Wing Loading Question

[NoRules 0]

So I'm looking for a new canopy and I was just looking at BigAirSportz and here's what they say about the Samurai "We steer experienced and aggressive pilots toward the 1.5 to 1.8 lbs/sf (many pilots are comfortable above 2.0lbs/sf). Intermediate and conservative pilots toward the 1.3 - 1.5 range. They have even been used by inexperienced jumpers at very low wing-loadings..."

Now I consider myself an intermediate and conservative canopy pilot... But to load a canopy at 1.3 I'd have to be jumping a 105. Is a 105 (not necessarily Samurai, I'm just asking) really an intermediate and conservative canopy for me, given that wing loading?

Just to note... I am not planning on jumping a 105 right now or going from a 135 to a 105 so no need to start lecturing... I just want to know if that wing loading applies once the canopies get that small. I know there have been times when I've thought that a smaller canopy would fly better (and maybe safer) in windier conditions...

~ * Life Has No Rules * ~

[outlawphx 1]

No, IMO wingloadings don't scale real well when you start getting into the 120 sqft range. They have less drag, shorter lines, etc. I think a 120 would be a significant boost in performance from your 135.

[quade 3]

Wingloading is only an indication of performance; NOT hard and fast ACTUAL performance.

A small canopy will generally be "twitchier" than a larger canopy at the exact same wing loading.

BTW, a canopy doesn't know the wind is blowing. In my opinion, a smaller and therefore twitchier canopy in gusty wind conditions is less, not more, safe.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Samurai136 0]

Quote

I consider myself an intermediate and conservative canopy pilot... But to load a canopy at 1.3 I'd have to be jumping a 105. Is a 105 really an intermediate and conservative canopy for me, given that wing loading?

You're jumping a Sabre2 135; have you jumped a Stiletto of the same size? What was your experience? Have you jumped a Sabre2 or any canopy loaded at 1.3:1? What was your experience?

The wingloading is one issue. Wingloading doesn't scale perfectly. It is not unreasonable at your experience level to explore jumping a smaller Sabre2. Just move down one size at a time.

Changing canopy class from a Sabre2 to an elliptical class canopy (Stiletto/ Samurai/ Katana/ Crossfire/ Etc) is a significant transition from what you are presently jumping.
A Samurai or Katana of the same size will be 'faster' than the Stiletto... or tend to dive more. A change of wingloading and canopy class in one move is not reccomended. Things happen a lot faster. Bad Piloting choices can have serious consequences. But it is not unreasonable to explore jumping an elliptical class like stiletto the same size as you're presently jumping.

I think you probably should classify yourself as a conservative canopy pilot (you jump a 1:1 wingloading) until you develop more experience with higher wing loadings and faster canopies. Develop your piloting skills by changing one known variable at a time instead of trying to make the entire leap all at once.
Blue Skies

Ken

"Buttons aren't toys." - Trillian
Ken

[billvon 2,426]

>Is a 105 (not necessarily Samurai, I'm just asking) really an
>intermediate and conservative canopy for me, given that wing loading?

Not for you. The problem is the definition of "beginner" "intermediate" and "advanced" - many people have different definitions of what those are.

For example: I have about 4500 jumps, of which about 1000 have been on sub-120 sq ft canopies, loaded around 1.8 to 1. I usually do a 90-180 degree front riser turn to landing. I consider myself an intermediate canopy pilot - comfortable under most canopies at most loadings, but not as experienced as someone like JC (or even someone like JP, who has put more effort into learning to swoop than I have.)

By my definitions, the loading you suggest above would work fine. A Samurai 136, loaded at 1.5 to 1, would be a conservative canopy for me.

There's an additional factor at work here, and that is that lighter people are typically happier under lighter wingloadings than heavier people. If my exit weight was 150, I'd probably be as happy with a 1.7 to 1 loading as I am with the 1.9 to 1 loading I have now. So as a lighter person, you'll likely be looking at lighter loadings to be as 'happy' with a given canopy as other people.

[Lolie 0]

I believe this article exactly addresses your questions. A good read for everyone, but particularly smaller jumpers looking to downsize and bigger experienced jumpers that are offering wingloading advice.

Wingloading and its Effects, by John LeBlanc

Edit: I can't type.

-Miranda
you shall above all things be glad and young / For if you're young,whatever life you wear
it will become you;and if you are glad / whatever's living will yourself become.

[NoRules 0]

I agree with the not changing class and size at the same time... Unfortunately it's the end of the season but I think I'll start by demoing a few different types of canopies next season and see if I prefer a change in class or a change in size...

Thanks so much for everyone's helpful replies!

~ * Life Has No Rules * ~

[riddler 0]

I have 350 jumps, and I consider myself a beginner pilot. I've done front-riser 90 degree turns to final, double-front riser landings (straight in), landed down-wind, rear stalls, half-brake turns, harness shifting, and everything else I could think of under canopy (except radical swoops). But I've never taken a canopy class, and I've never dedicated several jumps to learning one thing about my canopy, and I fly conservatively, especially close to the ground. So I still think of myself as a beginner.

My highest wingloading was 1.3, and it was pretty high for me.

Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD