flyboy6554 3 #1 December 27, 2014 OK, here's one for all you history and trivia sleuths.. In the 1970's I was routinely taking my belly reserve up to a rigger in the Denver area to do the 60 day repacks (before one of my buddies in C-Springs got their rigger ticket). At the time I was jumping an old military B4 main harness; this rigger was making his own harness at the time that was kind of a stylemaster knock-off and I had him build a custom harness and container for me that I used for many years until the back mounted reserves finally won out. For the life of me I don't remember his name and just wonder if anyone has ever heard of him or if this rings a bell....I did a little cursory investigation via the internet but nobody seems to know or remember anything. Anybody got a clue as to who this might have been?? Or what eventually happened to him? Thanks in advance for any info. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,048 #2 December 27, 2014 Hi flyboy, Quotehistory and trivia sleuths I first met Troy Loney, who designed & developed the Centaurus rig, about 1981 in the Denver area. I have no idea if he was building/rigging before that time. Just a wild shot in the dark, Jerry Baumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyboy6554 3 #3 December 29, 2014 Thanks Jerry......thought I would elicit more responses here, but guess it WAS a long time ago. I bought that harness in 1975; it may predate your info. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Usetawuz 1 #4 December 29, 2014 Hey flyboy I think Jerry is right it was probably Troy Loney. _________________________________________ The older I get, the better I was! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stratostar 5 #5 December 31, 2014 Your talking about Troy Loney, I used to jump with him out there when he started the rig company.you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Niki1 1 #6 December 31, 2014 JerryBaumchenHi flyboy, Quotehistory and trivia sleuths I first met Troy Loney, who designed & developed the Centaurus rig, about 1981 in the Denver area. I have no idea if he was building/rigging before that time. Just a wild shot in the dark, Jerry Baumchen The Centaurus had to be before '81. It was berfore the Wonderhog Vector and Mirror Image introduced the Vector at the World meet in Z'Hills in '81.Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossilbe before they were done. Louis D Brandeis Where are we going and why are we in this basket? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lekstrom10k 0 #7 December 31, 2014 I had a Wonderhog in the late 70's .It didnt have a three ring yet Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,048 #8 December 31, 2014 Hi Niki, QuoteThe Centaurus had to be before '81. I did not say that the Centaurus was developed/made in '81. I said that I met him in '81. > "I first met Troy Loney, who designed & developed the Centaurus rig, about 1981 . . . " Jerry Baumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Niki1 1 #9 December 31, 2014 JerryBaumchen Hi Niki, Quote The Centaurus had to be before '81. I did not say that the Centaurus was developed/made in '81. I said that I met him in '81. > "I first met Troy Loney, who designed & developed the Centaurus rig, about 1981 . . . " Jerry Baumchen Well, pardon me for not noticing the commas. "Let's eat Granma." Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossilbe before they were done. Louis D Brandeis Where are we going and why are we in this basket? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Niki1 1 #10 December 31, 2014 lekstrom10kI had a Wonderhog in the late 70's .It didnt have a three ring yet Three rings started being put on '77 or '78, I think, They were originally a forged "5010" ring from Forgecraft. After Bill saw that it was going to be accepted and the other manufacturers started wanting the kits he had Forgecraft make the mold for the sloted RW1. It's very expensive to have that done. That's probably why there are so many WonderHogs out there with the 5010 rings.Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossilbe before they were done. Louis D Brandeis Where are we going and why are we in this basket? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SCS2303 0 #11 January 1, 2015 Carl Wolf or Scott Brady??? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #12 January 2, 2015 Niki1***I had a Wonderhog in the late 70's .It didnt have a three ring yet Three rings started being put on '77 or '78, I think, They were originally a forged "5010" ring from Forgecraft. After Bill saw that it was going to be accepted and the other manufacturers started wanting the kits he had Forgecraft make the mold for the sloted RW1. It's very expensive to have that done. That's probably why there are so many WonderHogs out there with the 5010 rings. ............................................................................. When were slotted harness rings introduced to lines-mens' and tree-climbers' belts? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zoobrothertom 5 #13 January 6, 2015 My first rig was a black Wonderhog with 3rings and was serial number 251. We had to call Bill Booth because the last number was fuzzy and ask him to match colors with blurry numbers. This happened around 1983. Was this rig one that was changed over to 3rings like described above?____________________________________ I'm back in the USA!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyboy6554 3 #14 January 9, 2015 OK....anybody know if Troy Loney is still alive and kicking?? I'd like to thank him as I rode my 24 flat reserve 6 times from 1975-1983......this was during my round parachute era....sleeve problems till I switched to a bag.....he didn't build the reserve but he did make the reserve container. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,048 #15 January 9, 2015 Hi 6554, QuoteOK....anybody know if Troy Loney is still alive and kicking?? He is not. I do not remember how many years ago ( ~10 maybe ), but Troy took his own life. He was always exceptionally nice to me, Jerry Baumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,048 #16 January 10, 2015 Hi Niki, You're mostly correct. I 'think' that it was about '76 that Bill showed the prototype 3-ring system at the US Nationals; but I could be wrong regarding the timing. He then added it to his Wonderhog. He would not license it to anyone. If you wanted a 3-ring system, you had to buy a Wonderhog. In early '78 Steve Yantz was selling a competing single point release design called the YES system* ( Yantz Escape System ). I visited him in Lake Elsinore about his system. He was no longer involved and said to contact Chuck Embury about it. I eventually contacted Chuck and bought a design from him. It consisted of one mockup, some very detailed drawings on how to build it & a very complete list of sources for every material that you would need to build them. Some time after that, Bill formed a company called 3-Ring Inc and Sandy Reid ran it. They only sold complete kits, no seperate parts. Just about that time, I had a local jumper who left his rig too close to a baseboard heater and heat-damaged one riser. I sent a very long letter to Sandy with about a million and one reasons why they should sell parts rather than complete kits. He agreed and sold me only what I needed to build one replacement riser. I had everything else and did not need a complete 3-ring kit. Then in '79 Mick Bevens and I tore a harness completely apart ( twice ) during TSO testing. It took me a month or two to finally determine why it came apart. Dan Poynter asked me to write-up what happened & how I solved the problem for the PIA Newsletter; which I did. A year or so later, the large harness ring with the slot appeared on Bill's 3-ring systems. The great advantage of this design is that the load(s) go into the main lift web from underneath rather than onto the outside. Consider velcro, you can peel it easily but in shear it is very strong; same concept. Then sometime even later, DJ Associates began producing and selling their own versions of the harness ring & other rings to build 3-ring systems. They could not sell complete kits due to the patent. The rest is history. Jerry Baumchen * The YES system was a single lever type of design; vs the multi-lever design that the 3-ring is. About that same time, Jerry Myers developed a similar single-point release system based upon a single lever but his was reversed on the harness when compared to the YES system. Some time after that, Security licensed Jerry's system and used it on their rigs until the 3-ring became more readily available. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Niki1 1 #17 January 10, 2015 Jerry, You should be a resource for the museum. Your recollection of this history is accurate and detailed. But don't leave out the other "imitators". The "paddles". (Maybe the YES thing) and the frap wrap. The frap wrap was Ted Strong's attempt at a single point release. I don't know what the real name of the system was called but it acquired the nickname at a Z-Hills Turkey Meet. Ted had set up a suspended harness to demonstrate it. Someone pulled the handle and had to struggle, shifting his weight left and right to get one side to release. A properly built 3-Ring never (?) had a problem. Until '83 when Forgecraft started delivering RW1s that were improperly hardened. (Or not hardened at all) RW1s were stretching during hard openings thereby making them narrower and the RW2 would not flip through. I don't know if anyone died because of it but there were several serious incidents. Forgecraft, at their expense made the RW4(?). The separable version of the RW1. I had the job at the time of putting the harnesses on the container. So I also had the job of replacing the bad RW1s. Most of the time we could cut the bad RW1s off with bolt cutters and slide the bar of the separable RW4. But I had been doing this for a while and the ones that I had put together originally were so tight that often times I had to take the confluence wrap off and rethread the hardware on the harness. Bill fussed at me a little for doing too good a job putting the harness and containers together. The RW4 proved to be an extremely useful piece of hardware. They gave RWS 10,000 pieces free because they had made the mistake of not running them through the final hardening process. Bill wanted to buy more because it was so useful but Forgecraft wanted to sell the dies. Bill said it wasn't worth it so Forgecraft destroyed the molds. Well, this has run on longer than I meant to. Ask me some other time about the invention of the Molar pack methodMost of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossilbe before they were done. Louis D Brandeis Where are we going and why are we in this basket? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
