Now every one can own a silencer

[normiss 622]

Today's mass shooting is a perfect example of the need for silencers.
Just imagine how many more would be dead while trying to figure out what was happening.
I'm curious how many were saved based off of immediate recognition of a full-auto weapon being used.

[RiggerLee 61]

And in perfect timing... IT'S HERE!! It showed up this morning at the post office. I have soft ware problems on my computer or I'd post pictures of my new baby like any other proud parent. It's a monster. 50 cal with a freakin huge silencer, sorry I mean "Sound Moderator", on it. Workmanship is actually very nice. And it came with an incredibly nice case. Embroidered reinforced soft/hard case. Like a smaller version of a golf club case. Nicest give away I've ever seen. Of course it was a grand...

As to suppressors used in shootings. If he's shooting supersonic then you still have the crack of the shock wave. How loud some thing is is very difficult to measure. A lot of it depends on where you place microphones and you actually need a very good microphone to measure changes in noise level with out it maxing out. Bottom line is that a supersonic round is not quiet even fired through a very good suppressor. Depending on how you measure it like... 90% the noise level of suppressed. It does make it less directional. It also removes a lot of the signature, like flash.

Lee

Lee
[email protected]
www.velocitysportswear.com

[normiss 622]

There were plenty of microphones! It was a concert.
With loud music and crowd noise.
Perfect environment.
I hope the silencer bill goes down faster than the victims of this shooting, but I know better in this country.

[rushmc 18]

So, at this point you show your desire to join the sick pukes who wish to politicize this active evil as fast as possible. Secondly, you also show that you have no idea how a suppressor works. To give you a bit of background, the suppressor cools the gases before the gasses exscape. That reduces the report. They do not work on fully automatic weapons for more than a round or two because the chamber heats up to the same temperature and then it doesn't work. So before you make yourself look any more stupid, at least learn how something works before you make a dumbass comment like you just did.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[gowlerk 1,924]

rushmc

So, at this point you show your desire to join the sick pukes who wish to politicize this active evil as fast as possible. Secondly, you also show that you have no idea how a suppressor works. To give you a bit of background, the suppressor cools the gases before the gasses exscape. That reduces the report. They do not work on fully automatic weapons for more than a pound or two because the chamber heats up to the same temperature and then it doesn't work. So before you make yourself look any more stupid, at least learn how something works before you make a dumbass comment like you just did.

Marc, you are a Prince among mere men here. But sometimes you just out do even yourself. Outstanding post.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[gowlerk 1,924]

rushmc

So, at this point you show your desire to join the sick pukes who wish to politicize this active evil as fast as possible. Secondly, you also show that you have no idea how a suppressor works. To give you a bit of background, the suppressor cools the gases before the gasses exscape. That reduces the report. They do not work on fully automatic weapons for more than a pound or two because the chamber heats up to the same temperature and then it doesn't work. So before you make yourself look any more stupid, at least learn how something works before you make a dumbass comment like you just did.

Marc, you are a Prince among mere men here. But sometimes you just out do even yourself. Outstanding post.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[Phil1111 913]

rushmc

So, at this point you show your desire to join the sick pukes who wish to politicize this active evil as fast as possible. Secondly, you also show that you have no idea how a suppressor works. To give you a bit of background, the suppressor cools the gases before the gasses exscape. That reduces the report. They do not work on fully automatic weapons for more than a pound or two because the chamber heats up to the same temperature and then it doesn't work. So before you make yourself look any more stupid, at least learn how something works before you make a dumbass comment like you just did.

YOU have no idea on how a suppressor works. No I won't call you a dumbass and no I won't call you stupid.

A suppressor slows down the speed of the gasses driving the projectile down the barrel, to subsonic velocity's as the gasses flow around the baffling, in the suppressor. Its objective is to slow the gas to subsonic velocities to reduce the sound level. Temperature has nothing to do with the equation. Therefor if the bullet is subsonic and the gasses escaping the suppressor subsonic, the lowest possible sound is achieved.

If the bullet is supersonic and the escaping gasses subsonic. The net effect is to make the sound of the shot appear to come from a 90 degree angle from the real exit point of the projectile.

[billvon 2,434]

>They do not work on fully automatic weapons for more than a pound or two
>because the chamber heats up to the same temperature and then it doesn't work.

Great example of a version of Skitt's Law.

[rushmc 18]

Phil1111

***So, at this point you show your desire to join the sick pukes who wish to politicize this active evil as fast as possible. Secondly, you also show that you have no idea how a suppressor works. To give you a bit of background, the suppressor cools the gases before the gasses exscape. That reduces the report. They do not work on fully automatic weapons for more than a pound or two because the chamber heats up to the same temperature and then it doesn't work. So before you make yourself look any more stupid, at least learn how something works before you make a dumbass comment like you just did.

YOU have no idea on how a suppressor works. No I won't call you a dumbass and no I won't call you stupid.

A suppressor slows down the speed of the gasses driving the projectile down the barrel. Its objective is to slow the gas to subsonic velocities to reduce the sound level. Temperature has nothing to do with the equation. Therefor if the bullet is subsonic and the gasses escaping the suppressor subsonic, the lowest possible sound is achieved.

If the bullet is supersonic and the escaping gasses subsonic. The net effect is to make the sound of the shot appear to come from a 90 degree angle from the real exit point of the projectile.

The 5.56 or 308 rounds are not subsonic. The only way it works in a rifle like that is too cool the gases to a point where they are subsonic but not have any effect on the bullet. It would be very difficult to fire the four to five hundred yards that he was shooting with subsonic rounds and do the damage that he did. So you may know a little bit about it but you don't know much. And regardless of the argument. Once the silencer or suppressor heats up to the same temperatures the gas coming out it is no longer effective. Therefore using them on automatic rifles for more than just a round or two is useless

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 18]

billvon

>They do not work on fully automatic weapons for more than a pound or two
>because the chamber heats up to the same temperature and then it doesn't work.

Great example of a version of Skitt's Law.

First-hand experience that you obviously lack

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Phil1111 913]

rushmc

******So, at this point you show your desire to join the sick pukes who wish to politicize this active evil as fast as possible. Secondly, you also show that you have no idea how a suppressor works. To give you a bit of background, the suppressor cools the gases before the gasses exscape. That reduces the report. They do not work on fully automatic weapons for more than a pound or two because the chamber heats up to the same temperature and then it doesn't work. So before you make yourself look any more stupid, at least learn how something works before you make a dumbass comment like you just did.

YOU have no idea on how a suppressor works. No I won't call you a dumbass and no I won't call you stupid.

A suppressor slows down the speed of the gasses driving the projectile down the barrel. Its objective is to slow the gas to subsonic velocities to reduce the sound level. Temperature has nothing to do with the equation. Therefor if the bullet is subsonic and the gasses escaping the suppressor subsonic, the lowest possible sound is achieved.

If the bullet is supersonic and the escaping gasses subsonic. The net effect is to make the sound of the shot appear to come from a 90 degree angle from the real exit point of the projectile.

The 5.56 or 308 rounds are not subsonic. The only way it works in a rifle like that is too cool the gases to a point where they are subsonic but not have any effect on the bullet. It would be very difficult to fire the four to five hundred yards that he was shooting with subsonic rounds and do the damage that he did. So you may know a little bit about it but you don't know much. And regardless of the argument. Once the silencer or suppressor heats up to the same temperatures the gas coming out it is no longer effective. Therefore using them on automatic rifles for more than just a round or two is useless

Stop while you are ahead. I've personally shot over 10,000 rounds from automatic weapons. Including over 3,000 rounds from suppressed weapons. I bought my first Dillon 550 when I was 20 years old.

[normiss 622]

Calling me a dumb ass when you can purchase full auto silencers in interesting.
I hate it when the trolls get me to respond.

Ok, back to the Uzis and G36's.

[billvon 2,434]

>First-hand experience that you obviously lack

And you apparently lack any knowledge of physics, thermodynamics, or even what suppressors are used for.

First off, suppressors suppress both sound and muzzle flash. That's one reason snipers like them. In a crowded urban environment (like, say, Las Vegas) the sound of the shot echoes from everywhere; it's very hard to tell where a shot is coming from. People start hearing shots, they look around - but they don't see the muzzle flash, and absent that very visible indicator, it's hard to figure out where the shooter is. Especially if he's done a reasonably good job of hiding himself, which was not the case in Vegas.

To put it another way, if the Vegas shooter had been on the roof with a suppressor rather than behind a broken window, the death toll could have been hundreds instead of 60 or so.

Second, the primary reason the gases cool is not that the suppressor is cool and the gases get cooled by the metal. It is because the gases expand into the space provided by the suppressor, and expanding gases cool whether or not the surroundings are warm or not. (Google Ideal Gas Law for more info.) They cool and that reduces their pressure and thus velocity exiting the suppressor. Subsonic gases = quieter.

You really should stop digging at this point, but I know you won't. Will be fun to watch.

[rushmc 18]

normiss

Calling me a dumb ass when you can purchase full auto silencers in interesting.
I hate it when the trolls get me to respond.

Ok, back to the Uzis and G36's.

Oh for Christ's sakes. Now you want to talk subsonic rounds? Obviously that's not what was used here the 5.56 or 223's or 308 are not subsonic rounds when they're fired from 4 to 500 yards. You cannot effectively suppress an automatic high power rifle which was the comment you made. So it had nothing to do with what you're saying now with Uzi in that other gun.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 18]

Single shot sniper rifles are not what we're talking here. We're talking fully automatic weapons. Suppressors do not work on high powered fully automatic weapons. At least not the kind of suppressors most people can afford do

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 2,434]

>At least not the kind of suppressors most people can afford do

The backpedaling begins.

I give you ten posts before you are at "I never said that suppressors stop working when they are hot. You're twisting my words!"

Meanwhile some things that you can call fake news:

============
From SilencerCo:

The Hybrid™ is the silencer for any platform. Compatible with pistol calibers from 9mm to .45ACP, rifle calibers from 5.56mm to .45–70 GOV, and many in between like .458 SOCOM, the Hybrid is both full auto and magnum-rated and can be used on pistols, rifles, and submachine guns.
==========
From Franklin Gun Shop:

We carry Advanced Armament Corp. (AAC), Gemtech, Surefire, and Yankee Hill suppressors in stock. We can also special order others for you. We have all the paperwork necessary to start the process, which can be as little as a couple of months for a suppressor, or longer, if submitting for a fully-automatic weapon.
==========

[rushmc 18]

High power fully automatic weapons are incredibly hard to suppress. The suppressor heats up and the gas escapes at the same speed making the report nearly the same.

I'm not the one digging hole bill. You are

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Phil1111 913]

rushmc

Single shot sniper rifles are not what we're talking here. We're talking fully automatic weapons. Suppressors do not work on high powered fully automatic weapons. At least not the kind of suppressors most people can afford do

There is a place called you-tube. All kinds of rednecks doing dumb stuff with guns. Including full auto. I'm surprised you don't have a channel of your own!

You can skip to 7:26 for full auto suppressed from "M16".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NM8xvE5B4yk

The gas temperature for a .5 meter rifle barrel is shown in the graph below.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/316007119_Internal_and_Transitional_Ballistic_Solution_for_Spherical_and_Perforeted_Propellants_and_Verification_with_Experimental_Results
It indicates 2000 K at the muzzle which equates to 3140 Fahrenheit.

14) How does the heat generated from firing a gun affect the suppressor? 10/22/2012
The hot expanding gases that propel the projectile are trapped within the silencer and cause the temperature of the silencer to increase. The more intense your firing schedule, the hotter the silencer (and the barrel) will become. Higher pressure rounds also lead to higher temperatures within the silencer because of the amount of hot expanding gases that the silencer will trap.
http://www.advanced-armament.com/FAQs_ep_41-1.html#48

[RiggerLee 61]

We got an SOT a while back so we could make suppressors for a company building MP-5's It's a really nice SD can. One guy here in perticuler has a lot of class three toys including a lot of cans. I think he has more money then since. I don't think I could ever justify spending $35,000 on a gun which is what a transferable full auto MP-5 cost. You can get an incanel can or some exotic shit that will hold up under full auto just fine. The other day we were doing full mag dumps through it as fast as we could change them. We only did like four 30's but it was enough to get the can up to temp. We were testing a cover for it. The basilfill browned but held together but the kevlar thread died. Point is you can get a auto rated can if you want to drop the change. And there is nothing quiet about it. It is still good and loud.

As to cooling. Most of the work is done by letting the gas expand and slowing it down before it exits the can. But there is an element of heat transfer in which the gas is cooled by the can. That does reduce the volume of the gas. There have been designs that used packing to absorb that heat. They pack steel wool into areas of the suppressor. It absorbs the heat with all the surface area. You can also run a can wet where you smear something like, white lithium grease on surfaces or into this packing. It absorbs the heat when it vaporizes cooling the gas. Tends to make more smoke and stink but there are several things you can use that way. Only last for a couple of shots till it's gone and the can is hot. But these were ligament methods for building suppressors back in the day back before they started calling every thing a component and forbidding you to replace them. Wipes... don't get me started. You see that's why we need to deregulate this shit. So we can have cheep ass proper cans with packing and wipes instead of trying to turn one can into a life long investment. Support the SHARE act!

Lee

Lee
[email protected]
www.velocitysportswear.com

[billvon 2,434]

> The suppressor heats up and the gas escapes at the same speed making the
>report nearly the same.

Cool! They violate the Ideal Gas Law! Write that one up and your Nobel Prize is assured. No one will see it coming.

(I note you have now changed your tune from "they do not work on automatic weapons" to "report nearly the same." I figure that within 10 posts you will be saying "it's a little louder when the suppressor is hot" or "you can destroy a suppressor on a full-auto by firing it long enough." Good thing you got the "reverse gear" option on your PC.)

[RiggerLee 61]

I love hickok45.

Lee

Lee
[email protected]
www.velocitysportswear.com

[normiss 622]

That's awesome!
Maybe the next elementary school massacre with be shown live in real-time!

[RiggerLee 61]

A stainless or titanium can, yes you will destroy it.

Never the less this is what you get when you stop teaching children math in school. Even full auto that pulse is still way drawn out. You nolonger get the big shock wave from the gas expanding in a big normal shock wave. That's why it suppresses the flash. It slows the gas down preventing the muzzle blast from forming that big wave front and reigniting the unburnt combustion products when the temp spikes in the shock wave. That's why no flash. That's why a bear muzzel has such a big flash and why muzzle breaks that reflect the gas are even brighter.

Lee

Lee
[email protected]
www.velocitysportswear.com

[rushmc 18]

No reverse Bill. When the can is up to full temp its ability to suppress drops significantly. So you can dance around and do all the little funny shit you like to do and what cool your friends. But I do know what I'm talking about. Fully automatic rifles are hard to suppress. And they're sure as hell not quite enough that we can walk in the room shoot somebody walk out nobody knew it happen

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Phil1111 913]

A friend who is a gunsmith got a permit to build a suppressed sten gun from scratch. This was about 35 years ago.

It was very heavy for a 9mm and as such very easy to control. We would take it to the range and run a 000 rounds through it each.

Our fingers would get raw from reloading mags. At the end of the day our entire hands were black and we stunk of powder.