Wind Tunnel Mythbusters

[freefalljenn 0]

Did anyone see the recent airing of the Mythbusters that contained Wind Tunnel footage? I think they were flying at iFly in San Francisco. I think it is super cool that there was information about wind tunnels on such a main stream TV show. Was anyone there when they flew? They seemed to LOVE it.

jenn
Tunnel Junkie Since November 2005! ;o)~
TPM #46
Paraclete XP TPM Delegate

[VivaHeadDown 0]

The mythbusters crew were a lot of fun AND they flew great! Super nice people. I hope they include more of the outtakes in a future DVD of the episode because they kept us laughing the whole time. It's always great to work with people who enjoy what they do.

Don't Confuse Me With My Own Words

[skydiverek 56]

What was the 'myth'?

[JohnRich 4]

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What was the 'myth'?

They were trying to see if it was possible for a skydiver to catch another skydiver in freefall.

Yeah, simple easy answer for skydivers. But some idiots out there apparently think that terminal velocity is the same regardless of body position.

So one of the guys got in the wind column in a belly-fly position. And then the hot babe Kari walked in with feet on the mesh, and was not pushed up into the air. And that proved that feet-to-earth has less drag than belly-to-earth. Therefore, it would be possible to alter your body position in freefall and catch another skydiver.

Doh!

[muzzler 0]

Thats funny!!
I have worked in tunnels for a few years and beleive it or not,not all skydivers would be capable of even docking on someone,much less catching them. Great in theory! LOL

[djd 0]

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not all skydivers would be capable of even docking on someone,much less catching them.

LOL Amazing thing adrenaline. makes the quietest of people do the most amazing things... :)

but then again i am sure all us tunnel rats could catch someone unconscious spinning back to earth in a ball no probs every time..

hmmm then again ... sry delusions of Grandure creeping into my head

[awindrider 0]

Any chance Myth Busters will let you post that well recognized redhead saying that's the most fun she's ever had on the IFlySFBay website? That is what I heard her say on the show, isn't it? Now that's an endorsement! Maybe you shouldn't. I don't want to have too much competition for my preferred time slots.
See you there.

If God meant for us to fly
He'd have given us imagination!

[skydiverek 56]

Full episode here:

http://www.skydivingmovies.com/ver2/pafiledb.php?action=file&id=6583&string=mythbusters

[Slider68 0]

Awesome episode. I had to disagree with one part of it though. Facing a person in freefall you can hear screams, though I wouldnt call it "conversation".

[djd 0]

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Facing a person in freefall you can hear screams, though I wouldnt call it "conversation".

Try doing a 5 or 6 way Horny gorilla you can hear each other then...lol.
and its great fun to boot...

[packerboy 3]

I know this is an OLD thread, and I know that this episode of Mythbusters is OLD. But I just saw it for the first time.

Anyone think it's a little crazy that headdown dude passes the tandem in freefall while it is opening? Camera usually adds distance, so it couldn't have been that far. I'm sure the guy is good... but was that the plan? And if it was, was it a very smart plan?

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In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock. ~ Thomas Jefferson

[BlindBrick 0]

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I know this is an OLD thread, and I know that this episode of Mythbusters is OLD. But I just saw it for the first time.

Anyone think it's a little crazy that headdown dude passes the tandem in freefall while it is opening? Camera usually adds distance, so it couldn't have been that far. I'm sure the guy is good... but was that the plan? And if it was, was it a very smart plan?

you are making a classic mistake. Stunt work does not equal sport skydiving.


-Blind

"If you end up in an alligator's jaws, naked, you probably did something to deserve it."

[packerboy 3]

ummm... ok.

Every skydive should start with a plan. Stunt or not.

Take Travis Pastrana's chuteless jump for example. Stunt. Well planned, well executed, fairly safe. Ballsy yes, but not exactly the top of the crazy meter.

This however. A headdown flyer passing a tandem canopy while it is opening, imo is not a very well executed, very thought out stunt. The purpose of the jump could be classified as a "stunt" as in that it was performed for the entertainment of an audience yes. But something I personally believe to be more dangerous than Travis' chuteless jump was not exactly the core purpose of the skydive.

I find it hard to believe that the plan from the get go was to pass the canopy in freefall. I also doubt that the passenger was fully aware of the added danger that the "stunt" added to his skydive.

Just my opinion that the headdown jumper should have broke off well before he did. It could have been done alot safer.

imo "stunts" are no different than any other skydive that begins and ends with a plan except they use fancier cameras and have a larger audience.

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In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock. ~ Thomas Jefferson

[d123 1]

for me the moment they said that the passenger is opening the chute I've said: Nice... delta down to someone with an nervous hand on the rip-cord!

Lock, Dock and Two Smoking Barrelrolls!

[mdrejhon 8]

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This however. A headdown flyer

Actually, she looked like a speed skydiver, not a freeflyer. (Semantics, I know). Or even just a regular big way delta dive, if the delay was just about 5 to 10 seconds.

When I dive on big ways, as last out, I am sometimes 7 seconds from the first people exiting, especially when the exit is being fumbled. I catch up and dock. I have the ability to adjust my dive trajectory while I deep dive to catch up with the formation. We try to empty planes quickly, but sometimes, shit happens.

Depending on how it's planned, I think this mythbusters jump was safer, IMHO, than the chuteless jump -- but YMMV. There's a lot of off-camera planning that is not explained on television. I do half of the mythbusters skydive now and then (7 seconds instead of 15), all the time in some my big ways -- last out of a trail plane for a 100-way -- and safely dock.

However, if a 2-way jump was planned as such, I could swoop past the other guy (that would be dangerous, but I could aim to zoom 50 feet away, with full control of my dive trajectory). What I'm interested in is if, off-camera, it was a well-planned speed skydive. Not much has been said in this thread about the planning behind this. If it was a random planned skydive, then yes, it is dangerous...

The diving I am doing, is not really head-down, but a controlled dive.

I have seen a big way where the first person exiting was 10 seconds from the last person exiting, and the last person still made it. (It was an exit mistake that caused the spread. Granted, there was more working time - 80 seconds of working time - much more than a tandem - since the dive started at 15000 feet, and mere breakoff altitudes of big ways, are sometimes lower than tandem deployment altitudes.)

Also another footnote. I occasionally track at 100+mph horizontally past opening canopies that's only 100 feet to the left or right of me. It's a fact of life of big way breakoff, that it sometimes happen especially when some people breaks off early by mistake, and some of us are left trying to outrun people behind us from the later breakoff wave, meaning there are occasionally times some people end up zooming past opening canopies, at relatively high velocities not too different from the Mythbusters show. Events like this more so likely to happen, when tracking is semi-messy due to a spetacular funnel (we had an entire 39-way funnel today as an example). Oh, and we outers are often told to pull no higher than 2500 feet -- that means razor thin hard deck and almost always a number of full canopies just under 2000. Lots of altitracks and neptunes show deployment complete as low as 1500 for the lowest opening outers, with many in the range 1700-2300. Yes, pushes the BSR's in a way, when a razor-thin margin is delayed by one second. Yes, low enough that there's been two cypres fires at the last Perris 100 way event.

Yes, we do stuff that sound dangerous. But I think it's still safer than the chuteless jumps. Big ways aren't just boring 1 point skydives, eh!?

[likestojump 3]

the frame grab from the handcam showed a person on their belly falling away from the deploying tandem.

FWIW it could have been someone on their belly facing the tandem, and not falling past them.

[packerboy 3]

Is there anything you aren't an expert on Mark?

Looked to me like the guy went screaming past the tandem as it deployed. Less than 50 ft away. You don't fuck with tandems like that. Especially ones with whuffos on the front.

That being said, my perception could be wrong... perhaps he was flying relative and fell away as they were deploying.

I think you are wrong about a 100 way being less dangerous than Travis Pastrana's jump... it was a joke imo. Anyone fresh off AFF could do that with the guys that he had around him. Not the case with all the chuteless jumps done. But his was not all that impressive... just ballsy. Only one person in any (albeit minimal) danger there.

And by headdown, I meant that the diver was generally pointing towards the earth with his head.. that's all. Call it what you want. Just please try to refrain from posting in every other fucking thread talking to everybody like they are all a bunch of whuffos and you are the next James Bond. Check yourself.

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In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock. ~ Thomas Jefferson

[hjumper33 0]

I dont think the jumper in questions ever posts on here so ill ask him. At the time, i dont think he felt like he was in danger of hitting the canopy. The most dangerous part of the filming was probably when buster almost landed on a house in the first drop attempt!

[MikeJD 0]

Sorry in advance for the pedantry below.
To properly prove the 'catchup' myth, I'd say the chaser would have had to both catch the tandem and dock on it - after all the real skill of freefall swooping is being able to close the distance in the shortest time while still being able to flare out and approach the target safely. Of course he didn't get the best of exits either.

First time I'd seen that show. I kind of enjoyed it, but given the supposed purpose of the programme (even though of course it's really just to entertain) they ought to take a bit more care with their science:

1) If the two cutout skydivers in the air tube really do have the same mass then they're both presenting the same total surface area to the wind, because they've been weighted to make them fly flat. It doesn't demonstrate the main reason for a swooper's speed - altering the attitude of his body to present a much smaller surface area. The wind tunnel demo did make a much better job of that.

2) The in-air conversation test is also badly flawed (although you could certainly have applied it to the earlier skydiving scene in the same movie!) With Swayze and Reeves face to face, they'd both be yelling into the burble created by Reeves' head and I'm sure that would let them converse.

Finally, even though they're supposed to be exploding myths the programme makers can't resist the usual sensationalism - 'if something goes wrong (in skydiving), you're pretty much dead.' Yeah, thanks um, 'Mythbusters'.

[packerboy 3]

Yeah.. the cutouts in the tube.. They should have weighted the guy feet down or head down.

The conversation in the movie took place across the sky from each other, so that was pretty much busted by the two being face to face and not hearing each other.

I could totally be wrong about the catchup jump. Perhaps the guy caught up and was flying relative to the tandem when they opened. The way it was cut though, it was made to look like he passed him just in time for opening. It looks like he flips to belly just as the tandem opens. The camera from the catchup diver show him opening very soon after going to belly, which would lead me to believe that he was in a pretty much headdown attitude while the tandem was opening. I'm sure it was safer than what I perceive.. just something that caught my eye.. that's all.

When I first started flying camera, there was more than once that I noticed on film that someone passed my canopy in freefall. Someone from another group. I would have never noticed had I not had the camera. Didn't make me feel safe.

Was a cool episode though. Now they should bust the myth that if anything goes wrong in skydiving you're dead. Throw out a couple of intentional mals.

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In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock. ~ Thomas Jefferson

[mdrejhon 8]

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Is there anything you aren't an expert on Mark?

Na.... I'll tell you first thing I'm a totally shitty freeflyer. And I'm not a swooping expert -- I've only done double fronts (albiet 150 times now, going to transition to slight swoop turns eventually).

Edit -- I actually really don't consider myself a big way "expert". Maybe a damn good big way rookie at my jump numbers, relatively speaking.

[MikeJD 0]

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The conversation in the movie took place across the sky from each other, so that was pretty much busted by the two being face to face and not hearing each other.

Mm, agreed of course. My only beef was that they said they were busting all three myths from the same scene - and in the scene they showed (with one of them below the other, facing upwards, and their heads only inches apart) conversation should have been relatively easy.

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Now they should bust the myth that if anything goes wrong in skydiving you're dead. Throw out a couple of intentional mals.

Yep - shame that doesn't make such good TV as a dummy punching a hole in the ground.

Speaking of intentional mals, I remember reading somewhere about attempts to deliberately pack a lineover for a Hollywood movie (Drop Zone, maybe?) Apparently, they couldn't make it happen and eventually resorted to stitching the line to the top of the canopy. I guess there should be comfort in that!