Sure grips - sense or nonsense?

[fonz 0]

Hey guys,

I'm about to order myself a custom RW suit. Amongst the available options are so-called sure grips (non-slip fabric at the back of grippers). Is this really a great thing or do you have to be an Airspeed member to notice any effect?

Thanks in advance

And five hundred entirely naked women dropped out of the sky on parachutes.
-- The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

[weid14 0]

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Hey guys,

I'm about to order myself a custom RW suit. Amongst the available options are so-called sure grips (non-slip fabric at the back of grippers). Is this really a great thing or do you have to be an Airspeed member to notice any effect?

Thanks in advance

I'm guessing you're getting a Tony Suit... unless you're doing hard core 4way, it probably isn't necessary, although, why not get a Bev Suit and not worry about it at all, her comp gripper design is da bomb!

[quade 3]

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. . . unless you're doing hard core 4way . . .

Not that I actually know anything about this sort of thing, but, good RW doesn't rely on a vise-like grip.

OK, it does help if the tail-flyer has a good grip on exits sometimes, but generally speaking, if you need to resort to tricks and jumpsuit magic to keep your grips, you probably are doing something wrong.

My guess is that most of the stuff Airspeed does, including exits (but excluding some block moves), could be done with just hand placements and not "grips" at all.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[weid14 0]

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. . . unless you're doing hard core 4way . . .

Not that I actually know anything about this sort of thing, but, good RW doesn't rely on a vise-like grip.

OK, it does help if the tail-flyer has a good grip on exits sometimes, but generally speaking, if you need to resort to tricks and jumpsuit magic to keep your grips, you probably are doing something wrong.

My guess is that most of the stuff Airspeed does, including exits (but excluding some block moves), could be done with just hand placements and not "grips" at all.

randoms, yes, block moves no.... you use energy from your piece partner to go faster. it's a fine line between letting the other person fly and helping or feeding off that energy. zig marq, comp box, tee/tee, ritz/pick, they are very aggresive, high energy, I've pulled grips out of peoples hands before (mental note to self after that -- slow down to others speed). you definately need to have a firm grip. the rubbery stuff, I'm not so sure about though.

[Ron 7]

The sure grips are good.

But like others have posted, not needed for most "fun" RW.

How much extra do they cost?

And to Quade....I pull, push, bend, swing, pray, bite....do whatever it takes to get the block done. Randoms I don't even really take grips, I just place my hand on the grip (exception is cat grips on Inside or Outside Center. I grab with the inside hand and pull while moving to reach the other grip.) But on Blocks I pull like hell at times.

At these times it is nice to have some of these "Gimmicks" Out there. Tony's "Sure Grip" and Bevs Square grips with the hole in the middle do really help if you are really getting on it. But my Merlin grips, and my Michigan grips work just as well.

But hell if it does not cost much more....get it.
If you want to do 4way, why not dress the part?
You could skydive with out booties, but if you plan on doing really fast RW....why would you?

My thoughts

Ron
Frost 98-02

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[billvon 2,400]

>Not that I actually know anything about this sort of thing, but, good
>RW doesn't rely on a vise-like grip.

Some does, especially in block moves. And of course in big ways, grip strength is often a big issue.

[skybytch 259]

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And of course in big ways, grip strength is often a big issue.

Yup! That's why Kate told the pink suited ones "take the grip you know you can hold for 60 seconds, even if it takes an extra second or two to get it."

One broken grip on a record attempt is a bad thing...

[quade 3]

OK, ok! I'll admit I'm a shooter & NOT a point turner! But I did put in an exclusion about block moves if you go back and read the post.

MY point was (and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong) is that a LOT of RW folks that I've observed use their grips like some sort of device to keep them in place rather than flying their bodies. Even though I don't touch anyone when I participate an RW jump, I can see pretty damn clearly what happens when these skydivers have to let go of the grips; they float, they sink, they go spinning off into different zip codes.

OK, big-ways MAY be an exception as well. Yeah, ya gotta absorb the waves, tension and stuff, but if it was being done properly it shouldn't take super human grips or gimicks to do it. I mean, isn't that kind of the point of all those finger pointing drills in the tunnel -- fly the body?

Or am I just totally wrong here?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[skybytch 259]

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but if it was being done properly it shouldn't take super human grips or gimicks to do it.

True. But how many of us, truthfully, can say we always do it properly? I think for most of us that's a goal, but we don't quite yet get it exactly right on every skydive.

[skycat 0]

Just my opinion, I don't know anything about the sure grips, but I do recommend cordura grippers. Not to help the grip so much as they are just more durable for those not so perfect exit launches

Fly it like you stole it!

[riggerrob 558]

Skycat has a good point about cordura grips being more durable.
I am really tired of sewing grippers back on with extra re-inforcements.
When you order grippers, make sure there is extra fabric where the ends of the groppers are sewn onto the suit.
While we are on the subject of reinforcement, please do your local rigger/seamstress a favor and order all new jumpsuits with double knees and double butts. Knees and butts always wear out first and they are a pain to patch.

[Ron 7]

Well Quade,
Most blocks require some pulling.
Randoms as well.
We had Garry Smith from Majic fly with us in the tunnel one night. We only had 3 there, and he just finished coaching a team so we asked if he would join us. One of the things he told us to start working on was pulling and pushing each other more in the randoms. He told us only to do this in areas where it would be helpful....such as comming out of the compressed on M (Bundy). It helps alot, and now that he brought it up it seems only natural to do it. Now when I watch them or Airspeed, I can see them "Helping" each other.
He also said that most teams don't need to do this yet. But we were around the 15 range, and we should start trying it.

Quade you are also right that alot of people take grips and use them to hold slot. Way wrong.

And if the group is really working on it a 100 way does not have to have tension...Then Javelin 110 ways had very little tension. Tension, and the need for iron tight grips come into play when people don't fly the slot they have. Or when doing block moves.

But back to cool Gripper designs....
Why not?

Ron

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[fonz 0]

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But back to cool Gripper designs....
Why not?
/reply]

Sure grips are only 10 bucks extra, so that's not the objection.
A llimitation however is that they come in 1 color: black. Now guess what color I wanted for my suit... (yep, black suit with orange grips).

And five hundred entirely naked women dropped out of the sky on parachutes.
-- The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

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[Ron 7]

Well, they are only black on the back of the gripper.

Black is better for Judging....the grips are for competitiors...if its a big deal for you to have other colors....don't get them.

easy huh?

Ron

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[weid14 0]

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Well, they are only black on the back of the gripper.

Black is better for Judging....the grips are for competitiors...if its a big deal for you to have other colors....don't get them.

easy huh?

Ron

you're grasp of logic is astounding Ron.... Niklas had us doing the push move, too, very useful in some situations M to B, Marq to D that sort of thing sometimes not so useful.... I don't suppose you need "help" in the tunnel tonight?

[fonz 0]

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Black is better for Judging....the grips are for competitiors...

You lost me there. Sorry, maybe I'm just stupid

And five hundred entirely naked women dropped out of the sky on parachutes.
-- The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

[weid14 0]

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Black is better for Judging....the grips are for competitiors...

You lost me there. Sorry, maybe I'm just stupid

the grips are designed for competive 4way -- judges like dark suits/white gloves, very easy to see that all grips are there that way, hence black only for the grippy things.

[fonz 0]

Well, then at a mere 10 bucks, I guess there's no reason why I shouldn't get them.

Thank you guys.

And five hundred entirely naked women dropped out of the sky on parachutes.
-- The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

[quade 3]

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Well Quade,
Most blocks require some pulling.

Yeah, Eric Gin also just ripped me a new one for not making this clear enough.

Long story short, yeah, everyone is right -- certainly the comp grips won't -hurt- anybody's flying and may certainly -help- in a number of instances.

Normally, I'd like to say that I'm the first person to say I'm wrong or don't know about stuff, but you guys are pretty fast!

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[fonz 0]

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Eric Gin also just ...

I had Eric as JM on a couple of AFF dives. Say hi to him for me, ok?

And five hundred entirely naked women dropped out of the sky on parachutes.
-- The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

[quade 3]

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I had Eric as JM on a couple of AFF dives.

Then you had one of the best there is.

Eric was the captain on my first 4-way team. Really an amazing guy. Generally soft spoken, unless he's teasing me for any one of a hundred reasons. One of those people that's not particularly well known outside of a very small circle of RW people. However, a very worth-while person to get to know.

My guess is that I dont' have to tell him you said hi, because he's lurking out there in the shadows somewhere -- with my head in the cross-hairs.

"Binkley! You freekin' sniper!"

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver