Hooknswoop 19 #26 November 26, 2007 QuoteHow about respecting that they are on the leading edge of a new sport and stop comparing them to skydivers. Why? What is the big deal? How would you describe their abilities? Just sounds to me that your ego can't handle the fact that an 8 and 11 year old can out-fly you in the tunnel. What's the big deal? Before too long, they both will be able to out fly me, if not already. I think that is awesome. Derek Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot1 0 #27 November 26, 2007 IMO, these young kids will never grow up to become "skydivers". They will never be able to stand the 20min boring ride to altitude or take on the task of packing a parachute after each jump. Edwww.WestCoastWingsuits.com www.PrecisionSkydiving.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #28 November 26, 2007 My Ego?---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #29 November 26, 2007 QuoteIMO, these young kids will never grow up to become "skydivers". They will never be able to stand the 20min boring ride to altitude or take on the task of packing a parachute after each jump. I wonder if Larry Hill's grandkids, tunnel flyers as well, will ever skydive. It might be difficult to justify the expense of skydiving for less free fall time, packing, plane rides, and weather holds after flying in the tunnel so much. It will be interesting to see how many under 18 tunnel flyers go on to skydive. I know a lot of over-18 tunnel flyers have. Derek Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #30 November 26, 2007 Get those kids into paragliding/ground launching/speed flying/whatever they're calling it this month and then they'll have some serious canopy control skills to build a skydiving knowledge base on. How cool would that be? You're right, I AM jealous. I'd love to be able to spend that kind of time in a tunnel. Then again, I'm not willing to spend the money. Jealous or not I'd love to be able to watch these kids fly in the tunnel. I bet its incredibly impressive in person. You know seeing stuff like this makes me believe that skydiving will never be in the olympics or X-games (again). Wind tunnel flying and a variation of ground launching will be. So people can setup around the "stage" and watch. Something that any kid *could* do.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tunnelmom 0 #31 December 4, 2007 When I read some threads in Forums I just shake my head and think that people are willing to say things in forums that they might not say if they really knew the people they were talking about and could get to know them on a personal level. I just want to clear some things up so that the intent of the quote is understood. I also want everyone here to know that my kids have gotten so much out of the tunnel flying and have met so many people in this industry who have become important parts of our lives. We started out flying in the tunnel at a "kids league" in Colorado. The kids fly twice per week with other children in the tunnel. Our kids loved it so much that they wanted to have some goals and decided to form a team and train to compete in a tunnel competition. The kids league is where we got them started and we thank Skyventure Colorado for providing an opportunity for these kids to fly! As for the article.... Anyone reading that article who knows anything about wind tunnels and skydiving has to know that the reporter made mistakes in the article. I will just refer to one to make my point-- she talks about the fans in the Skyventure tunnels being in ground fans... That shoudl show that some information was not properly relayed on her part Don't believe everything you read! The discussion about comparing abilities of the kids to the instructors was taken somewhat out of context. It was only in relation to WIND TUNNELS, not skydiving and was meant to answer a question about how much assistance the kids need to go from the doorway to the tunnel. A great deal of our conversation was ommitted, making the quote come across differently then it should have. It was really a response to help the reporter understand different skill levels and why the kids do not need assistance with certain things. It was definitely NOT meant to slam instructors or to say that these kids are better than other people. I truly apologize that it came across that way! I certainly did not mean to offend anyone at all and I am very sorry. The kids love this sport and really do want to skydive someday and if they do decide to jump from a plane, they will certainly have a lot to learn. The interviews I had with the reporter were all clearly focused on wind tunnels and not actual skydiving, this was clear in our conversations, but not necessarily in the article. The discussions about flying abilities were discussions about their freefall ability and had nothing to do with actually jumping from an airplane. Of course they have to learn all of the other skills before they jump! Their freefly skills will be very good by that time. Freefall skills are all that I was talking about in the quote. All I ask of the people here is to not judge people before you really know them. Remember we are all people, just like you are. These kids are going to be around in this sport, they have worked very hard and have a true passion for flying in the tunnel. It takes a great deal of effort and focus for an 8 year old boy to learn a 4 way formation! Anyone here who would like to come see them or fly with them is more than welcome to come visit in Colorado. We'd be happy to let you jump in the tunnel and meet the kids! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tdog 0 #32 December 4, 2007 Quote It might be difficult to justify the expense of skydiving for less free fall time, packing, plane rides, and weather holds after flying in the tunnel so much. When they have the average 20-something job and make $480 a week, and can only afford to spend 10% of their take home salary on their hobby, and can buy 15 minutes a month, maybe they won't be able to fly in the tunnel either. This is why so many skydivers can't! You know I love flying in the tunnel. I tell every AFF student to visit the tunnel. I still have more distance traveled in the tunnel than in the sky, and I am near 2,500 miles of "outdoor" freefall. But the fact remains. $120 will buy me a whole day of fun with my best friends at the DZ. The weather holds and plane rides have built relationships I hope will last for the rest of my life. $120 gives me less than a half of an hour of fun at the tunnel in a very antisocial environment where I can't joke or chat with friends because of the noise and earplugs. Maybe a quick chat outside before and after. But, I have not made any life long friends at the tunnel. For pure fun for the limited money I have - I go to the DZ or hike a cliff in moab with good friends, just to be winded off, for 1 second of freefall. To train I go to the tunnel. I think a lot of skydivers share similar perspectives. Oh, and for another post where you asked why we are haters? You are right, it is jealousy. And I am not a hater. I think these kids are awesome... (And lucky) Just a word of perspective, from what other skydivers have said to me locally... (not necessarily what I think, nor what everyone thinks) The community respects the kids. They are just sick of being told the kids outfly them, by the tunnel employees, the press, the news releases, etc. They know it is true. But they don't like being told over and over again, because they can't afford to spend the money to catch up, and know they will never be sponsored by their parents, the tunnel, or Go Fast. For the average American, the only way to fly as good as these kids, or you, is to get a job at the tunnel. The rest of us have to pay bills. (Hence the jealousy).P.S. I am ready to come back and work on my sit in the tunnel. (See I am still a fan). Can I hire one of the kids as a coach? They are great fliers and I am sure they could teach me a thing or two. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tdog 0 #33 December 4, 2007 Quote When I read some threads in Forums I just shake my head and think that people are willing to say things in forums that they might not say if they really knew the people they were talking about and could get to know them on a personal level. One of my good friends is a tunnel rat. I took him up on his AFF jumps and on his level 7, was flying as good as me on the formations we built (not your typical level 7). Upon crashing his canopy into the ground, I yelled, "once a tunnel rat, always a tunnel rat." He has since learned how to land a canopy, and is a great person and skydiver. He also has said he is going to spend all his income on skydiving as he loves the sky more than the tunnel, after just a few jumps. That was the basis for my comment that your kids will need to learn the canopy control that is foreign to them. In my posts I used the words "if they come with the attitude", not "they will come". I never assumed they would... I also said they would learn very quickly. Since you replied back to my posts, I assume your comments are to me. I have seen your kids fly in the tunnel, and I think they are awesome. I hope to someday jump with them. If I owned a DZ, I would even let them jump younger than the typical age, with your permission. They are focused and talented. But, I would in a joking way remind them that they are tunnel rats after they out flew me in freefall then crashed their canopy into the ground. I also would remind them that they are average joes - because the best mentors and skydivers I have jumped with have always assumed their skillset was lower than actuality. It is cool when you fly with someone like Airspeed and they treat you as a teammate, not a student. That is a cool culture. I hope they skydive as soon as possible. They will learn more with a young athletic mind. I don't think I would have said anything on the internet I would have not told you directly. My posts simply pointed out, that these kids had an opportunity of a lifetime, something I could never afford financially with what the tunnel charges my friends and I to fly. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tunnelmom 0 #34 December 4, 2007 The kids are just kids and people need to remember that. We feel that we are raising them right. We constantly remind them not to get a big head about all of this, which is not an easy thing to do with the amount of attention they have gotten in the past few months. Parenting is hard. Unless you are a parent yourself, it is very hard to understand everything involved with raising kids. Even when you do become a parent, you try your best, but there is no "manual" or "instruction booklet" to tell you what to do. You have to just try your best. What I do know is that this has been the best experience of thier lives. We are lucky we have been able to give them this opportunity, and they are lucky to have the opportunity. If I had it to do all over again, I woudl not change a single thing we have done with relation to the tunnel flying. The kids are having the time of their lives. The cost of kids league at Sky Venture Colorado is very reasonable, which allows families to give thier kids this opportunity. We have had the kids in soccer for many years, and soccer is definitely not cheap either. When we take the cost of all of the travel for competitive soccer, uniforms, coaching fees etc. and add it up for both kids for the past 6 years, it is not that much less then what we have spent at the tunnel. Our kids are good soccer players, but they are not great soccer players, they are also just one of the milliions of kids who play soccer, it is not unique and special like the tunnel flying. What is special about the tunnel is that it is a unique sport for kids. The article was trying to show that flying in the tunnel is a new sport for kids that wasn't available to them prior to wind tunnels. I think the purpose was to show that with the tunnels popping up all over the nation, there will be a new era of people flying, both in the tunnel and out of airplanes. The wind tunnels will eventually change the sport of skydiving when these kids are old enough to jump from a plane and when they learn all of the other skills necessary to skydive. I know many people who started out in the tunnel and are now skydivers. I fly in the tunnel myself and it is not easy for me! I really respect what the kids have accomplished becuase I cannot learn things anywhere near as fast as they do. As a result of flying in the tunnel, I want to get my AFF this spring. Our true hope is that these kids can do whatever they can to help the wind tunnels and the drop zones and to gain recognition for the sport as a whole. One of the things we have enjoyed so much about the sport is the people we have met. They are all fantastic. The instructors in Colorado are like family to us. We have been in Arizona a lot lately and will be in Arizona more in the coming months and we are getting to know the peple there as well and they are also fantastic. All we ask from the community is that people keep things positive and that all of the skydivers try to remember that kids are just kids and that these kids look up to all of you guys as role models. It doesn't matter who is better than who, or if you can fly head down or sit fly or not. The kids idolize all of you guys who can jump from planes and they are the ones who are jealous of you becuase they think you are just the coolest! We appreciate all of the support we have gotten from the community and the sponsors. That is what has made this sport so special to our whole family. The reaction by 99.9 percent of people when they meet the kids is so overwhelmingly positive it is hard to really put it into words. The support and encouragement we have gotten from skydivers, instructors and everyone else who has met the kids is nothing short of awesome. We hope things continue to remain positive for the kids as they grow and develop in this sport. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DJL 232 #35 December 5, 2007 tunnelmom. Ignore the internet people. They'll always be there blabbing about things from behind their computers."I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,649 #36 December 5, 2007 Quotetunnelmom. Ignore the internet people. They'll always be there blabbing about things from behind their computers. Irony score 10/10... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DJL 232 #37 December 5, 2007 QuoteQuotetunnelmom. Ignore the internet people. They'll always be there blabbing about things from behind their computers. Irony score 10/10 Do I get an 11 if I tell her to ignore people who type?"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NeedToJump 0 #38 December 5, 2007 I think what the kids have accomplished and are continuing to accomplish is fantastic. I can't wait to meet and fly with them at some point Wind Tunnel and Skydiving Coach http://www.ariperelman.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tunnelmom 0 #39 December 5, 2007 Thanks so much for the positive feedback! Whenever you come to Colorado, let us know and the kids would LOVE to fly with you! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
