what units do Europe/others use for canopy size/wingloading?

[mixedup 0]

curious as to whether other countries use as typical units for canopy size & wing loading? i.e. do they use

- canopy size: ft² (i.e. or do they quote their canopies in discussion by m²)

- wing loading: lbs/ft² (assume they'd have to for this one by definition? )

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[piisfish 135]

Square feet

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[Pobrause 6]

lbs/sqft² is generally accepted throughout the world as the way to compare and discuss wingloading at least in skydiving.
Even the russians accepted this standart after the fall of the iron curtain.
But I do wonder, whether they (not only the russians ;) ) use different units in other parts of aviation (e.g. wingloading of a plane?!)

One of the most common internet-tools here in germany to calculate your wingloading for your specific canopy size does offer kg/m² also though

http://www.flyfirebird.com/catalog/information.php/info_id/14

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To absent friends

[piisfish 135]

Thanks for that calculator link.
Was just pretty shocked by the classification of wingloadings.

Quote

Rough overview about significant loads:
Students:
< 1,1
lbs / sqft
Beginners:
1,1 - 1,5
lbs / sqft
Advanced Pilots:
1,5 - 2,0
lbs / sqft
Pro-Pilots:
2,0 - 2,4
lbs / sqft
Aerobatic Pilots:
2,4 - 2,8
lbs / sqft

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[Pobrause 6]

Me too!
According to Sofpidarf there should be no such thing as "intermediate wingloading" after your third jump.
A a general rule I would assume everything above 100 sqft too dangerous to jump. As always... Power first, Controle second!!



All jokes asside:
These are not the official recommondations for wingloadings in Germany and they do state also that if in doubt bigger is better and the wrong canopy size puts not only your bones but your life at risk...

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To absent friends

[BMFin 0]

The skydiving industry uses sqft since its mostly US dominated.

However the paragliding industry seems to be using more square meters since I guess its more European dominated (or international?)

[Bufobufo 0]

It's all about the definition of the words - student, beginner, advanced, pro and aerobatic.

It's the same old story as when you look at mc owners. Many are those riding litre sports bikes, but only a handful knows how to ride them proper or even get 50% of their true potential and are better off with a weaker bike. Same thing in skydiving, and the same kind of people most likely...

Flying a canopy at 2.0+ WL and being honest about your current skill level as a canopy pilot are two completely different things for many jumpers maybe me included.

Sorry for going out of topic.

[lyosha 46]

I was expecting some metric units in the mix at least... like kg/m or something... a little surprised Europe got stuck with our ass-backwards American ways on this one. :P

[Pobrause 6]

more like kg/m²

But I hear ya!
It sounds mutch more impressive this way!
My wingloading now is 6,6!

I think I could get used to this

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To absent friends

[DrDom 0]

Bufobufo

It's all about the definition of the words - student, beginner, advanced, pro and aerobatic.

It's the same old story as when you look at mc owners. Many are those riding litre sports bikes, but only a handful knows how to ride them proper or even get 50% of their true potential and are better off with a weaker bike. Same thing in skydiving, and the same kind of people most likely...

Flying a canopy at 2.0+ WL and being honest about your current skill level as a canopy pilot are two completely different things for many jumpers maybe me included.

Sorry for going out of topic.

The diference is that a highly loaded canopy will still have the same groundspeed at a glide; a motorcycle with a litre engine can be driven as a docile machine.

You are not the contents of your wallet.

[riggerrob 558]

piisfish

Thanks for that calculator link.
Was just pretty shocked by the classification of wingloadings.

Quote

Rough overview about significant loads:
Students:
< 1,1
lbs / sqft
Beginners:
1,1 - 1,5
lbs / sqft
Advanced Pilots:
1,5 - 2,0
lbs / sqft
Pro-Pilots:
2,0 - 2,4
lbs / sqft
Aerobatic Pilots:
2,4 - 2,8
lbs / sqft

Most of those numbers are reasonable, with the exception that most schools will only allow first (solo) students to jump canopies loaded around 0.7 pounds per square foot.

Similarly, precision landing competitors and BASE jumpers usually limit their wing-ladings to around 0.7.

[mjosparky 3]

lyosha

I was expecting some metric units in the mix at least... like kg/m or something... a little surprised Europe got stuck with our ass-backwards American ways on this one. :P

Life can sure be a bitch at times.

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[Bufobufo 0]

DrDom

The diference is that a highly loaded canopy will still have the same groundspeed at a glide; a motorcycle with a litre engine can be driven as a docile machine.

I'm not going to immerse myself on your thoughts about ground speed, glide and what not, you kind of lost me there. The analogy you use on bikes still applies on canopies.

Right now you think there is a huge difference since flying HP canopies at 1,5-2,0lb/sqf seems distant, but once you get more jumps and experience under your belt you might not be as eager to disagree and maybe you even start to notice some similarities