Would you let a non jumper pack your reserve??

[yoink 321]

Absolutely! In fact, I'm trying to get a mate to do just that - he's absolutely meticulous and I reckon would make a great rigger... Whether I'd be the first person to use a newly qualified rigger is another question though

[skybytch 259]

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Whether I'd be the first person to use a newly qualified rigger is another question though

I would. I have. Not a problem.

A newly rated rigger is likely to be packing by the rules and likely to be very meticulous and anal about the pack job. That's a good thing in my book.

[FrenchyDiver 0]

I sure did have a non jumper pack my reserve many times. Given that a rigger has to get certified in order to perform reserves packs, it is not my business whether he/she jumps or not. A rigger is a rigger.
Go for it lady, if you get your certif, and if I happen to be in your DZ and need a repack, you'll get a pack job that day.

Hispas Brothers President
HISPA #2,

[rgoper 0]

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If you were referring to Army riggers, then your comment is valid

maybe i should have been more specific, i was referring to the Army. (In the U.S.)

--Richard--
"We Will Not Be Shaken By Thugs, And Terroist"

[callmewhuffo 0]

ok you guys have boosted my confidence in pursuing this to a whole new level! i am by far the most meticulous, anal person i know, and before my hubby even started aff i was wondering what went where and why to make that parachute open, and ive been reading about it ever since. i would say as far as knowledge goes about the workings of a rig, ive got it down. my problem is, other then watching lil videos on the web and reading, ive never seen it in action. no hands on experience i guess i should say. now my question to you all is, after attending a packing class, whats my best bet as to finding someone to let me watch? should i just ask around, or is there a particular guideline i should follow? i dont wanna get paid or start 'working' per say, i just want to watch and ask questions right now. thanks.

blue skies and god bless!

melissa

[Rainbo 0]

Start with talking to your hubby's rigger. There are usually scheduled rigger courses set up in lots of areas.
As for the question, my rigger no longer jumps so technically I let a non jumper rig for me. I have never had a reserve repack done that I was not present at. Usually afterwards we would have dinner and a drink. It never hurts to take care of your rigger. BY the way He has saved me 5 times in the past 23 years.

Rainbo

Rainbo
TheSpeedTriple - Speed is everything
"Blessed are those who can give without remembering, and take without forgetting."

[rgoper 0]

Melissa:

may i be so bold as to inquire why you would want to be a rigger, but not a skydiver? i admire your personal ethics as far as paying attention to detail, etc...but there's nothing like "hands on" experience to help visualize the importance of rigging, packing reserves and the like. i know that your aware that if a sky diver is presented with a serious mal at deployment time, that reserve is all we have, there is no "plan c" i had visualized in my mind for years what a reserve loked like deploying after a cut-away, i finally found out, until that time i didn't have a real "experience" per se that i could base my visulations on. your enthuziasm is admired and respected, but experience this exillarating sport for yourself!

--Richard--
"We Will Not Be Shaken By Thugs, And Terroist"

[taln1rigr 0]

FYI ~ Air Force (AF) personnel who are referred to as "Riggers" are those who have successfully completed the Army's Fabrication of Aerial Delivery Loads Course (FADLC) in Ft Lee, VA. Upon doing so they are then authorized to wear the Rigger's Wings on their uniform & are therfore generally referred to as "Riggers". In saying that, the AF personnel who attend the FADLC are those who will either be rigging or inspecting cargo & its parachutes for airdrops. However, the AF personnel who handle personnel chutes, ejection seat chutes, etc are a completely different careerfield, Survival Equipment (SE), who are not authorized to wear the Rigger's Wings on their uniforms & are generally not referred to as "Riggers". But of course there is an exception ... there is a VERY small few in SE who have been authorized to attend the FADLC, earn their wings (making them dual-qualified), & can now be referred to as "Riggers". This can be the case when someone in SE has been directed to support a Special Tactics Unit (Combat Controllers & Pararescumen) or if that person has cross-trained.

Best Wishes, Melissa, on your endevour. It's not an easy task to accomplish nor will it be a light load to bear. But your poll speaks volumes & has been very re-assuring since I too am looking to become certified & haven't yet felt the need to become a skydiver outside a tandem jump. Therfore I'll leave you with this ... because 9 aircrew lives & a multi-million dollar aircraft can depend on me the military set forth requirements for me to pass & maintain in order to become an AF Rigger. The FAA also sets forth requirements for those seeking to become Riggers for the same basic reason ... human lives depend on that person's knowledge & skills.
So while it's understandable that some people may prefer a pack job by an experienced rigger who skydives it by no means guarantees a better quality pack job over a rigger who doesn't jump. Look at what the military entrusted to some Airman off the streets with 3 weeks of cargo rigging school behind them ... 9, not 1, but 9 lives & the airplane they flew in on. In the same respect, it does seem pretty far off to allow a mechanic to work on your brakes when he doesn't know how to drive ... but just because a licensed mechanic is also a licensed driver may not always guarantee you a worthy & reliable brake job. Bottom line? Know Your Rigger!

[vonSanta 0]

What are the requirements in the US for becoming a rigger?

In DK there is (IIRC) Packer, Senior Packer, rigger, Master rigger. You get yer packing cert after 20+ packs plus 5 exam packs (with entanglements).

To become a senior packer you have to have had a packing certificate for two years, gone through a materials course and so forth. The next step is getting a reserve packing certificate - once you've had this for a year, you can start on the training to become a rigger.

So, if the lady in question here started today, she'd be able to *start* on her riggers training in three years.

Maybe a bit anal. I sorta like it this way though.

Aye, I know that two years or one year doesn't equate to number of pack job/qualification. It tends to and is thus workable.

Santa Von GrossenArsch
I only come in one flavour
ohwaitthatcanbemisunderst

[flyangel2 2]

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Whether I'd be the first person to use a newly qualified rigger is another question though

I would. I have. Not a problem.

A newly rated rigger is likely to be packing by the rules and likely to be very meticulous and anal about the pack job. That's a good thing in my book.

I too have used a rigger that has just recently received his rating. Heck, I was using him when he was working on his ticket. He was also one of the few that I trusted to pack my main, and that was before he turned 18 years old and started skydiving.

I say go for it, you don't have to know how to skydive in order to do a good job of packing reserves. Having your riggers ticket and knowing you are a trustworthy person is enough for me.

May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey

[mjosparky 3]

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easy one: "Never in a million years" no way someone who was not a skydiver be qualified enough, even with a riggers certificate to be able to visualize each and every type of mal and how to handle it, and the importance of making every crease, every fold correctly. i am speaking for myself only, no one else.

Most skydives don't have a clue as to what makes their reserve work so being a jumper would not make them a better rigger.

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[mjosparky 3]

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easy one: "Never in a million years" no way someone who was not a skydiver be qualified enough, even with a riggers certificate to be able to visualize each and every type of mal and how to handle it, and the importance of making every crease, every fold correctly. i am speaking for myself only, no one else.

I know several riggers, senior & master, that have forgotten more about how parachutes are made, what makes them work and understanding of their importance than most skydivers with ever know. And they have never stepped out of a plane.

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[SkydiverRick 0]

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easy one: "Never in a million years" no way someone who was not a skydiver be qualified enough, even with a riggers certificate to be able to visualize each and every type of mal and how to handle it, and the importance of making every crease, every fold correctly. i am speaking for myself only, no one else.

Most skydives don't have a clue as to what makes their reserve work so being a jumper would not make them a better rigger.

I agree. The lack of understanding (of gear) that many jumpers exhibit is scary. It's apples and oranges.

never pull low......unless you are

[mjosparky 3]

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easy one: "Never in a million years" no way someone who was not a skydiver be qualified enough, even with a riggers certificate to be able to visualize each and every type of mal and how to handle it, and the importance of making every crease, every fold correctly. i am speaking for myself only, no one else.

Most skydives don't have a clue as to what makes their reserve work so being a jumper would not make them a better rigger.

I agree. The lack of understanding (of gear) that many jumpers exhibit is scary. It's apples and oranges.

It does make you wounder if they have the same lack of knowlege with everything they do.

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[rgoper 0]

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I know several riggers, senior & master, that have forgotten more about how parachutes are made, what makes them work and understanding of their importance than most skydivers with ever know. And they have never stepped out of a plane.

i call your hand, name at least 3, and give their names and ratings. i'm sure they won't mind if they're credible.

--Richard--
"We Will Not Be Shaken By Thugs, And Terroist"

[SkydiverRick 0]

i call your hand, name at least 3, and give their names and ratings. i'm sure they won't mind if they're credible.

[SkydiverRick 0]

It does make you wounder if they have the same lack of knowlege with everything they do.

[mjosparky 3]

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I know several riggers, senior & master, that have forgotten more about how parachutes are made, what makes them work and understanding of their importance than most skydivers with ever know. And they have never stepped out of a plane.

i call your hand, name at least 3, and give their names and ratings. i'm sure they won't mind if they're credible.

PM sent! Don't play poker with people you don't know.

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[rgoper 0]

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PM sent! Don't play poker with people you don't know.

never recieved it. name them here.

--Richard--
"We Will Not Be Shaken By Thugs, And Terroist"

[wmw999 2,121]

Richard, mjosparky has been a master rigger, involved in gear design and testing and a whole lot more, for a lot longer than you've even thought about skydiving.

I'll bet he knows them. But they might not want to be named on the forum.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[jerm 0]

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but there's nothing like "hands on" experience to help visualize the importance of rigging, packing reserves and the like.

hogwash... if anything, "hands-on" experience can make a person MORE cavalier about packing because they know what they can get away with.

As a packer i'm MORE careful with other people's stuff than my own.. i know what kind of leeway i have with my canopy because i pack it and jump it and know how it responds to this or that. I'm not that to experience the other people's openings so with them istick to what i KNOW works, not just what i've anecotally snuck by with on my own packs.

A whuffo rigger would have nothing to go on but strictly by the book... and that could very well be an advantage.

Also, I think whuffos are probably MORE aware of the consequences of that happens if they fuck up -- as whuffos are generally more scared of this sport than we are.

Landing without injury is not necessarily evidence that you didn't fuck up... it just means you got away with it this time

[rgoper 0]

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Richard, mjosparky has been a master rigger, involved in gear design and testing and a whole lot more, for a lot longer than you've even thought about skydiving

and? i never questioned his capabilities, or his experience level. please don't put words in my mouth, or try to make it sound like i meant something other than i actually said.

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I'll bet he knows them. But they might not want to be named on the forum

why wouldn't they want to be named in this forum? i have seen at least 2 sky divers post on this site that have the same amount of time in the sport as i do (which means mojosparky has been doing what you said for longer than they've even thought about skydiving as well) and they posted the news about recieving their riggers ticket, so what's the deal?

--Richard--
"We Will Not Be Shaken By Thugs, And Terroist"

[SkydiverRick 0]

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easy one: "Never in a million years" no way someone who was not a skydiver be qualified enough, even with a riggers certificate to be able to visualize each and every type of mal and how to handle it, and the importance of making every crease, every fold correctly. i am speaking for myself only, no one else.

How many jumps do you require your rigger to have? Do they have to be current? Can they pack your square reserve if they only have 5000 jumps on a round, but none on a square? What if they never had a cut-away, are they qualified to pack reserves or just mains?

never pull low......unless you are

[mjosparky 3]

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PM sent! Don't play poker with people you don't know.

never recieved it. name them here.

You recieved it. Case closed

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[rgoper 0]

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You recieved it. Case closed

sorry, but i didn't. if i would've i may have posted the pm here myself. but, it's your lie, tell it anyway you want to.

--Richard--
"We Will Not Be Shaken By Thugs, And Terroist"