would compete without money.

Curious how much the prize money can amount to? At the PSN at the Ranch in 2004 we had 7K for top spot. Now THAT'S "money"! Then i saw some pros get $1500, 1250 1000 for top positions in PST... Thats enough for gas and lodging lol. How much can you win in CPC? 1K for top spot? Less?

If you can get enough money from sponsors AKA free money, to have a 3K purse for top three slots, then great! But if people have to put up say... 100 bucks each for the prize fund, and you have 15-20 people showing up... then I'd rather just compete for no money at all.

And I mean... does the money really matter? Isnt it about COMPETITION and sportsmanship?

SoFPiDaRF - School of Fast Progress in Downsizing and Radical Flying. Because nobody knows your skills better than you.

[superstu 0]

at the cpc chamionships 1st got 2500, 2nd got 1500, and 3rd 1000

on the regional level the amount varies.

Slip Stream Air Sports
Do not go softly, do not go quietly, never back down

[CanuckInUSA 0]

Quote

And I mean... does the money really matter? Isnt it about COMPETITION and sportsmanship?

I think Chris Hayes has pretty much set the record straight for many of us. If we want good judges, good video, good volunteers and just a good over all competition. Then we need to expect to pay for it. What's left over after that can be used as prize money for the winners (for regional CPC events it's usually not that much to begin with).

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[frost 1]

Thats good money!
A few questions:
How many people entered and what was the entrance fee? What part of it went to cover the expenses and what part went to prize money? Did any sponsors provide cash?

SoFPiDaRF - School of Fast Progress in Downsizing and Radical Flying. Because nobody knows your skills better than you.

[frost 1]

no question about that. What I was asking - does the (PRIZE) money really matter to have fun and compete?

SoFPiDaRF - School of Fast Progress in Downsizing and Radical Flying. Because nobody knows your skills better than you.

[ntacfreefly 0]

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does the (PRIZE) money really matter to have fun and compete?

Not in the least. I think most swoopers realize that the top slots cycle regularly. It's almost, if not, impossible to walk into a meet knowing you're going to win it. That leaves it just for fun, and if you win money then sweet - if not then you just had another weekend of fun jumping
Blues.

To the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders. ~ Lao-Tzu

It's all good, they're my brothers ~ Mariann Kramer

[frost 1]

That leaves it just for fun, and if you win money then sweet - if not then you just had another weekend of fun jumping

[CrazyL 0]

Look at the U.S. Nationals and World Meet. Teams pay out loads of money to train,travel, and compete all throughout the year for fun. What is the prize? Medals. Happy to have a token for winning. Medals hangout forever. Easier to keep than trophys too.

[AndyMan 7]

If I were to try competing, it will not be for the prize money.

_Am

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[raymod2 1]

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How many people entered and what was the entrance fee? What part of it went to cover the expenses and what part went to prize money? Did any sponsors provide cash?

It was $150 to enter and there were 30 competitors. That's $4500 in entrance fees and $5000 in prizes. I agree with CanuckInUSA. Since the CPC is not a pro league there should be no monetary prizes.

[Vectracide 0]

Hey Stu,

Yeah, I would and plan on competing, regardless of prize money (as I dont plan on seeing it anyways)

I'm surprised to see that many say no, as the CPC really isn't for guys trying to make a buck. Like there is anything in skydiving that can make you a buck in the first place. At best, you make some beer (bong money for you Chachi) money.

------------------------------

Controlled and Deliberate.....

[dsbbreck 0]

I voted yes, because I love swooping and would compete no matter what, but I still believe that there should be cash prizes.

1st of all, competition isn't as exciting if there is nothing to win. Now some say the experience is enough, but I disagree.

Personally I like to see all the regional prize money to go to the top qualifiers for the nationals. This gives them money to travel so they can compete. I also like the idea of large cash prizes for the nationals. This gives the competitors a reason to travel and helps them afford to go pro. Going pro requires a lot of travel.

If there were HUGE money in Pro swooping, then maybe just the experience would be enough, but realistically, nobody is going to get rich as a swooper, so being paid as an amature just keeps the interest in it alive.

I've run swoop events and people just weren't interested if there wasn't something to win. Experience wasn't enough for them to commit the time and expense toward the event.

By the way, I won my region last year, but I spent a lot more than I won.

David

"Socrates wasn't killed because he had the answer.......he was killed because he asked the question."

[dsbbreck 0]

I would like to follow this up by saying....

If a competitor is required to pay a fee to compete, then there should be a prize.

If it costs $25 per competitor just to set up the course and hire judges, then I'd rather spend $50 so there would be $25 going toward prizes. Other wise most people would just spend the $25 on a couple extra jumps.

When I ran competitions I bought all the supplies myself and got volunteer judges and all the entry fees went directly to the winners.

David

"Socrates wasn't killed because he had the answer.......he was killed because he asked the question."